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Excited about our D yet?

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Bedard's breakdown of Collins leaves a lot to be desired t be honest.

Where Collins is going to need the most improvement is with pass rush moves — he has none. Collins is extremely stiff in the hips, which usually doesn’t translate well to rushing the passer. Right now he rushes by speed or strength. Contrast that to Ninkovich, who has tremendous flexibility and athletic ability.

I am excited about Dobson and Boyce. Warming up to Ryan. I think he's long speed, or lack thereof, will hurt him if he has to cover deep, but if he's used similar to the way they used Arrington, I think he could be good.
 
I like that we took the 3 players who have experience working together from Rutgers. It looks like the LB has the ability to drop into coverage well. The trio might give our starters a run for their play time, when the 3 of them are on the field together. I think something special may come from this.
 
I have no reason to prefer draftees Ebner and Harmon instead of over-the-hill vets like Gregory and A Wilson. I much prefer the veterans.

We'll see if Logan is better than Cole as a dime back. I certainly hope so. As for Dowling, I don't think that ANY player has started his career on IR for us under Belichick and been a contributor. Dowling has 2 years of IR.

Make no mistake, i do like what we've done. We just have to take a deep breath before expecting this defense to be even average against the pass.

 
I was already excited for the defense before the draft. People seem to forget that Hightower, Jones and Dennard were only in their first year. We may not even see their full potential for another 2 or 3 years, McCourty is only gonna get better at safety. He's just tapping his potential at this point. If Tommy Kelly can give us any kind of push up front and Armstead goes bananas like we hope the front 7 will be one of the most formidable imo.

Love the Collins pick especially his extra burst of strength and his experience at corner and safety. Hoping he can contribute sooner rather than later because he seems like a upgrade over Dane. At least on paper. Add in that he can rush the passer and that sticks out really well. My imagination runs wild with the possibilities. If he was the best player on his defense on an 0-12 team could working with alongside talented players boost him into impact player potential? Still think if Dane can stay healthy he is going to contribute a lot to the team.

Logan Ryan had a first round grade on some charts. Anytime you can add a corner of his potential you do it. Seems like nickel and dime at this point but you never know. Arrington needs competition and it seems he will get it everyday from this kid.

What can I say? The Harmon pick is baffling to me. I don't need a lecture on the finer points of BB's drafting skill. Didn't like the pick and now can only hope Belichick proves all wrong again. There's nothing anyone can say to convince me that they could of not gotten this guy as an unrestricted free agent. Hopefully he becomes a lights out special teamer and a valuable member to the secondary. Wait and see on him. Could surprise us in a big way. Enough whining on that pick.

Michael Buchanan was a super value in the 7th round. Don't know why he fell but I can see huge rewards as a situational player. Excellent pick.

As the Pats get better so do other teams. I'm not going to worry about some of the powerhouse NFC teams until we get to that point. If the coaches can get this talent to fall in line as well some of these WR's just click, I think our chances to get back to the Championship are good. I also think Miami and Buffalo improved their teams quite a bit over the draft. Still think they are a couple of years away to really challenge for the AFC East though.
 
My D excitement is based on several factors.
1) Prior to the Talib trade, QBs identified the weakest CB and just carpet bombed him with passes. After Talib arrived and Dennard worked his way into the lineup, no longer did QBs believe the Pats were inferior at the position, and at times, I sensed QBs avoided passing at Talib. My point, offensive game plans became more about execution than dominating weakness. In other words, teams recognized the CB grouping was shored up.
2) The mobile/elusive QB was NE's achilles heel last year. Both Seattle and SF exploited NE's lack of pass rush and extended plays that allowed WRs time to move down field. I'm more optimistic now because a) the NFC South replaces the the NFC West on NE's schedule eliminating dual threat QBs that are on stacked rosters. Sure Cam Newton is capable, but his team lacks as a whole...and b) Talib didn't play vs Seattle and was effective vs SF until injury. Once he went down, SF inflicted their offensive will.
3) NE recognized coverage LB was an issue and addressed this first in the draft. Drafted Collins and resigned Fletcher. Who knows if this personnel will be effective covering RBs and TEs, but at least NE has options that weren't available last year. Watching releasing RBs roam free is particularly frustrating. Lets not forget Adrian Wilson if he gets deployed as an undersized LB to shadow non WRs. To be detirmined.
4) With Canadian D linemen and a Raider brought in to offer some interior pressure, this has to be encouraging....right??
5) last but not least....roster maturation. McCourty as a permanent S fixture, Talib with a NE training camp. Denard with a clear mind and a brighter future (eventually). Our 2012 #1s ready to make a leap forward. My one hope is that they identify what Hightower's best strengths are and deploy him in the appropriate role. I'm hoping 2012 was a "lets see what he's got" and now NE has a better idea how this big man can shine. I have my opinions....but what do I know.

I still don't see this D as a dominate entity, but I do believe weaknesses have been shored up and this grouping will gel as a unit and play better team defense. The biggest question mark now is the second safety position....who will take the job and how does this position get factored into defensive game plans. IF BB believes this position has been shored up, then we could see a more aggressive D.
 
I wish I could get more enthused about the Collins pick. Trying.

The Collins pick looks much better now that the draft is over. The Harmon pick is still a head scratcher and a reach, though.
 
The main reason to be excited is we are returning our defense intact so it can pick up where it left off. The rookies aren't rookies anymore. We don't need to trade for Talib midseason. We don't need to move McCourty midseason. Barring injuries in preseason we can start the same defense that we started in the playoffs. But we've added :

Kelly and Armstead at DT.
Likely Abraham at DE.
Collins at DE/LB
Wilson at Safety (he will also help the young safety group a ton)
Ryan at CB for depth.

None of the above need to start although Kelly likely will.
 
I can't think of a LB prospect with the potential to be an elite coverage player, run stopper and pass rusher in the last 10 years. Jamie Collins is going to have everyone scratching their heads in two to three years wondering how we drafted him in the 2nd round. He might be our new Willie McGinest.
 
Or maybe Jamie Collins will be an even better version of Vrabel. I don't really know who to compare him to because his skill set is so wide. I've mentioned Akeem Ayers and Sean Witherspoon but I hate to compare him to them because they are both so young but they are the best example of modern day LBs that can do it all.
 
I can't think of a LB prospect with the potential to be an elite coverage player, run stopper and pass rusher in the last 10 years. Jamie Collins is going to have everyone scratching their heads in two to three years wondering how we drafted him in the 2nd round. He might be our new Willie McGinest.

Run stopper? Maybe his body transforms, but I don't see the strength to take on/shed tackles. I see a gap shooter with big play potential though. The problem is BB's D gets so conservative fearing big plays that an attack weapon will rarely get the opportunity. Lets get a little mahem going
 
I can't think of a LB prospect with the potential to be an elite coverage player, run stopper and pass rusher in the last 10 years. Jamie Collins is going to have everyone scratching their heads in two to three years wondering how we drafted him in the 2nd round. He might be our new Willie McGinest.

That would be awesome. I think a lot of us are fearing Crable and hoping for Willie McG. I'll definitely be rooting for closer to the latter.
 
No, I am not sold on Collins.

Ok. So what. I'm not sold on anyone till they prove it on the field and training camp. All of our prospects are just that until they prove otherwise. For now I'll trust in the Pats coaching staff and scouting crew.

But he has to show something on the field first. And plus I think he will need a year at least before he can contribute in the base defense.

And in the final equation that's what counts. What can you do for me on the field? There's a lot of in between stuff that needs to occur - like learning the playbook, buying into the team philosophy, adjusting to pro speed, learning responsibilities, and finally putting it all together.

What Collins does have is physicality and jump through the roof athleticism. I mean, dude have you seen his combine workouts? Unbelievable.

Jamie Collins Nearly Over-Leaped Markings With 11-Foot-7 Broad Jump at NFL Combine (Video) | Daily Blend | NESN.com

Add to that good length and size. Add to that apparent ability/agility to cover in the passing game. And top it off with productivity on the field that grew each year he played in the collegiate game. This is an athletically gifted football player with nearly unlimited upside. But he has to put it all together and perform.
 
Hell yeah i'm excited. Talib is getting a whole off season to infuse much swagger needed into the secondary. To be fair, Dennard already has this swagger. The others need to play angry (you are in my pocket biatch angry) and not play like they're waiting for the other side to make a mistake.
 
Run stopper? Maybe his body transforms, but I don't see the strength to take on/shed tackles. I see a gap shooter with big play potential though. The problem is BB's D gets so conservative fearing big plays that an attack weapon will rarely get the opportunity. Lets get a little mahem going

He has a lot of room to add some muscle. I could see him adding 10-15 pounds between now and his 2nd year.
 
Or maybe Jamie Collins will be an even better version of Vrabel. I don't really know who to compare him to because his skill set is so wide. I've mentioned Akeem Ayers and Sean Witherspoon but I hate to compare him to them because they are both so young but they are the best example of modern day LBs that can do it all.


No, I'd compare Rob Ninkovitch to Mike Vrabel. Smart. Not great but not a problem as a pass rusher. Can set the edge at SOLB. Fair Coverage ability at OLB.

That is a summary of Mike Vrabel. Plus they are both Boiler makers.
 
I'm very excited. Depth has improved, which was needed, as has the special teams unit along with that, more versatility and speed has been infused in the middle of the defense. The defense has had a lot of draft capital spent on it, now's the time to shows improvements on the field.

Beyond that though, one thing that hasn't been discussed a lot yet, after more tape study on Collins, is how good he is against the read-option. He seemingly takes it down that with ease in comparison to Patriots' other LBs. His speed and physicality, could make him the "hunter" in the LB corps that the Patriots have lacked for years.

I thought Hightower could man that spot from his Alabama tape, but he just doesn't seem to have enough speed or athleticism to chase down fast QBs or RBs on the perimeter that have broken contain or coverage skills to cover up the seams and in the flats. Collins has a lot of Hightower's versatility, but on the other end of the spectrum.

Collins likely won't be an immediate Von Miller-type presence as a pass rusher nor a great edge-setter at this point in his young career. He needs a lot more work in those areas than anything else in that regard, but I think he could be tasked with "roaming" the line of scrimmage and "sniffing out" plays while doing a lot of "flowing" to the football. He's a space player which Coach always talks about. He should be do fine in that role initially while he works on everything else.
 
No, I'd compare Rob Ninkovitch to Mike Vrabel. Smart. Not great but not a problem as a pass rusher. Can set the edge at SOLB. Fair Coverage ability at OLB.

That is a summary of Mike Vrabel. Plus they are both Boiler makers.

You're right. I can't find anyone in our team history to compare him to. Akeem Ayers and Sean Weatherspoon are current NFL players I'd compare him to.
 
I'm very excited. Depth has improved, which was needed, as has the special teams unit along with that, more versatility and speed has been infused in the middle of the defense. The defense has had a lot of draft capital spent on it, now's the time to shows improvements on the field.

Beyond that though, one thing that hasn't been discussed a lot yet, after more tape study on Collins, is how good he is against the read-option. He seemingly takes it down that with ease in comparison to Patriots' other LBs. His speed and physicality, could make him the "hunter" in the LB corps that the Patriots have lacked for years.

I thought Hightower could man that spot from his Alabama tape, but he just doesn't seem to have enough speed or athleticism to chase down fast QBs or RBs on the perimeter that have broken contain or coverage skills to cover up the seams and in the flats. Collins has a lot of Hightower's versatility, but on the other end of the spectrum.

Collins likely won't be an immediate Von Miller-type presence as a pass rusher nor a great edge-setter at this point in his young career. He needs a lot more work in those areas than anything else in that regard, but I think he could be tasked with "roaming" the line of scrimmage and "sniffing out" plays while doing a lot of "flowing" to the football. He's a space player which Coach always talks about. He should be do fine in that role initially while he works on everything else.

You make a good point. Look at the young QBs we will have or might have to face. Geni smith, tannehill, cam newton. And if Super Bowl, kaepernick, Wilson, Rodgers. All of them are very mobile. Collins could well fill the spy role and still fulfill edge duties.
 
Defense will finally be a strength this year.
 
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