Zolak: Sources Say Brady Overthrowing Edelman was "100% on Edelman"

[borg]

Read what Brady6 wrote in http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/a-closer-look-at-tom-brady’s-game-on-sunday.1111900/ unless you were just trolling..

I read that earlier. A poster with Brady in his name defending Tom on every throw and throwing everyone else under the bus....valuable stuff....and not a surprise.
Regardless...
Crossing pattern...Edelman positioned between two vertical layers of coverage....wide open.
Sorry, the point is to complete the pass...and given the line of throw...over Edelmans wide open head, the throw was bad. Zolack should use sources not named Gizelle

 

[Zeus]

Tell Zolak I said - who cares. It was one play and likely would not have changed the outcome.

I completely agree with the "who cares." That's a team matter, I hate finger pointing and at this point, what difference does it make?

I do think that the play (had the pass been completed) had the potential to alter the outcome of the game. (I note that you said "likely.") Given the score at the time (23-20?) and that NE would have had a first down inside the Miami 25, the outcome is very much up in the air at that point. I thought it was a huge play.

 

[Rob0729]

And the other 13 misses on passes over 15 yds? Teflon Tom

Some of them are on Brady, but a lot of them are not.

 

[Ring 6]

I haven't seen anyone claim that Brady played well. What I've seen is people claiming that, behind that line, playing well was never a possibility.

QBs get sacked and still play well. Brady had a very bad half of football. Sure he would have had to overcome some issues but there were plays to be made. Some were, but were called back by penalties. The offense overall stunk in the second half. Thats not a reason to give Brady an excuse that he had no chance, because he is the GOAT, and he has overcome much more on other occassions. Just didn't happen this time.

Even when he had time to throw? Please point to the specific snaps in the second half where he had time to throw and failed to make a play. Spoiler: you'll find 1-2 max.

There were plays to be made. The team didn't make them.

When they kept him upright, he was really good, and the Pats were on pace to drop 40 on the Dolphins. When the line collapsed, he didn't have a magic solution to that.

This was not one of Brady's better games. He didn't suck, but on the Brady scale it wasn't good.

If there's a criticism of Brady here, it's that he isn't Andrew Luck or Russell Wilson. If you put him behind a crap line, he isn't going to escape the pocket and salvage something out of it. I dunno why anyone's acting like this is new information, though. He's a pocket passer, and pocket passers need a pocket. Peyton Manning's the exact same way, and this has been true for both of them for their entire careers.

Brady has never been mobile and he has beaten many teams that were doing a good pass rushing job.
I don't know why we need to act like he is incapable of playing well under those conditions. Not a lot of QBs are, but he is.

 

[Danger Zone]

That's what I thought, but it ultimately wasn't all that important. That play didn't change the outcome of the game.

Edleman catches that ball in stride and scores 7.

Perception about Brady's game and longball take a huge upswing just from him connecting on that one pass.

75% of the doom and gloom and second guessing posts about this game dont get written.

 

[primetime]

It looked to me like miscommunication. Brady threw it to one spot where there was no one and Edelman could have run onto the ball. Edelman ran to a different spot where there was no one and he could have caught the ball. It was an incomplete pass. It happens. Every quarterback misses passes down the field, and Brady is no exception, so it's not a big deal. Manning misses a lot of passes down the field too, he just has guys who can take his short and medium throws to the house on any given play which the Patriots do not.

The bigger deal was a complete lack of time to throw and a questionable gameplan in the second half.

 

[luuked]

I read that earlier. A poster with Brady in his name defending Tom on every throw and throwing everyone else under the bus....valuable stuff....and not a surprise.
Regardless...
Crossing pattern...Edelman positioned between two vertical layers of coverage....wide open.
Sorry, the point is to complete the pass...and given the line of throw...over Edelmans wide open head, the throw was bad. Zolack should use sources not named Gizelle

Are you just trolling ?

Brady6 gave a pretty nice summary on what those "record setting" deep passes were. So you are telling me that throwing deep in a last ditch effort should be weighted as much as e.g. the deep pass Brady missed last January in Denver ?

There is context to every throw. Just looking at stats is inane and lazy at best.

 

[Rob0729]

I read that earlier. A poster with Brady in his name defending Tom on every throw and throwing everyone else under the bus....valuable stuff....and not a surprise.
Regardless...
Crossing pattern...Edelman positioned between two vertical layers of coverage....wide open.
Sorry, the point is to complete the pass...and given the line of throw...over Edelmans wide open head, the throw was bad. Zolack should use sources not named Gizelle

Most deep ball passes a QB throws the ball to where the receiver is supposed to be and it is the receiver's job to make adjustments. On the deep pass, it is usually the QB's job to throw to a location and the receiver does the rest of the work. If the receiver runs to the wrong location, then doesn't matter.

 

[Rob0729]

Tell Zolak I said - who cares. It was one play and likely would not have changed the outcome.

If he connected with Edelman, it certainly could have changed the outcome. That easily could have scored six on that play.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I read that earlier. A poster with Brady in his name defending Tom on every throw and throwing everyone else under the bus....valuable stuff....and not a surprise.
Regardless...
Crossing pattern...Edelman positioned between two vertical layers of coverage....wide open.
Sorry, the point is to complete the pass...and given the line of throw...over Edelmans wide open head, the throw was bad. Zolack should use sources not named Gizelle

Is the whole concept of "throw to where the receiver's going, not where he is" completely foreign to you?

Because that's about as basic as it gets. Brady threw to where he thought Edelman was going, and Edelman thought that he was supposed to be somewhere else. One of them was wrong. It was a bad read on one or both of their parts, but it wasn't a bad throw. Brady put the ball exactly where he thought it was supposed to go.

 

[pencilneckgeek]

I don't think people here understand the concept that, in order for a quarterback to be effective, he has to remain upright. You'd think they would have learned after watching the greatest offense in NFL history get crippled because Brady was getting pounded like Tori Lane in a 5-way.

Now that you mention it, I did feel kind of dirty the morning after watching that game.

 

[Brady6]

If he connected with Edelman, it certainly could have changed the outcome. That easily could have scored six on that play.

Edelman was wide open because of the route he ran, which you are saying was the wrong route. Well if he ran the right route how do we know he would have been open.

 

[BradyFTW!]

That's what I thought, but it ultimately wasn't all that important. That play didn't change the outcome of the game.

It probably didn't, but who knows, it might have. When you're playing that badly, it's especially true that you can't afford to leave big plays on the field.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Edelman was wide open because of the route he ran, which you are saying was the wrong route. Well if he ran the right route how do we know he would have been open.

Nobody knows what would have happened, and Rob didn't claim to. But it certainly looked like Edelman had his man solidly beaten.

 

[pencilneckgeek]

Regardless...
Crossing pattern...Edelman positioned between two vertical layers of coverage....wide open.
Sorry, the point is to complete the pass...and given the line of throw...over Edelmans wide open head, the throw was bad.

That was the way I read the coverage, too, but I'm not inside the locker room. Zolak is closer to it, so I would defer to his information. However, in general, I think the way the offense works is that the receiver needs to be where Brady expects him to be, and part of those expectations is turning it upfield when you have a chance at six points. (Thus, the WR is at fault by default.) Whether Brady should be looking for site adjustments like that when there is a trailing safety is another question, but that is one that the team needs to answer in the meeting rooms and not on the field. It makes little difference who was to blame. The QB and the WR need to get on the same page if they hope to execute effectively.

 

[Rob0729]

Edelman was wide open because of the route he ran, which you are saying was the wrong route. Well if he ran the right route how do we know he would have been open.

He was supposed to be farther to the sideline. The defenders were trailing for a route of the center of the field. So odds are good he would be open.

 

[PP2]

Are you just trolling ?

Brady6 gave a pretty nice summary on what those "record setting" deep passes were. So you are telling me that throwing deep in a last ditch effort should be weighted as much as e.g. the deep pass Brady missed last January in Denver ?

There is context to every throw. Just looking at stats is inane and lazy at best.

Luuked, you mentioned in another thread that you had access to all-22 for every game. Is it possible for you to create a gif of the all-22 on this particular play?

 

[borg]

Are you just trolling ?

Brady6 gave a pretty nice summary on what those "record setting" deep passes were. So you are telling me that throwing deep in a last ditch effort should be weighted as much as e.g. the deep pass Brady missed last January in Denver ?

There is context to every throw. Just looking at stats is inane and lazy at best.

Lighten up my friend. I never "weighted" this particular throw or any throw. I am of the opinion the QB over shot the WR....no biggy. And I hope I don't have to apologize for not buying into the "Brady is Infallible" cult-think that some grasp too tightly to. The guy had a rough half, the team had a rough half. I pinned the entire sucktitude on the heat in a post Sunday night. I live in S Fla...and the heat this time of year zaps you...and the team looked zapped in the 2nd half.

 

[condon84]

Wait, isn't our passing game based on reading defenders? Edelman read how the CB was covering him and because of his read, cutting it outside where his man was playing inside leverage, he got open. Had he continued to run out towards the post as Brady's pass indicated, his man would have kept running with him and his separation wouldn't have been that much.

 

[james87654]

fwiw......bedard just said that he thought it was bradys fault on this pass......on felger and mazz