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Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years Old?

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Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

I don't know. I just see a less nimble/quick guy. Maybe it's the brace. Maybe it's age.

Maybe I need new glasses.

yeah, it's your eyes that have slowed down a bit
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

I like Mallett too but really? Why? Because hes TB's backup and hes tall and has a strong arm?

We've seen this movie before..

Mallett is beginning his 2nd year with Belichick, Brady and Hoyer - pretty good internship, and there's no new competition meaning the Patriots feel pretty good about what they have at that position.

Mallett was a steal when they drafted him and the big knock was maturity. There's not much better than a couple of years around the Patriots for a young player to learn what it takes to be a professional football player.

Check this story out and the comparison with 2011 draft classmate Cam Newton who has turned out pretty well:

Ryan Mallett one of most talented quarterbacks in 2011 NFL Draft - Michael Rosenberg - SI.com

How great would it be for Tom Brady to include training a capable understudy as part of his legacy? He is the sort of person who would care about that.
 
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Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

You seem to have a real need to perceive Brady as a guy too smart to hang around much longer because football can be dangerous... He's been hanging around it long enough to know that, and yet he remains - even (anxiously) returns from his world travels as the hubby of an A list mega model...during which he never fails to maintain a world class conditioning program. You don't have to be psychic to decipher his feelings on the matter because he has addressed them frankly, repeatedly in multiple formats. What you seem to have to believe is he would never be honest and it's more likely he shares your particular POV...

Once again, Mo, you argue without an opponent.

I said I could see him playing until he's 40. It was my opening comment. I also said that I could see him hanging it up earlier. You always seem to jump to the latter statement as what I truly believe when I actually and honestly believe the former equally.

"Playing until 40 or older" and "Hanging them up earlier" are two contradictory ideas that I have absolutely no trouble keeping in my mind at the same time.

I take Brady at his word when, as he did in interviews just yesterday, he says he "wants" to play a lot longer and that he "sure hopes" he's playing in his 40's, which is why I say I could see him playing at 40.

I also think that, like a lot of public figures, he might not be showing all his cards. That's not a question of whether he's "honest," just of what he might prudently say to the media. If he were thinking of retiring in a couple of years, why in the world would he give the slightest hint about that to an opponent in such a way that could give them an advantage?

What's wrong with that? How hard is it to understand that I could intellectually believe that there might be truth in both of those statements?

It is you who seem to have the need, because I am not 100% in lock step with the "Brady will play until 42" POV, to project onto me the belief that I think he's somehow being nefariously deceptive and am, therefore, certain that he's going to retire much earlier. Nothing could be further from the truth.

The issue of his long term health is a separate matter that I believe all available evidence suggests he keeps to himself and a few close friends.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

40- I'll believe it when I see it...but the parallel I'd draw it to is Montana. Montana's final year, 1994, at 38 years old, he threw for 3283 yards, only 661 yards off his career high in 1990. He also only had 9 picks in 493 attempts. Now, his TD production in KC was substantially lower than in San Fran (13 and 16 TDs), but I would chalk that up to supporting cast.

League ranking wise, Montana was 10th in yardage in 1994. The leader...Bledsoe, at 4555 yards.

If I look at the % of drop in the yardage...Joe's final season represented 83% production of 1990. I think we'd all take 83% of TB12. In short, at 38, Montana was fairly productive.

Does this really mean anything? Nah. My main thought process is that no one has been "elite" at 40. If anyone can do it, Brady can, I am just pessimistic that he will. It will be fun to see if he does. I'll be rooting for him.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

Mallett is beginning his 2nd year with Belichick, Brady and Hoyer - pretty good internship, and there's no new competition meaning the Patriots feel pretty good about what they have at that position.

Mallett was a steal when they drafted him and the big knock was maturity. There's not much better than a couple of years around the Patriots for a young player to learn what it takes to be a professional football player.

Check this story out and the comparison with 2011 draft classmate Cam Newton who has turned out pretty well:

Ryan Mallett one of most talented quarterbacks in 2011 NFL Draft - Michael Rosenberg - SI.com

How great would it be for Tom Brady to include training a capable understudy as part of his legacy? He is the sort of person who would care about that.

Your comeback is a lone mediots musings based on he met him once in 2007 and he's tall and he has a strong arm...and the only problem there could possibly be is immaturity? Teams don't pass through 3 rounds on elite QB talent solely on that basis...because of the dearth of talent remotely available at the position.

He claimed everyone would drool once he got to camp. We're still waiting. He can absolutely make some jaw dropping throws. But it's what follows them that remains problematic. Indecision, slow release, ground balls, air balls... What he can do has never been debated. No correct that, many scouts differed in assessing his skillset beyond arm strength, which is undebated. What else he can or can't do remains debatable. And arm strength is over rated as a skillset at the next level. Mental acuity (processing speed) and accuracy and pocket presence and disciplined consistency (mentally and mechanically) under pressure and a whole slew of other combined tangible and intangible skills trump it.

Running this offense isn't about showcasing your particular talent while flying by the seat of your pants and taking the bad with the good. That's why Pioli traded for Cassel and Josh ran from Cutler. He should get a lot of opportunity to show what he can do within the next several days because Brady won't be taking a lot of reps in game situations given the fluidness of the OL. Hoyer may not be placed at risk as much, either, because he is it at the backup position.

The thing to keep in mind as you observe Mallett will be can he run the offense efficiently, because the reps will not be all about showcasing his arm. They will be about assessing the competing talent around him as it relates to roster decisions. That is why Bill struggles to generate buzz for his developmental signal callers. That is what Cassel's critics who much preferred O'Connell or Gutierrez who seemingly found a way to make a play as well as making some unfortunate, repetitive mistakes failed to grasp. The pre season isn't about winning games here, it's about gauging a multitude of players ability to consistently function within this offense at a level that can help the team win games that matter. A few bombs to guys who won't be on the 53 (who are competing against guys who won't be on the opponent's 53 either) doesn't do that. Being poised and disciplined and executing the plays called or making good decisions and living to fight another day does.

The fact that there isn't someone behind him isn't an endorsement. If they thought he could pass Hoyer on the depth chart they would have been more likely to bring in someone else and save themselves $1.9M against the cap... There will be someone behind him and theoretically no one ahead of him in 2013 but unless he can hold that guy behind him off he probably won't be here when 2014 dawns. And if Belichick believes the kid has done everything they asked of him and simply isn't a fit - but might fit another scheme - don't be surprised if in the absence of any offer he doesn't just let him go to see if he can find his niche, if he has one, elsewhere. He set O'Connell free after just one season as a default #2, and chose to roll with a rookie UDFA, and he had invested a third in Kevin, too.

There is a first time for everything and Mallett may yet prove to be the exception to the rule that Petrino's college QB's just don't translate at the next level. Just haven't seen any clear cut signs of that - or any drooling - yet.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

40- I'll believe it when I see it...but the parallel I'd draw it to is Montana. Montana's final year, 1994, at 38 years old, he threw for 3283 yards, only 661 yards off his career high in 1990. He also only had 9 picks in 493 attempts. Now, his TD production in KC was substantially lower than in San Fran (13 and 16 TDs), but I would chalk that up to supporting cast.

League ranking wise, Montana was 10th in yardage in 1994. The leader...Bledsoe, at 4555 yards.

If I look at the % of drop in the yardage...Joe's final season represented 83% production of 1990. I think we'd all take 83% of TB12. In short, at 38, Montana was fairly productive.

Does this really mean anything? Nah. My main thought process is that no one has been "elite" at 40. If anyone can do it, Brady can, I am just pessimistic that he will. It will be fun to see if he does. I'll be rooting for him.

If Brady only manages to play in one game in the next two years, as Joe did at 35-36 on top of suffering a near career ending back injury he'd rebounded from in his early 30's, then I will consider that analogy. Even though times have changed and conditioning as well as sports medicine has improved, Brady isn't going to fight the inevitable if push comes to shove for a lot of reasons that applied in Joe's case.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

40- I'll believe it when I see it...but the parallel I'd draw it to is Montana. Montana's final year, 1994, at 38 years old, he threw for 3283 yards, only 661 yards off his career high in 1990. He also only had 9 picks in 493 attempts. Now, his TD production in KC was substantially lower than in San Fran (13 and 16 TDs), but I would chalk that up to supporting cast.

League ranking wise, Montana was 10th in yardage in 1994. The leader...Bledsoe, at 4555 yards.

If I look at the % of drop in the yardage...Joe's final season represented 83% production of 1990. I think we'd all take 83% of TB12. In short, at 38, Montana was fairly productive.

Does this really mean anything? Nah. My main thought process is that no one has been "elite" at 40. If anyone can do it, Brady can, I am just pessimistic that he will. It will be fun to see if he does. I'll be rooting for him.

Brett Favre was in the MVP discussion at the age of 40, with 33 TDs and 7 INTs, and a 107.2 QB rating.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

Brett Favre was in the MVP discussion at the age of 40, with 33 TDs and 7 INTs, and a 107.2 QB rating.

thanks. Missed it.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

thanks. Missed it.

No problem... Favre's pretty much the exception that proves the rule.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

Running this offense isn't about showcasing your particular talent while flying by the seat of your pants and taking the bad with the good. That's why Pioli traded for Cassel and Josh ran from Cutler. He should get a lot of opportunity to show what he can do within the next several days because Brady won't be taking a lot of reps in game situations given the fluidness of the OL. Hoyer may not be placed at risk as much, either, because he is it at the backup position.

To be fair, Cutler was looking for an excuse to get traded the moment they fired Shanahan.
 
Re: Why Can't Patriots Quarterback Tom Brady Be An Elite Quarterback At Forty Years O

Your comeback is a lone mediots musings based on he met him once in 2007 and he's tall and he has a strong arm...and the only problem there could possibly be is immaturity? Teams don't pass through 3 rounds on elite QB talent solely on that basis...because of the dearth of talent remotely available at the position.

He claimed everyone would drool once he got to camp. We're still waiting. He can absolutely make some jaw dropping throws. But it's what follows them that remains problematic. Indecision, slow release, ground balls, air balls... What he can do has never been debated. No correct that, many scouts differed in assessing his skillset beyond arm strength, which is undebated. What else he can or can't do remains debatable. And arm strength is over rated as a skillset at the next level. Mental acuity (processing speed) and accuracy and pocket presence and disciplined consistency (mentally and mechanically) under pressure and a whole slew of other combined tangible and intangible skills trump it.

Running this offense isn't about showcasing your particular talent while flying by the seat of your pants and taking the bad with the good. That's why Pioli traded for Cassel and Josh ran from Cutler. He should get a lot of opportunity to show what he can do within the next several days because Brady won't be taking a lot of reps in game situations given the fluidness of the OL. Hoyer may not be placed at risk as much, either, because he is it at the backup position.

The thing to keep in mind as you observe Mallett will be can he run the offense efficiently, because the reps will not be all about showcasing his arm. They will be about assessing the competing talent around him as it relates to roster decisions. That is why Bill struggles to generate buzz for his developmental signal callers. That is what Cassel's critics who much preferred O'Connell or Gutierrez who seemingly found a way to make a play as well as making some unfortunate, repetitive mistakes failed to grasp. The pre season isn't about winning games here, it's about gauging a multitude of players ability to consistently function within this offense at a level that can help the team win games that matter. A few bombs to guys who won't be on the 53 (who are competing against guys who won't be on the opponent's 53 either) doesn't do that. Being poised and disciplined and executing the plays called or making good decisions and living to fight another day does.

The fact that there isn't someone behind him isn't an endorsement. If they thought he could pass Hoyer on the depth chart they would have been more likely to bring in someone else and save themselves $1.9M against the cap... There will be someone behind him and theoretically no one ahead of him in 2013 but unless he can hold that guy behind him off he probably won't be here when 2014 dawns. And if Belichick believes the kid has done everything they asked of him and simply isn't a fit - but might fit another scheme - don't be surprised if in the absence of any offer he doesn't just let him go to see if he can find his niche, if he has one, elsewhere. He set O'Connell free after just one season as a default #2, and chose to roll with a rookie UDFA, and he had invested a third in Kevin, too.

There is a first time for everything and Mallett may yet prove to be the exception to the rule that Petrino's college QB's just don't translate at the next level. Just haven't seen any clear cut signs of that - or any drooling - yet.

I do not disagree with you that we just don't know yet with Mallett. I do know he was a top-five talent with the maturity questions, and that he's a coach's son and that he's got the goods physically.

I also know that the Pats did not bring in any veteran QBs to push Hoyer and Mallett for the backup job. That tells me it is an endorsement and that if they need to go to plan B, Josh and Belichick feel pretty good about the current depth at that position.

McDaniels directed the 2008 11-5 offense led by Matt Cassell. Belichick and McDaniels know what they need at QB to make their offense succeed.

Your post hits the nail on the head with the sentence: "Being poised and disciplined and executing the plays called or making good decisions and living to fight another day does (make for a starting NFL QB.)"

Mallett and Hoyer provide the skills, smarts and poise to run this Ferrari of an offense or we'd be looking at some other guys in red jerseys.

I'm looking forward to this pre-season for a lot of reasons - first, to see what the defensive line will look like, but also to see Mallett run the offense with a full off-season and camp under his belt. I expect we'll all be drooling.
 
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