The official "our defense is horrible" thread

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Ok who are you and what have you done with Hey Bro!??

Hahaha, very funny. I'm just trying to be consistent.

I've complained about this defense for years not making a play when it matters most.

I don't care if they're ranked last in the league in total defense. I just want them to hang around long enough to make a play. However, it would be nice if they were good.

 

[Kontradiction]

Has anyone looked at the offensive stats for week 3?

Kyle Orton put up like 475 yards. How about those two "dominating" defenses in Miami last night?

Was the reason for Buffalo having the worst offense a result of talent or Trent Edwards?

That's cool. But what does that have to do with what our defense was unable to do yesterday against, statistically, the worst offense in the NFL yesterday? And yes, Buffalo, as a whole, is a terrible offense outside of CJ Spiller. If Fitzpatrick were anything, he would have shown it in the multitude of starting opportunities he's gotten over the last couple of years. Instead, he was unable to beat out Trent Edwards in camp.

 

[moosekill]

Up until the last few years, BB's teams always got better as the year progressed. The difficulty of his schemes always seemed to just take time to figure out. Hopefully, they will continue to improve this year.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

That's cool. But what does that have to do with what our defense was unable to do yesterday against, statistically, the worst offense in the NFL yesterday? And yes, Buffalo, as a whole, is a terrible offense outside of CJ Spiller. If Fitzpatrick were anything, he would have shown it in the multitude of starting opportunities he's gotten over the last couple of years. Instead, he was unable to beat out Trent Edwards in camp.

You do realize that the Bills just released Trent Edwards? Why? Maybe they should just release the whole offense.

Now wind back to my earlier post question, "Does Buffalo suck or just Trent Edwards?" Care to guess why I like asked the question?

How do you think Buffalo answers that question? It's possible that they think they sucked because of the QB....just sayin.

How much tape is there on a Chan Gailey designed Fitz offense?

Again, I am not saying that everything is peachy keen. However, if the defense sucks, 20 defenses suck even more or a different criteria needs to be applied.

Based on the league rules and philosophy of generating offense, the shutdown defenses of old are less and less applicable. That's why the big boys talk about a "QB driven league".

In today's world turnovers and red zone defense are more important than ever. On those two criteria, the defense was much better than the wrist cutters want admit.

 

[BradyFTW!]

That's cool. But what does that have to do with what our defense was unable to do yesterday against, statistically, the worst offense in the NFL yesterday? And yes, Buffalo, as a whole, is a terrible offense outside of CJ Spiller. If Fitzpatrick were anything, he would have shown it in the multitude of starting opportunities he's gotten over the last couple of years. Instead, he was unable to beat out Trent Edwards in camp.

The same Spiller who has 79 total yards on offense through 3 games?

 

[Rob0729]

The numbers don't lie. If you cough up 23 offensive points to Ryan Fitzpatrick's Bills, you suck. Just because you suck eek 3 doesn't mean you will ultimately suck in December/January, but for now, the defense sucks.

Most disappointing was the run defense. The Bills exploited the Patriots weakness at OLB not vs. the pass but vs. the run. Lynch and Spiller were nearly unstoppable when they took it outside. This is particularly discouraging given the speed that TBC and Cunningham bring to the table, and that run D was supposed to be Ninkovich's strength.

On a positive note, the inside run defense looks stout enough. Brace was a noticeable presence on some plays and Mayo looked his best since that Jets game in 2008. Spikes had some moments. The secondary, for all its blundering, made plays when it had to.

Prognosis, this is an obviously flawed unit and a work in progress. IMO, the Patriots best bet in 2010 is to unleash the hounds. There are too many holes on this unit for Belichick's "do your job and trust your teammates" mantra to produce results.

You do realize the Dolphins gave up 31 points to the Ryan Fitzpatrick Bills last year? Fitzpatrick has had some decent games in his career. He has played better than Edwards in recent years. He isn't Brady, but he is capable of putting in a good game here and there. Just not consistently.

 

[Kontradiction]

You do realize that the Bills just released Trent Edwards? Why? Maybe they should just release the whole offense.

Now wind back to my earlier post question, "Does Buffalo suck or just Trent Edwards?" Care to guess why I like asked the question?

How do you think Buffalo answers that question? It's possible that they think they sucked because of the QB....just sayin.

Or perhaps it's that Edwards sucked, only threw checkdown routes, and Buffalo didn't feel as if they needed to carry three quarterbacks. The only difference between Fitz and Edwards, though, is that Fitz is willing to throw the deep ball. He's not very good at it, but he's willing to try. With that said, though, Fitz doesn't somehow turn Buffalo's offense into some juggernaut. Our defense just allowed them to look like that yesterday.

Again, I am not saying that everything is peachy keen. However, if the defense sucks, 20 defenses suck even more or a different criteria needs to be applied.

Uh... what? We've been down this road before, and it didn't end any differently than you want this one to end. I don't think I have to tell you that bringing up the old "20 DEFENSES R TEH SUCK" argument doesn't address or change the fact that our defense had a lot of trouble with the worst offense in the league yesterday. However, just to hammer something in, I'll go ahead and post the stats of our defense through three weeks...

Total Defense: 27th (5 defenses are worse so far)
YPG: 27th (5 defenses are worse so far)
Passing: 25th (7 defenses are worse so far)
Rushing: 19th (Not bad considering the issues we have so far)
Scoring: 28th (4 defenses are worse so far)

As you can see, our defense is pretty much near the bottom of the league in every major category through three weeks. So I'm not sure where you got your "20 defenses" assertion from, but it's pretty faulty. On top of that, we didn't exactly face dominating offenses through the first three weeks. Our opponents' offensive rankings...

1. Bengals - 14th
2. Jets - 21st
3. Bills - 32nd

So, yeah, that's cool. Other defenses are having some issues. But let's not ignore our own elephant in the room.

Based on the league rules and philosophy of generating offense, the shutdown defenses of old are less and less applicable. That's why the big boys talk about a "QB driven league".

How many true "shutdown defenses" have there ever been in this league? I'm not expecting a shutdown defense. I am expecting a defense that can force a QB the calibre of Fitzpatrick into more than just six true incompletions. I'm expecting a defense to be able to stop a horrid offense like Buffalo's into more than just two punts. Maybe you should heighten your expectations.

In today's world turnovers and red zone defense are more important than ever. On those two criteria, the defense was much better than the wrist cutters want admit.

The defense caught two badly overthrown balls. I'm not sure how that can be seen as "forcing turnovers". However, they did hold onto them. So I guess that's worth something. However, both (forcing turnovers and red zone defense) obviously need to improve. The stats I just posted should bear that out.

 

[Sicilian]

The defense caught two badly overthrown balls. I'm not sure how that can be seen as "forcing turnovers".

The Chung interception was aided by a pressure from Cunningham. Without being able to step into the throw, it sailed on Fitz and Chung was there to clean up. That was a forced turnover.

I agree on Meriweather's pick. Just a high throw.

 

[Deus Irae]

Right now, this may well be the worst defense in the NFL. Hopefully, it will improve over the course of the season.

 

[JackBauer]

It's bad, but it's not THAT bad. I think there are 5-7 defenses that are worse.

Of course, a three game sample isn't worth that much, either.

 

[Sicilian]

Of course, a three game sample isn't worth that much, either.

This is very important thing to remember. Even with past history, I'm not going to make any judgments after 3 games, just like I'm not going to declare Kansas City a contender, say Pittsburgh is going unbeaten, or assume that Fred Taylor is going to play 16 games.

Right now, the only facts are 1) We have a lot of work to do. 2) At 2-1, we're in a position to have that work still pay off.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Or perhaps it's that Edwards sucked, only threw checkdown routes, and Buffalo didn't feel as if they needed to carry three quarterbacks. The only difference between Fitz and Edwards, though, is that Fitz is willing to throw the deep ball. He's not very good at it, but he's willing to try. With that said, though, Fitz doesn't somehow turn Buffalo's offense into some juggernaut. Our defense just allowed them to look like that yesterday.



Uh... what? We've been down this road before, and it didn't end any differently than you want this one to end. I don't think I have to tell you that bringing up the old "20 DEFENSES R TEH SUCK" argument doesn't address or change the fact that our defense had a lot of trouble with the worst offense in the league yesterday. However, just to hammer something in, I'll go ahead and post the stats of our defense through three weeks...

Total Defense: 27th (5 defenses are worse so far)
YPG: 27th (5 defenses are worse so far)
Passing: 25th (7 defenses are worse so far)
Rushing: 19th (Not bad considering the issues we have so far)
Scoring: 28th (4 defenses are worse so far)

As you can see, our defense is pretty much near the bottom of the league in every major category through three weeks. So I'm not sure where you got your "20 defenses" assertion from, but it's pretty faulty. On top of that, we didn't exactly face dominating offenses through the first three weeks. Our opponents' offensive rankings...

1. Bengals - 14th
2. Jets - 21st
3. Bills - 32nd

So, yeah, that's cool. Other defenses are having some issues. But let's not ignore our own elephant in the room.



How many true "shutdown defenses" have there ever been in this league? I'm not expecting a shutdown defense. I am expecting a defense that can force a QB the calibre of Fitzpatrick into more than just six true incompletions. I'm expecting a defense to be able to stop a horrid offense like Buffalo's into more than just two punts. Maybe you should heighten your expectations.



The defense caught two badly overthrown balls. I'm not sure how that can be seen as "forcing turnovers". However, they did hold onto them. So I guess that's worth something. However, both (forcing turnovers and red zone defense) obviously need to improve. The stats I just posted should bear that out.

Did mommy tell you that there has been only 3 games played?

The Jets just put up 31 points and over 400 yards of offense against the Dolphins?

You you feel better id week 1, the defense padded stats?

Ahhh, ever go to NFL.com and review weekly game stats?

Maybe you should review the post discussing the Saints defense in 2009.

Again, I guess this just completely flies over your head, so I'll try once again:

The 2010 NFL is a QB driven league that requires sustained offense. the NFL wants more offense, more scoring. that's why offenses like the the Jets and Dolphins score into the 20's with 400+ yards of offense.

Turnovers and red zone defense are more important than ever since that's the best way to limit points.

 

[Snarf]

This team most likely ISN'T going to the super bowl this year, maybe next year or '12. It has a core group of young talented players that are LEARNING. This forum has a group of posters that have no patience and refuse to see that and want instant gratification, your one of them. I think a lot of this group of instant gratification posters grew up in the in the last ten years and think that SB championship grow on trees. It takes time to develop a team good enough to make it all the way. It takes time and luck. The sooner you and the others realize that the sooner the board won't be flooded with threads like this and "do you believe this" or Bench Tom Brady" etc.

Then this is a stupid defense managed by a stupid coach.

The goal is to be competitive EVERY year, and that requires a mix of veterans and young, talented players.

Please stop trying to justify having a crappy defense. There is no rational justification. The goal is to have a competitive team each and every year.

If there's a year where our defense is not competitive, then our defense is a failure.

 

[Rob0729]

It's bad, but it's not THAT bad. I think there are 5-7 defenses that are worse.

Of course, a three game sample isn't worth that much, either.

Yeah, the Dolphins' defense had about as much problems with the Jets at home as the Pats did. And before last night, the Dolphins were considered to have a great defense. Four other teams have allowed more points than the Pats and if you take out the special teams points allowed, I think that number increases to seven or eight other teams.

The defense has a lot of room for improvement to even be average, but it isn't the worst.

 

[Sicilian]

Then this is a stupid defense managed by a stupid coach.

The goal is to be competitive EVERY year, and that requires a mix of veterans and young, talented players.

Please stop trying to justify having a crappy defense. There is no rational justification. The goal is to have a competitive team each and every year.

If there's a year where our defense is not competitive, then our defense is a failure.

I take it this is your first year of following professional sports.

 

[Deus Irae]

weeks into the season, 2 opponents have scored their season high against the Patriots, and the other (Jets) put up 28 on them.

They may very well be the worst defense in the league right now. Anyone who thinks that they are not currently in the "worst" conversation is fooling himself.

The hope is the defense will improve over time, and that the improvement will start right away.

 

[JackBauer]

Meh.

I'd say some of those NFC West defenses are clearly worse.

And then the Jaguars.

I'm sure there are a handful more.

 

[mgcolby]

Then this is a stupid defense managed by a stupid coach.

The goal is to be competitive EVERY year, and that requires a mix of veterans and young, talented players.

Please stop trying to justify having a crappy defense. There is no rational justification. The goal is to have a competitive team each and every year.

If there's a year where our defense is not competitive, then our defense is a failure.

This post says much more about your intellect than it does our "stupid coach".

 

[BradyFTW!]

Meh.

I'd say some of those NFC West defenses are clearly worse.

And then the Jaguars.

I'm sure there are a handful more.

Redskins, Lions, Texans, Cardinals, Seahawks, etc. A lot of defenses have looked bad so far; we won't know how bad any of them really are until we know how good/bad the offenses they matched up against were.

 

[Deus Irae]

Meh.

I'd say some of those NFC West defenses are clearly worse.

And then the Jaguars.

I'm sure there are a handful more.

The Patriots are 28th in scoring defense, having played the Jets, Bills and Bengals. The team's currently below them are Jacksonville, NYG, Buffalo and SF, every team below them has faced better offenses, and they are all within 5 points of each other. There's not a single defense that's "clearly worse" than what the Patriots have been fielding so far this year.