Winning with this current receiver corp is not sustainable

[Sticky Caulk]

Re: For now, we are the Chicago Bears of the 2000s

Stop trolling.

 

[DarrylS]

Back to earth, and back to topic...

This offense is currently getting 0 catches from the TE's and backfield, in week 1 Vereen was effective... Thursday it was all on the WR's...

Previously our WR's have been complimentary to the RB's, TE's and Slot Receivers... so when they are cast into the limelight as the only offensive weapon, shyt happens....

The O is predicated on finding the open receiver, and focusing on rookie receivers can have negative results... we have about 1/2 the offensive weapons we used to have...

 

[ausbacker]

Back to earth, and back to topic...

This offense is currently getting 0 catches from the TE's and backfield, in week 1 Vereen was effective... Thursday it was all on the WR's...

Previously our WR's have been complimentary to the RB's, TE's and Slot Receivers... so when they are cast into the limelight as the only offensive weapon, shyt happens....

The O is predicated on finding the open receiver, and focusing on rookie receivers can have negative results... we have about 1/2 the offensive weapons we used to have...

The receivers were getting separation then dropping catches. They also appeared to be running incorrect routes and making rookie mistakes. That's what I took out of the game.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Back to earth, and back to topic...

This offense is currently getting 0 catches from the TE's and backfield, in week 1 Vereen was effective... Thursday it was all on the WR's...

Previously our WR's have been complimentary to the RB's, TE's and Slot Receivers... so when they are cast into the limelight as the only offensive weapon, shyt happens....

The O is predicated on finding the open receiver, and focusing on rookie receivers can have negative results... we have about 1/2 the offensive weapons we used to have...

On Thursday night we had far less than half, close to about zero. Zero at TE, Zero out of the backfield, and our #4 receiver last year was our #1 with 2 unproven receivers behind him.
If you are speaking on a theoretical basis on the 2013 season (assuming good health), we are significantly better than half. No real drop off in the backfield (Vereen replaces Woodhead), certainly half at TE, not that far off on WR. So while I agree that the offense looks less potent, when speaking theoretically, there remains markedly more than half of 2012's production there. It's all about the health at this point, IMHO.

 

[Snake Eyes]

Id rather take my chances with a weaker offense and a stronger defense than what we've had the last few years.

Ummm, the quote was 'what have we won since becoming a powerhouse offence'? There's nothing bad about a strong offense, and having one doesn't automatically mean you defense becomes weaker.

In truth, we had a finesse offense that put up a lot of points in the regular season that fell apart when facing a tough, physical defense. I wouldnt exactly call that a power-house offense, and I think if we actually had a tougher offense we'd have done a lot better and have more Lombardis.

 

[aluminum seats]

Haven't read all of this, but I have to say I find all the hysteria over the receiving group sort of ridiculous.

Going into this season, anyone you asked would have said that OF COURSE this group would need a few weeks to jell, and that would be OK. They're rookies, Gronkowski is out, etc. Now that they're struggling, it's somehow unexpected? Come on.

I always thought the team should have kept Welker. No brainer to me. But he's gone, and we've got a new crop here. Let's give 'em a little time.

 

[RIpats88]

The pats need to stick with their current plan and endure the growing pains with these receivers...because

1. Dobson/Thompkins getting in sync with brady and contributing = higher upside for the offenses success than relying on old veterans

2. Bringing in an old Vet will probably stunt the growth of these receivers and ultimately wont help us come playoff times

really, we just need Gronk/Amendola to get healthy and this offense should be fine IMO...

 

[aluminum seats]

The pats need to stick with their current plan and endure the growing pains with these receivers...because

1. Dobson/Thompkins getting in sync with brady and contributing = higher upside for the offenses success than relying on old veterans

2. Bringing in an old Vet will probably stunt the growth of these receivers and ultimately wont help us come playoff times

really, we just need Gronk/Amendola to get healthy and this offense should be fine IMO...

Completely agree. September is all about just getting the wins. There will be growing pains--over the next few weeks, the Pats will lose an UGLY game (or two). They'll give up some points, offensive won't click, a couple of turnovers, and boom. It will get truly ugly around here during that time.

Then, come December, the Pats will likely run the the table, or close to it. Suddenly, this offense, and team, will look pretty damn good. And then we'll see. Health is important, and relying on a guy like Amendola with an injury history might end up not working out. We will see.

But if this team IS healthy come playoff time? You bet I'll take what's on this roster. I'll sign for it now.

 

[Snake Eyes]

Bringing in an old Vet will probably stunt the growth of these receivers and ultimately wont help us come playoff times

How do you KNOW the receivers will develop? How many receivers have been brought in who haven't developed?

The goal should be bring in players who give us the best chance of winning, if one of those players is a vet who doesn't need to learn how to be an NFL receiver in addition to being a Pats receiver, then I'm all for it.

 

[mgteich]

How do you KNOW the receivers will develop? How many receivers have been brought in who haven't developed?

The goal should be bring in players who give us the best chance of winning, if one of those players is a vet who doesn't need to learn how to be an NFL receiver in addition to being a Pats receiver, then I'm all for it.

I agree.

One might argue that the best situation would be to have both veterans and a developmental receiver or two. If 1-2 developmental receivers is a good idea, it does not follow that 4 (without veteran backup) is better).

 

[Oswlek]

How do you KNOW the receivers will develop? How many receivers have been brought in who haven't developed?

The goal should be bring in players who give us the best chance of winning, if one of those players is a vet who doesn't need to learn how to be an NFL receiver in addition to being a Pats receiver, then I'm all for it.

Whether we know that the young guys will develop is immaterial. Winning in September takes a back seat to winning in January and the only thing we know for certain is that signing Jenkins or Stallworth will not make this crew championship caliber.

Getting guys healthy and coddling a productive season or two out of the youngsters is the only possible solution, so it makes little sense to do anything else. Bill isn't stupid, he knows NE has a get out of jail free card by being in the AFCE, and he's perfectly fine playing it.

 

[mgteich]

As Reiss said, Belichick will let this continue for another couple of weeks. At some point, receivers will stop dropping the ball and tipping the ball to the other team, or they will be inactive or at sitting on the bench, playing a couple of reps a game (as Boyce did this week).

And, you are correct, if we were in any other division in the NFL, a veteran or two would already be here. It is easy enough to free up a couple of roster spots until Amendola and Gronkowski return.

After all, what were going to if Edelman need to be out for a half. Would we simply have conceded the game. No, the reality is it would have been more prudent to have Jenkins on the active roster in place of Boyce (who got 2 reps).

Whether we know that the young guys will develop is immaterial. Winning in September takes a back seat to winning in January and the only thing we know for certain is that signing Jenkins or Stallworth will not make this crew championship caliber.

Getting guys healthy and coddling a productive season or two out of the youngsters is the only possible solution, so it makes little sense to do anything else. Bill isn't stupid, he knows NE has a get out of jail free card by being in the AFCE, and he's perfectly fine playing it.

 

[Oswlek]

As Reiss said, Belichick will let this continue for another couple of weeks. At some point, receivers will stop dropping the ball and tipping the ball to the other team, or they will be inactive or at sitting on the bench, playing a couple of reps a game (as Boyce did this week).

And, you are correct, if we were in any other division in the NFL, a veteran or two would already be here. It is easy enough to free up a couple of roster spots until Amendola and Gronkowski return.

After all, what were going to if Edelman need to be out for a half. Would we simply have conceded the game. No, the reality is it would have been more prudent to have Jenkins on the active roster in place of Boyce (who got 2 reps).

Then they would need to have Jenkins on the actual roster in place of Boyce (or someone else) which isn't happening.

NE is fine with their WRs at the moment, despite all the gnashing of teeth. Fans just need to pop open their prozac bottles or get into transcendental meditation or something for a little while.

 

[Snake Eyes]

Whether we know that the young guys will develop is immaterial. Winning in September takes a back seat to winning in January and the only thing we know for certain is that signing Jenkins or Stallworth will not make this crew championship caliber.

There are no receivers available who will make this "a championship caliber" offense, so that really isn't relevant, what is relevant is whether an outside vet will make the team better. Plenty of teams have won SBs with parts of the team being less than championship caliber because other parts of the team were strong enough to compensate, but the stronger those sub-championship pieces are the better your chances are of winning.

 

[Mack Herron]

Whether we know that the young guys will develop is immaterial. Winning in September takes a back seat to winning in January and the only thing we know for certain is that signing Jenkins or Stallworth will not make this crew championship caliber.

Getting guys healthy and coddling a productive season or two out of the youngsters is the only possible solution, so it makes little sense to do anything else. Bill isn't stupid, he knows NE has a get out of jail free card by being in the AFCE, and he's perfectly fine playing it.

It is not etched in stone that we will win the division or make the playoffs.

 

[Froob]

How do you KNOW the receivers will develop? How many receivers have been brought in who haven't developed?

The goal should be bring in players who give us the best chance of winning, if one of those players is a vet who doesn't need to learn how to be an NFL receiver in addition to being a Pats receiver, then I'm all for it.

Agreed, you play to win the game. I would love for these guys to develop but if it cost us a few games and has us playing a playoff game in Denver is it worth it? And it's no guarentee they will develop. Younger does not equal better. A guy like Branch isn't worth it but a veteran who can still play like Lloyd would be a different story.

 

[mgteich]

I strongly disagree. When there are injuries, belichick uses the end of the roster positions to bring in players to bridge the gap.

1) I would have been fine (and still would be) with having one more receiver on the roster and one fewer linebacker. Do we really need FOUR special teamers in the linebacking corp? This has to with the 53 from the start.

2) We have a need now. I see little downside in waiving Beauharnais to sign one of the JAG WR's, or Mulligan. if Gronk is ready to play.

4) The only reason that we "are fine at WR" is that we are 2-0. We easily could be 0-2. The situation wouldn't really be any different. However, somehow, I think more would think it prudent to add a WR.

5) I think/hope that we will be fine at WR come Thanksgiving. That is NOT a reason to fail to have backups on the team now. Belichick is much better at roster management than that.

Then they would need to have Jenkins on the actual roster in place of Boyce (or someone else) which isn't happening.

NE is fine with their WRs at the moment, despite all the gnashing of teeth. Fans just need to pop open their prozac bottles or get into transcendental meditation or something for a little while.

 

[Patriot Missile]

What really does sustainable mean here? Are you saying they are not going to get better as the season progresses? Gronkowski and Amendola not coming back?

Again like a dead horse. Dobson had some critical drops. Yes he did. First game as a starter and possibly some jitters. He didn't drop a pass last year in college so maybe we will see some of his surehanded ways come back?

2013 NFL Draft: Aaron Dobson, Ace Sanders display best hands - SBNation.com

Thompkins and Dobson need to do a better job running routes and they have a long week to get better before playing another bad team. The experience is is very important and could be key later on in their development.

Loved the way Thompkins laid out for that ball in the endzone and the separation Dobson seemed to get. With a healthy Gronkowski having to be accounted for I think these two players become essential to the success of the passing game going forward.

 

[Oswlek]

There are no receivers available who will make this "a championship caliber" offense, so that really isn't relevant, what is relevant is whether an outside vet will make the team better. Plenty of teams have won SBs with parts of the team being less than championship caliber because other parts of the team were strong enough to compensate, but the stronger those sub-championship pieces are the better your chances are of winning.

Better against Tampa? Maybe. Probably, even.

Better in the playoffs? If that is the case, then NE is in trouble and you are better off just getting the kids up to speed for 2014.

 

[Oswlek]

It is not etched in stone that we will win the division or make the playoffs.

If Brady stays healthy, it might as well be.

4) The only reason that we "are fine at WR" is that we are 2-0. We easily could be 0-2. The situation wouldn't really be any different. However, somehow, I think more would think it prudent to add a WR.

5) I think/hope that we will be fine at WR come Thanksgiving. That is NOT a reason to fail to have backups on the team now. Belichick is much better at roster management than that.

4) No, the reason NE is "fine" at WR is because all the options being bandied about suck.

5) Yes he is, which is why I strongly believe they won't add anyone unless we go a few weeks without the kids making any improvement whatsoever. And, frankly, I find that very unlikely.