Theory:Brady too reliant on Welker?

[DaBruinz]

Let me preface this with a few things. I loved having Wes here. He is still one of the best in and out of his breaks and, despite his drops, he's still got some of the best hands around. Not to mention that he's tough as hell. A true gamer. A true Patriot. I was one of the first to talk about the Pats getting him from Miami back in 2006 before he became an RFA.

I rate Brady as, arguably, the greatest modern day QB. Since he took over back in 2001, he's had a confidence about him that gave you faith in the entire team. I don't expect Brady to be perfect. But I do expect a certain level of consistency from him.

OK..

I saw something in the AFCCG that I didn't like. And that was Brady trying to force the ball to Welker who was tightly covered while other guys (Vereen esp.) were open. This has been a growing concern since 2007. People mentioned that Brady relied too much on Moss and that he was trying to force the ball to Moss when Moss was covered. Back then, it didn't seem like Brady was forcing the ball to Welker because Welker was always open.

In all honesty, Brady has gotten away from what made him so successful in 2003 and 2004. In fact, it became cliche' to say "Who is Brady's favorite receiver? The open one." Brady would regularly have 6-8 different receivers with receptions. In the past few years, we'd be lucky if it was more than Welker, Hernandez, and Gronk.

I would have said that it was a function of the offense, but the AFCCG convinced me otherwise. Especially when Vereen was open on several different plays in a row out of the backfield and Brady threw to him twice with only one of the catchable. The other was thrown behind Vereen making it nearly impossible for him to catch.

 

[Mack Herron]

Brady's philosophy didn't change; his receivers did.

 

[DaBruinz]

Brady's philosophy didn't change; his receivers did.

That's a fail. It doesn't explain why Brady didn't dump off to Vereen on the several occasions that Vereen was wide open with no one within 10 yards of him instead of trying to force the ball to Welker or Hernandez.

You can't sit there and tell me that Brady had 100% confidence in all 8 guys he would throw passes to in 2003/2004 and that he only had confidence in 4-5 guys in 2012..

 

[SONS_OF_BELICHICK]

is was time to get rid of Tom's binky.....and get to work.....

 

[Archeryaddict12]

is was time to get rid of Tom's binky.....and get to work.....

Exactly, this will be better for the future to not have welker.

 

[lurker1965]

...

While I kinda, sorta, almost, like agree - don't expect me to admit it yet. I'm still in shock that Wes is with Peyton.

 

[fnordcircle]

I've said this to others a bunch and while it doesn't take the sting away it does give me some hope.

But ask yourself -

Does the Brady of 2011 or 2007 throw the ball to JR Redmond? Or does he try to force the ball into Troy Brown 17 yards down the field?

If they take the savings spent on Wes Welker and build a defense that we can be proud of again then I can be satisfied.

If they also have helped force Tom into being the QB who distributed the ball to a ridiculous number of players a game then I'll be weirdly ecstatic. Because I think that is what this team misses - Tom Brady sans the receiver tunnel vision.

 

[Bobs My Uncle]

If so then someone should have sat down with Brady and remedied his reliance problem.

 

[Observer]

Are the Patriots too reliant on Brady? Quick, let's get rid of him too. :bricks:

 

[Mack Herron]

That's a fail. It doesn't explain why Brady didn't dump off to Vereen on the several occasions that Vereen was wide open with no one within 10 yards of him instead of trying to force the ball to Welker or Hernandez.

You can't sit there and tell me that Brady had 100% confidence in all 8 guys he would throw passes to in 2003/2004 and that he only had confidence in 4-5 guys in 2012..

Amazing rationalization going on here. First, you know that one example is meaningless. He failed to throw to open receivers in 03/04 too. The success rate throwing to Welker warranted the looks he got. Welker took 12 million over 10 million to leave his team and close friend as QB and move across the country. There will surely be no Patriots WR in 2013 who can get open or move the chains as as effectively as Welker did. I don't think Bill is very good with his people skills.

 

[patfanken]

DB, I couldn't agree more. The fact that Pats didn't match what I consider a very reasonable deal tell me that the powers that be felt that the offense needed to be more balanced. Injuries to Hernandez, Gronk, and Edelman force the team to fall back into a Welker-centric mode again,

The other thing I have to wonder is whether they spotted a subtle deterioration of his skills, despite the overall production. Something that they could see watching him everyday, that we wouldn't be able to. As I have noted before. When smaller WR hit the wall, they hit it fast. Just look at Troy Brown. BTW- it doesn't mean there actually was any deterioration. I;m just speculating.

 

[DaBruinz]

Amazing rationalization going on here. First, you know that one example is meaningless. He failed to throw to open receivers in 03/04 too. The success rate throwing to Welker warranted the looks he got. Welker took 12 million over 10 million to leave his team and close friend as QB and move across the country. There will surely be no Patriots WR in 2013 who can get open or move the chains as as effectively as Welker did. I don't think Bill is very good with his people skills.

Mack - not sure where you've been hiding out, but I'm not the first person to mention about Brady forcing the ball to either Moss or Welker.

So, for you to say that it's just one example is just stupid since I clearly stated it's been happening since 2007....

There are literally hundreds of football players who'd disagree with your assessment regarding Bill's people skills. Starting with Jim Brown.

How do you know there will be no Patriots WR who can get as open or move the chains as well? Unless you can see the future, this is a SWAG on your part in some vain attempt to look smart.

You just don't know what will happen. Also, there is a good possibility that, if Gronk is healthy, he'll have as many 1st downs as Welker did. Gronk DID have 69 1st downs on 90 receptions in 2011, afterall.

 

[SONS_OF_BELICHICK]

I think the pats ..looked it at as...time to get younger....I think TB will put him into situations where he wont take beating...

 

[RIpats88]

Patriots offense has been too finesse which is why when teams get physical with them in the playoffs their offense goes to pieces

now, is Amendola more physical? im not sure...but he is somewhat of a better deep threat than welker

 

[Nunchucks]

I completely agree. I've seen brady forcing balls to welker way too often. Definitely hurt the offense against top defenses on3rd down.

 

[DaBruinz]

Patriots offense has been too finesse which is why when teams get physical with them in the playoffs their offense goes to pieces

now, is Amendola more physical? im not sure...but he is somewhat of a better deep threat than welker

Amendola isn't more physical than Welker.

 

[PP2]

DB, I couldn't agree more. The fact that Pats didn't match what I consider a very reasonable deal tell me that the powers that be felt that the offense needed to be more balanced. Injuries to Hernandez, Gronk, and Edelman force the team to fall back into a Welker-centric mode again,

The other thing I have to wonder is whether they spotted a subtle deterioration of his skills, despite the overall production. Something that they could see watching him everyday, that we wouldn't be able to. As I have noted before. When smaller WR hit the wall, they hit it fast. Just look at Troy Brown. BTW- it doesn't mean there actually was any deterioration. I;m just speculating.

The gap in the difference in the two offers is too narrow to lend credence to this theory (and it is a good one, by the way). The gap is so narrow that the only plausible answer is one of personal differences. I can only believe that Welker felt slighted.

Also if they were eager to avoid going Welker-centric, why go after a Welker-clone?

 

[Dagg]

I agree somewhat he looks to Wes in critical situations. Go back and watch 2001 we threw a lot more to the rb's I would like to see us return to that model. Still doesn't solve need for outside speed but I am hopeful. Wonder if we could get DHB on the cheap then focus on secondary. Wes wasn't Wes before he got in our offense I expect very little drop off with amendola.

 

[DaBruinz]

I agree somewhat he looks to Wes in critical situations. Go back and watch 2001 we threw a lot more to the rb's I would like to see us return to that model. Still doesn't solve need for outside speed but I am hopeful. Wonder if we could get DHB on the cheap then focus on secondary. Wes wasn't Wes before he got in our offense I expect very little drop off with amendola.

Sorry, Dagg, but Welker WAS Welker prior to getting into the Pats offense. Especially when you consider the horrible QBs he had throwing to him in Miami. I mean, let's be real. Duante Culpepper, Joey Harrington and Cleo Lemon?

 

[satz]

This will let brady to work more to hit slater on those out patterns.

NEXT Big Issue, Brady is too reliant on GRONK in the redzone, the number prove the fact.

We need to address this issue next .