Pat Kirwan's first mock

[jeffbiologist]

NFL.com news: Defense rules early in a look at the first two rounds

If the draft fell like this I think most of us would be hoping we choose Quinn instead of Costanzo and trade 33. Can anyone elaborate on the brain tumor mentioned??

 

[patchick]

If the draft fell like this I think most of us would be hoping we choose Quinn instead of Costanzo

This makes me wonder about the board consensus...hands up everybody, if you had a choice between Robert Quinn and Aldon Smith, who would you pick?

 

[Urgent]

Definitely Quinn over Aldon Smith.
I would go Quinn/Kerrigan, and Justin Houston is a toss-up vs. Smith - much more productive. Houston had double the sacks, is notably faster & stronger, and played 3-4 OLB. Smith is 1.5" taller.

 

[sbpatfan]

They both seem like your typical boom or bust.. so I guess with that in consideration I'd go with the bigger boom: Quinn.

 

[jeffbiologist]

This makes me wonder about the board consensus...hands up everybody, if you had a choice between Robert Quinn and Aldon Smith, who would you pick?

My order would have to be Quinn, Smith, Kerrigan. Whats this about Quinn's brain tumor though? Am I missing something?

 

[dryheat44]

My order would have to be Quinn, Smith, Kerrigan. Whats this about Quinn's brain tumor though? Am I missing something?

Ummm.....he has a brain tumor. You pretty much nailed your own question.

 

[patchick]

Personally, I'd take Smith over Quinn. They're both super raw and super risky, but IMO Smith shows better instincts and awareness, which makes him project better to OLB. I was also turned off by the fact that Quinn seemed to approach the Combine with a "DE or bust" mentality.

 

[dryheat44]

Personally, I'd take Smith over Quinn. They're both super raw and super risky, but IMO Smith shows better instincts and awareness, which makes him project better to OLB. I was also turned off by the fact that Quinn seemed to approach the Combine with a "DE or bust" mentality.

I don't see Quinn as raw, but that's not a point in his favor. I think of Smith as a lump of clay to mold. I see Quinn as a student who has to unlearn some bad habits and get an attitude transplant. I'll be honest -- Quinn's not on my draft board. Between getting kicked off UNC for knowlingly violating rules, not bothering to train for the combine, not playing football for a year, being a positional projection, and having a potentially serious medical issue, there's not a lot for me to like -- 2009 highlight film be damned. I can't think of a red flag that he doen't hit.

 

[TheBaronPatriot]

I don't see Quinn as raw, but that's not a point in his favor. I think of Smith as a lump of clay to mold. I see Quinn as a student who has to unlearn some bad habits and get an attitude transplant. I'll be honest -- Quinn's not on my draft board. Between getting kicked off UNC for knowlingly violating rules, not bothering to train for the combine, not playing football for a year, being a positional projection, and having a potentially serious medical issue, there's not a lot for me to like -- 2009 highlight film be damned. I can't think of a red flag that he doen't hit.

Can you shed some light on his lack of training for the combine?
There were indications he was out of shape?

 

[Metaphors]

Personally, I'd take Smith over Quinn. They're both super raw and super risky, but IMO Smith shows better instincts and awareness, which makes him project better to OLB. I was also turned off by the fact that Quinn seemed to approach the Combine with a "DE or bust" mentality.

I really like Smith but the main question for me is about the role you are looking for. If you are looking for a beast pass rusher, someone who can hold up (not dominate) on the edge and drop into shallow zones (screens and quick slants), then Quinn is your guy. I'll agree with your assessment of Smith but he doesn't have the rush moves, explosion and violent hands that Quinn has.

As for the brain tumor, it was a benign growth that caused him to have headaches/blackouts in high school. It was surgically reduced in size to relieve the pressure and is monitored twice a year. I don't recall it ever being mentioned as an issue at UNC. So while it needs to be checked out, I don't know of anyone who thinks it is a concern as a pro.

 

[patchick]

Can you shed some light on his lack of training for the combine?
There were indications he was out of shape?

IMO it was very apparent watching the drills. Watch 25 d-linemen in a row do the same half dozen drills, you can tell who's been seriously preparing for this job interview. Quinn didn't show that preparation -- which matters particularly for a guy who had the whole season to do nothing else.

From a Patriots perspective, he looked significantly more prepared/comfortable with classic DL drills moving forward, and totally out of place with LB-style drills that had him moving in space. To me, that read like a big flashing "I don't want to be an OLB and so didn't even bother training for it" sign.

 

[bucky]

This makes me wonder about the board consensus...hands up everybody, if you had a choice between Robert Quinn and Aldon Smith, who would you pick?

Aldon Smith.

 

[IllegalContact]

he's got the first round right.......

however, martez wilson instead of akeem ayers at 33 (wilson is faster and will be a better OLB), and brooks reed instead of carter at #60

then pettis and boling or moffitt in round 3, and finish out the draft with:

OGs - thomas claiborne, ricky henry
RB - roy helu jr.

 

[Water Boy]

I would throw a brick through my TV if the Patriots made these picks (with the exception of Wilkerson).

I'll gladly throw the dice on Aldon Smith at 17. I think Dry Heat summed up nicely why I'd take Smith over Quinn.

 

[Patriot Missile]

I would take Quinn in a heartbeat. You don't just forget film like his 2 years later. I think he gets a bad wrap for his combine that still wasn't half bad btw. There is only so much you can do on your own. To his own fault, he missed a year of football. He missed all the drills and practices that went along with it that keep you in football frame of mind and shape. For him to show up and perform as well as he did shows me he is a natural who was certainly rusty.

I'd like to know more about what he has been doing over the last year and who he has been getting his advice from. I see no reason once this guy puts the pads on that he won't be back in game form before long. I'm not going to fault the guy because he wants to be drafted as a DE. I see him lining up there at times anyway as an elephant.

There are a few players in this draft that will make me jump up and down like it's X-MAS morning if they are selected. Robert Quinn is one of them. To each their own.

 

[Keyser Söze]

Cant see Peterson going #1. You need a franchise changing player with that pick, not a CB teams can throw away from.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I really like Smith but the main question for me is about the role you are looking for. If you are looking for a beast pass rusher, someone who can hold up (not dominate) on the edge and drop into shallow zones (screens and quick slants), then Quinn is your guy. I'll agree with your assessment of Smith but he doesn't have the rush moves, explosion and violent hands that Quinn has.

As for the brain tumor, it was a benign growth that caused him to have headaches/blackouts in high school. It was surgically reduced in size to relieve the pressure and is monitored twice a year. I don't recall it ever being mentioned as an issue at UNC. So while it needs to be checked out, I don't know of anyone who thinks it is a concern as a pro.

Umm a brain tumor that caused blackouts? I'd say that is a definite concern!

 

[Metaphors]

Umm a brain tumor that caused blackouts? I'd say that is a definite concern!

- Benign
- Dealt with in 2007
- Checked 2x a year
- No issues since
- No medical opinion (that I know of) that suggests it is an ongoing issue

You have anything that suggests something different? I'm not saying that you don't pay it due diligence, but if it checks out and you can get a top 5 guy at your position of top need at #17, seems kind of silly to pass that up.

 

[mgteich]

QUINN
I don't see how Quinn is not a medical risk. We can assess the risk and take it, but it is a known risk nontheless. So, I would choose Smith over Quinn.
==========================================

The priorities at 17 are DE, OT, and OLB aren't they? The open question is how much we want on of the five top OT's. This mock has them all gone by 22. We would all like to draft Carimi at 28 or 33. That's very nice, but he won't be there.

Personally, I'm fine with Kaczur at RT. Belichick wouldn't have asked for him to take a pay cut so early in the offseason if Belichick had the same confidence. So, how likely is Light's extension? Is a mid-level veteran RT in free agency fine. It certainly used to be.

Obviously it would be a shame to draft an OT, extend Light, and see the OT on the bench for at least half his contract.

BOTTOM LINE
The question for me is how much Belichick want an OT. Perhaps he indeed wants one enough to draft Quinn or Smith.

BTW, this problem is a consequence of not having free agecny before the draft. Our decision would be much, much easier if we knew whether we were extending Light, and who we picked up as a veteran OT (Ojinnaka last year).

 

[TealSox]

Cant see Peterson going #1. You need a franchise changing player with that pick, not a CB teams can throw away from.

Wasn't expecting Kirwan to suggest Peterson, but I expected a defensive player.

The difference between this year and the years before, is that the Panthers can't negotiate with potential picks for leverage. No use for them to create a smoke screen unless they think they can trade the pick and recover additional picks. With that said, I can't see any team being interested in the #1 pick unless the Panthers can sell the idea of taking Cam Newton and Buffalo antes up.