Why have none of our ex-coaches come back?

[GrogansArmy]

Its something I've been wondering for the past few years. For example:

1. Charlie Weiss leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competition as OC.

2. Romeo leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competitor as DC.

3. Josh leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competitor as OC.

Thats just off the top of my head, maybe there are others. But I don't get it, why wouldn't they want to come back here? They had their best years here considering they got their "promotion" because of what they accomplished here.

I would think BB knows how good they were here and would let them back in a heartbeat even at the expense of letting go our current OC/DC.

Is it Pride? They don't want to be in BB's shadow?

I just remember that one SB where BB/Charlie/Romeo were huddled in a group knowing it was their last game together and just wishing each other good fortune. I would think either or both would want to come back to the "good old days".

For the 'holier than thou' posters, this is where you say I'm stupid and don't know a thing about football.

I totally agree you.

 

[Tunescribe]

Its something I've been wondering for the past few years. For example:

1. Charlie Weiss leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competition as OC.

2. Romeo leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competitor as DC.

3. Josh leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competitor as OC.

Thats just off the top of my head, maybe there are others. But I don't get it, why wouldn't they want to come back here? They had their best years here considering they got their "promotion" because of what they accomplished here.

I would think BB knows how good they were here and would let them back in a heartbeat even at the expense of letting go our current OC/DC.

Is it Pride? They don't want to be in BB's shadow?

I just remember that one SB where BB/Charlie/Romeo were huddled in a group knowing it was their last game together and just wishing each other good fortune. I would think either or both would want to come back to the "old days".

For the 'holier than thou' posters, this is where you say I'm stupid and don't know a thing about football. I totally agree you.

(1). I don't think the Patriots budget for top-dollar assistant coaches.
(2). Weis, Crennel, and I assume McDaniel all want to be head coaches. Knowing that, it wouldn't serve either the Pats' or their own best interests to come back here.

 

[Sciz]

What are you supposed to do with BOB after hiring McDaniels back?

 

[NinjaZX6R]

(1). I don't think the Patriots budget for top-dollar assistant coaches.
(2). Weis, Crennel, and I assume McDaniel all want to be head coaches. Knowing that, it wouldn't serve either the Pats' or their own best interests to come back here.

That's interesting though. Bill came back to his old boss Bill Parcells. Not sure if Belichick, after he got fired from the Browns, wanted to become a HC again.

 

[Fencer]

(1). I don't think the Patriots budget for top-dollar assistant coaches.
(2). Weis, Crennel, and I assume McDaniel all want to be head coaches. Knowing that, it wouldn't serve either the Pats' or their own best interests to come back here.

Agreed on both.

Coaching is the only area I can think of where I judge the Krafts as being a bit stingy.

 

[GrogansArmy]

Agreed on both.

Coaching is the only area I can think of where I judge the Krafts as being a bit stingy.

Not true. I believe I read a couple of years ago that BB was one of the highest paid coaches in the league.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Not true. I believe I read a couple of years ago that BB was one of the highest paid coaches in the league.

He is still the highest paid NFL coach.

 

[Tunescribe]

That's interesting though. Bill came back to his old boss Bill Parcells. Not sure if Belichick, after he got fired from the Browns, wanted to become a HC again.

Sure he did. A deal was in place for him to succeed Parcells in New Jersey, which he broke to come here. BB either was biding his time for the best situation to come along, or no one else wanting him as head coach between 1996 and 2000. (I don't know if he interviewed for HC elsewhere during that span.) His official title under Parcells from '96 to '99 was assistant head coach/secondary coach.

 

[Reckedtrek]

Maybe it's because they don't want to interrupt what they think is a current successful relationship with a current coach (although some would disagree) so that a past coach can come in, do well and be gone (again) in a year, leaving them back at square one without the coach they replaced in many cases. I don't know this as fact, but it seems that it would help the team maybe for a year or two but hurt the team in the mid and long range?

 

[Rob0729]

More often than not, when an assistant or coordinator leave to be a head coach and then get fired, they do not go back to the team they left to become a head coach.

Even when Belichick followed Parcells after he was fired from the Browns, he didn't go back to the team he left to take the Browns' job. Belichick left the Giants for the Browns and then followed Parcells to the Pats and then the Jets

With guys like McDaniels, Weis, and Crennel most likely looking for head coaching jobs agin (Weis got one), it makes it tough to go back to a head coach who has been very successful without him and (in Weis' case) a QB who got far better after he left. If they come back, people could label them a product of Belichick and Brady and not really head coaching material.

Also, both Weis and Crennel followed Pioli. They have about the same loyalty to him as Belichick and can still make a name for themselves. Reportedly McDaniels was going to go to KC this past offseason, but reports were that Haley refused to take him on his staff (probably because of their very publicized spat after Haley got peissed that McDaniels "ran up the score" and the fact that the last Pioli guy in Weis didn't get along with Haley). This typically will happen more often than players going back in that they will follow someone else from the tree when move on themselves.

 

[fnordcircle]

In order to get another HC job they each need to prove they can succeed without being on the Patriots with Belichick as the HC.

If they came back here and had similar success I think teams would be wary that history would repeat itself when they were offered the HC job.

I miss all those guys.

 

[Rob0729]

That's interesting though. Bill came back to his old boss Bill Parcells. Not sure if Belichick, after he got fired from the Browns, wanted to become a HC again.

A few key differences:

1.) Belichick never coached for the Pats until after he got fired by the Browns. He was going to a new place with totally different players.
2.) Belichick had the defensive genius cache that I don't think Crennel, Weis, or McDaniels had. Whether it is fair or not, I think Belichick's reputation didn't take the hit that Weis, Crennel, and especially McDaniels got after he got fired from the Browns.
3.) To that point, Parcells' reputation was taking a hit before Belichick came to New England in 96. Unlike Belichick now who is considered possibly the best coach of all time and can continue to put out Super Bowl contenders year after year no matter the coaching staff, Parcells' struggled before 96 to get the Pats to be consistent enough to win. In 1995, the Pats were 6-10 and that was Parcells' third year as a head coach (usually the third year is considered the year the team makes a legitimate playoff push). Belichick was brought in to help turn around the team and potentially save Parcells' job. The reason why Kraft gave Grier so much control over the 1996 draft was probably because he was concerned that Parcells might be heading the team in the wrong direction.

Actually, this third point is probably the biggest reason why Belichick followed Parcells and former Belichick coordinators are not coming back. In 1996, Belichick had the opportunity to come in as the savior to help turn around a struggling Patriots' team. Guys like Weis, Crennel, and McDaniels did not have that opportunity because the Pats were already considered a Super Bowl contender with or without them.

 

[strngplyr]

Also, in the OC's case, they'd need to improve upon our offense in some significant way to get looked at for a HC job. Weis left and the offense got better. McDaniels left and the offense hasn't missed a beat, with "lesser" players.

They won't prove their worthiness for another HC job, at least on the offensive side of the ball, by coming back to a unit they can't really improve on too much.

Defensively we simply lack talented personnel. Unless a DC gets credit for an amazing draft and we improve drastically over the same year no DC of ours will get another HC job in the near future.

Really no reason for the likes of Crennel, Weis, and McD to come back.

 

[andrewgarrr]

Not true. I believe I read a couple of years ago that BB was one of the highest paid coaches in the league.

He's also the GM.

 

[ATippett56]

Do you honestly believe that Bill Belichick would hire back Eric "the Rat" Mangini (no Mangenius in my book)?

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

[strngplyr]

Do you honestly believe that Bill Belichick would hire back Eric "the Rat" Mangini (no Mangenius in my book)?

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Notice his name wasn't included.

 

[TheGreatestEVER]

I can't seem to remember but i think it was Mike Lombardi that said that McDaniels is a candidate for the Chiefs' headcoaching job. I think that would be a good move to be honest, Cassel might actually make it back to the probowl.

Also, in the OC's case, they'd need to improve upon our offense in some significant way to get looked at for a HC job. Weis left and the offense got better. McDaniels left and the offense hasn't missed a beat, with "lesser" players.

They won't prove their worthiness for another HC job, at least on the offensive side of the ball, by coming back to a unit they can't really improve on too much.

Defensively we simply lack talented personnel. Unless a DC gets credit for an amazing draft and we improve drastically over the same year no DC of ours will get another HC job in the near future.

Really no reason for the likes of Crennel, Weis, and McD to come back.

I agree with this, they would just say they were successful with Tom Brady, because of Tom Brady.

You can see it in St. Louis, their offense hasn't really improved with McDaniels so I think that's another blow to his resume. In fact I think their offense and Bradford specifically regressed, but that maybe due to their atrocious excuse for an O-line. That's just proof that there isn't some magical New England Offensive SYSTEM. (I hate that label)

 

[jmt57]

Its something I've been wondering for the past few years. For example:

1. Charlie Weiss leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competition as OC.

2. Romeo leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competitor as DC.

3. Josh leaves for HC job, gets fired and goes to our competitor as OC.

Thats just off the top of my head, maybe there are others. But I don't get it, why wouldn't they want to come back here? They had their best years here considering they got their "promotion" because of what they accomplished here.

I would think BB knows how good they were here and would let them back in a heartbeat even at the expense of letting go our current OC/DC.

Is it Pride? They don't want to be in BB's shadow?

I just remember that one SB where BB/Charlie/Romeo were huddled in a group knowing it was their last game together and just wishing each other good fortune. I would think either or both would want to come back to the "good old days".

For the 'holier than thou' posters, this is where you say I'm stupid and don't know a thing about football.

I totally agree you.

Perhaps Belichick has spoken with Weis, Crenel and McDaniels and realizes that they are looking for another opportunity to be the head coach again. If he hires any one of those mentioned then he would need to demote the current person in that position (O'Brien and Patricia) to a position coach - something they probably would not accept - or just fire them. Then a year later the new hire does get offered a job elsewhere, and where does that leave the Pats in terms of an OC or DC?

If any of those three are convinced they no longer aspire to be an NFL head coach, then it would make sense for them to return to Foxboro; an example would be **** LeBeau returning to Pittsburgh after being fired by the Bengals. I just don't think that is the case with Weis, Crenel or McDaniels.

While I am sure there are a few examples of a fired coach returning to his old team as a coordinator or position coach, my guess is if you looked throughout the entire NFL for all coaches that have been let go that is probably the exception and not the rule.


It's a good question though; ignore the 'holier than thou' forum members.

 

[DarrylS]

It would appear for Romeo, Josh and Charlie their success has been defined by Bill's success, and there comes a time when you have to forge your own identity and show how successful you are away from BB... they haven't done very good.

With that being said, if BOB moves on next year.. McDaniels may be looking for work and he may come back with the understanding that he stay for a defined period of time.

McDaniels and BB's careers are somewhat parallel..

 

[plk]

(1). I don't think the Patriots budget for top-dollar assistant coaches.

Do you have a source for this or is it just an "impression"?

I seem to remember that a few years ago there were bitter complaints that one unfair advantage that the Patriots have over teams with less money is that they can, and do, pay top dollar for the assistant coaches that they want.