Suspect drafting past few years

[mgteich]

The linebacker situation goes back to trading up to a spot where we could ahve drafted Napolean Harris only to draft Graham.

I think it goes back earlier to Ben Watson. that was a pick where BB hoped he'd be a game breaker pick. We all knew the linebackers were aging and the team could have been proactive with this but it came back to bite them in the next few years.

 

[BelichickFan]

The linebacker situation goes back to trading up to a spot where we could ahve drafted Napolean Harris only to draft Graham.

Harris played for 4 teams (3 but one of them twice) in 7 years and is currently at home on Sundays watching on TV like you and me.

 

[mgteich]

Springs has been injured. Yes, I am disappointed, but Bodden has been shutdown and Butler has had time to develop.

I expect Springs will be around again next year as a veteran backup who could possibly start. He might be let go if Bodden stays, but I don't expect Bodden to stay.

You forgot Springs. He's been a huge disappointment.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

Springs has been injured. Yes, I am disappointed, but Bodden has been shutdown and Butler has had time to develop.

I expect Springs will be around again next year as a veteran backup who could possibly start. He might be let go if Bodden stays, but I don't expect Bodden to stay.

Bodden has been ok but he has not been a shutdown corner, not even close.Springs should be released after the season. By the way I'm watching MNF and what do you know, pressure from GB's two rookie OLB's who happen to be coached by one of our former assistants. Maybe it actually is possible to draft a linebacker who can rush the passer.

 

[mgteich]

our system in too complicated
the player wasn't available
The fact they play a similar system and that we could have drafted the same two players is indeed a bit frustrating.

Bodden has been ok but he has not been a shutdown corner, not even close.Springs should be released after the season. By the way I'm watching MNF and what do you know, pressure from GB's two rookie OLB's who happen to be coached by one of our former assistants. Maybe it actually is possible to draft a linebacker who can rush the passer.

 

[Deus Irae]

Springs has been injured. Yes, I am disappointed, but Bodden has been shutdown and Butler has had time to develop.

I expect Springs will be around again next year as a veteran backup who could possibly start. He might be let go if Bodden stays, but I don't expect Bodden to stay.

If Bodden's been a shutdown corner, it's when he's been playing at home with some toddlers. It hasn't been playing in the NFL on Sundays this season.

 

[mgteich]

I understand that Harris didn't work out to be a stud ILB.

The issue is being willing to take a chance and draft a linebacker early. Maybe Matthews would have been a failure for us. He seems happy enough starting for a former Belichick assistant at GB as a 3-4 OLB tonight.

Maybe Laurinitis wouldn't have worked out as an ILB for our very sophisticated 3-4. He seems happy enough competing for the DROY for the rams.

I believe that the patriots drafts under Belichick have been overall one of the best in the league, year after year. However, Belichick just doesn't seem to draft linebackers very well. Mayo was an exception where Belichick used a top 10 pick for a position of need. I'm sure he held his nose as he overpaid for a risky linebacker.

There are many things about Belichick's tendencies and team structure that I understand. His attitude toward linebackers I don't understand. He'll pay a ransom to acquire Colvin or Thomas. But he won't use the draft much. TBC was one of his best success stories. Guyton is great value, but hardly a stud at ILB.

I don't get why we don't use the first couple of rounds for a position that has been critical for the patriots in each of Belichick's year with the patriots. I guess next year will be the test. After all, we can move Thomas inside to play next to Mayo and have a really solid inside. IF ONLY WE CAN FIND OLB's and pass-rushing DE's!

Harris played for 4 teams (3 but one of them twice) in 7 years and is currently at home on Sundays watching on TV like you and me.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

I think it goes back earlier to Ben Watson. that was a pick where BB hoped he'd be a game breaker pick. We all knew the linebackers were aging and the team could have been proactive with this but it came back to bite them in the next few years.

I believe Karlos Dansby was picked next after the Pats took Watson.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Are you blind? You asked me to compare to a team which I did. All the players which you are outlining what you said. I said the same things about Givens, Branch etc.. You just don't get it. MOST OF THESE GUYS DID NOT MAKE AN IMPACT. Look and read the fine print. You are defending something that can't be defended. I just explained everything you said here. Why don't you stop being such a Pats suck up and get a reality check. MOST OF THESE GUYS HAVE NOT DONE A F####### thing for us. This is why we are here right now. Period. End of story.

I don't know how long you've been on this board, but 192 posts say you've haven't been here very long. Anyways, don't even waste your time with DaBruinz because he is notorious for defending almost everything the Pats do and berate you if you don't agree with him. You're right and he will never get how bad the Pats have done in recent drafts. It's the exact reason why the Pats are in the position they are today.

 

[The Intimidator]

Belichick added Bodden, Springs, Banta-Cain, Burgess and McGowan to the defense. We'd have a losing record without these players. And BTW, none cost us much cap money.

What the hell has Burgess and Springs done for this? Springs has done NOTHING for this team and has been a healthy scratch for the past month. Why is this? I believe it is because the coaching staff does not faith him to get it done or they aren't happy with his work ethnic. He is the highest paid corner on this defense and isn't playing? How can you call this a good signing? He has been a huge waste thus far.

Derrick Burgess was brought into help replace Seymour's production in rushing the passer and he has a grand total of 2 Sacks and has been horrendous vs the run. He has sucked ca ca and has been a horrible bust.. The pass rush has to be one of the worst this decade on this team. Take a look buddy at the free agent signings and trades over the past 4 seasons:

Michael Stone
Joey Galloway
Duane Starks
Monty Beisel
Chad Brown
Artrell Hawkins
Greg Lewis
Deltha O'Neal
Shawn Springs
Adalius Thomas
Hank Poteat

The good:

The Trade for Randy Moss and Wes Welker.

Are you blind here? Those free agents above have flat out been HORRIFIC. They have been all non productive and garbage. Every last one of those guys. Don't come in here and starting preaching at the top of you're lungs that Bill just missed on a few. No No No, this is far far more then "just a few" this offseason after offseason.

This isn't good people and we have blown chances in free agency and in the draft. Don't take a blind eye to it. It is happening and some people don't think it, and there mistaken.

 

[FalconHeavy]

What the hell has Burgess and Springs done for this? Springs has done NOTHING for this team and has been a healthy scratch for the past month. Why is this? I believe it is because the coaching staff does not faith him to get it done or they aren't happy with his work ethnic. He is the highest paid corner on this defense and isn't playing? How can you call this a good signing? He has been a huge waste thus far.


Michael Stone
Joey Galloway
Duane Starks
Monty Beisel
Chad Brown
Artrell Hawkins
Greg Lewis
Deltha O'Neal
Shawn Springs
Adalius Thomas
Hank Poteat


Are you blind here? Those free agents above have flat out been HORRIFIC. They have been all non productive and garbage. Every last one of those guys. Don't come in here and starting preaching at the top of you're lungs that Bill just missed on a few. No No No, this is far far more then "just a few" this offseason after offseason.

This isn't good people and we have blown chances in free agency and in the draft. Don't take a blind eye to it. It is happening and some people don't think it, and there mistaken.

Looking at the list, I guess it is safe to say "you get what you pay for". let us see what we do in this off season

 

[BadMoFo]

I just really hope that this year around draft time people stop talking about how "so and so player" doesn't fit the Patriot style of OLB/DE. At this point, we may just be looking for the pass-rushing player out there. Adalius Thomas is the quintessential Patriots style of player at OLB, but most of us here are calling for him to get the boot.

 

[Patspsycho]

I understand that Harris didn't work out to be a stud ILB.

The issue is being willing to take a chance and draft a linebacker early. Maybe Matthews would have been a failure for us. He seems happy enough starting for a former Belichick assistant at GB as a 3-4 OLB tonight.

Maybe Laurinitis wouldn't have worked out as an ILB for our very sophisticated 3-4. He seems happy enough competing for the DROY for the rams.

I believe that the patriots drafts under Belichick have been overall one of the best in the league, year after year. However, Belichick just doesn't seem to draft linebackers very well. Mayo was an exception where Belichick used a top 10 pick for a position of need. I'm sure he held his nose as he overpaid for a risky linebacker.

There are many things about Belichick's tendencies and team structure that I understand. His attitude toward linebackers I don't understand. He'll pay a ransom to acquire Colvin or Thomas. But he won't use the draft much. TBC was one of his best success stories. Guyton is great value, but hardly a stud at ILB.

I don't get why we don't use the first couple of rounds for a position that has been critical for the patriots in each of Belichick's year with the patriots. I guess next year will be the test. After all, we can move Thomas inside to play next to Mayo and have a really solid inside. IF ONLY WE CAN FIND OLB's and pass-rushing DE's!

You have got to wonder if BB ever got over Lawrence Taylor. Both he and Parcells seem to have judged every LB ever since, by LT, who just set impossible standards for being such a freak of nature.

 

[BadMoFo]

our system in too complicated
the player wasn't available
The fact they play a similar system and that we could have drafted the same two players is indeed a bit frustrating.

Yeah, it's so complicated that the players we currently have in this 3-4 defense and the ones we've had in the past few years can't even run it right.

 

[condon84]

I don't know how long you've been on this board, but 192 posts say you've haven't been here very long. Anyways, don't even waste your time with DaBruinz because he is notorious for defending almost everything the Pats do and berate you if you don't agree with him. You're right and he will never get how bad the Pats have done in recent drafts. It's the exact reason why the Pats are in the position they are today.

Why are you ruining my entertainment?

 

[satz]

Watching the GB cannot think for a minute

Jennings - Picked with NE pick we traded for Chad Jackson
Mathews- Picked with NE pickw we traded for Ron brace

 

[JMarr]

I just really hope that this year around draft time people stop talking about how "so and so player" doesn't fit the Patriot style of OLB/DE. At this point, we may just be looking for the pass-rushing player out there. Adalius Thomas is the quintessential Patriots style of player at OLB, but most of us here are calling for him to get the boot.

There are a lot of reasons why Thomas may have completely disappeared--who knows? But you're right--does every player they draft have to meet certain very specific physical/mental criteria? The answer is no, in spite of what some of the geniuses on this board will tell you. In the '09 offseason, you have to acquire a guy that can just flat out get to the QB and make game-changing plays for this defense. The only reason you don't is if you believe your scheme can overcome the lack of such players.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Anyone watched the Clemson vs GT game? How good would CJ Spiller look in a Patriots uniform? Mmmm.

But if we're going meat and potatoes drafting the team really needs a passrusher and a new OG more. Whoever comes in for Neal is a nonfactor. I suspect BB will also be looking at a DE replacement for Seymour in 2011 when we have the Raiders' 1st rounder. Or maybe we'll be able to trade that future pick for a prospect in 2010? Who knows.

Pass pressure, this defense needs it. As for the inexplicable 2nd half fetal position laydowns by the offense, I'm not sure what will solve that. A 3rd WR is needed, a more reliable running game is needed, better blocking by the OL is needed, you name it. I don't really know what's wrong but a lot of little things is adding up to no offense in the 2nd half.

 

[BelichickFan]

Watching the GB cannot think for a minute

Mathews- Picked with NE pick we traded for Ron brace

Not exactly :

"Trade #4 (4/25/09) – The Patriots acquired a 2009 second-round selection (No. 41 overall – DB Darius Butler), a 2009 third-round selection (No. 73 overall) and a 2009 third-round selection (No. 83 overall) from the Green Bay Packers in exchange for a 2009 first-round selection (No. 26 overall – LB Clay Matthews) and a 2009 fifth-round selection (No. 162 overall).

Trade #5 (4/25/09) – The Patriots acquired a 2009 second-round selection (No. 40 overall – DL Ron Brace) from the Oakland Raiders in exchange for a 2009 second-round selection (No. 47 overall), a 2009 fourth-round selection (No. 124 overall) and a 2009 sixth-round selection (No. 199 overall)"

For the pick where Mathews went and a 5th round pick, we got Butler and two #2s in 2010 (after trading the 2009 #3s).

 

[Brady to Brown]

- Why has Brace been inactive for many of these games? According to Andy Gresh, he has sat out games because of his work ethnic and his conditioning. Boom!!!

- Marquis Hill wasn't a bust? Excuse me, someone who was drafted in the 2nd round and had career totals of 2 tackles isn't a bust?

- Kevin O'Connel was not a 7th round pick. He was a 3RD ROUND PICK. a 3rd Round pick is viewed as someone who can help you. This pick made no sense with Brady and Cassel in front in him. Makes absolutely no sense. He sucked when he was in there as a backup and was let go out of training camp. Blown pick plain and simple.

- Shawn Crable was a healthy scratch several weeks pal. Even when he was healthy, he wasn't consistently in there.

- Brown was not cut do to the lack of depth of the secondary in 2007. Get you're facts straight bub. He was cut because he wasn't good. Plain and simple.

Have you watched Wealthy? He has been a train wreck. Have you watched the games these past two seasons? He has been awful.... Wow you're really on a role here.

Drafting is a MAJOR part of the game and we have been hampered by the poor drafting these past few seasons.

I think you are the one that doesn't know too much right now.

For those interested. Gives you a good look of how each draft has turned out years later.

2008
1 - LB Jerod Mayo - Active, New England Patriots
2 - CB Terrence Wheatley - Active, New England Patriots
3 - LB Shawn Crable - Injured Reserve, New England Patriots
3 - QB Kevin O'Connell - Active, New York Jets
4 - CB Jonathan Wilhite - Active, New England Patriots
5 - WR Matthew Slater - Active, New England Patriots
6 - LB Bo Ruud - Out of NFL

2007
1 - DB Brandon Meriweather - Active, New England Patriots
4 - DL Kareem Brown - Out of NFL
5 - OL Clint Oldenburg - Out of NFL
6 - LB Justin Rogers - Out of NFL
6 - DB Mike Richardson - Out of NFL
6 - RB Justise Hairston - Injured Reserve, Buffalo Bills
6 - OL Corey Hilliard - Practice Squad, Cleveland Browns
7 - LB Oscar Lua - Out of NFL
7 - OL Mike Elgin - Out of NFL

2006
1 - RB Laurence Maroney - Active, New England Patriots
2 - WR Chad Jackson - Out of NFL
3 - TE David Thomas - Active, New Orleans Saints
4 - TE Garrett Mills - Practice Squad, Minnesota Vikings
4 - K Stephen Gostkowski - Active, New England Patriots
5 - OL Ryan O'Callaghan - Active, Kansas City Chiefs
6 - LB Jeremy Mincey - Injured Reserve, Jacksonville Jaguars
6 - OL Dan Stevenson - Out of NFL
6 - DL Le Kevin Smith - Active, Denver Broncos
7 - DB Willie Andrews - Out of NFL

2005
1 - OL Logan Mankins - Active, New England Patriots
3 - DB Ellis Hobbs - Active, Philadelphia Eagles
3 - OL Nick Kaczur - Active, New England Patriots
4 - DB James Sanders - Active, New England Patriots
5 - LB Ryan Claridge - Out of NFL
7 - QB Matt Cassel - Active, Kansas City Chiefs
7 - TE Andy Stokes - Out of NFL

2004
1 - DL Vince Wilfork - Active, New England Patriots
1 - TE Benjamin Watson - Active, New England Patriots
2 - DL Marquise Hill - Deceased
3 - DB Guss Scott - Out of NFL
4 - DB Dexter Reid - Out of NFL
4 - RB Cedric Cobbs - Out of NFL
5 - WR P.K. Sam - Out of NFL
7 - DB Christian Morton - Out of NFL

2003
1 - DL Ty Warren - Active, New England Patriots
2 - DB Eugene Wilson - Active, Houston Texans
2 - WR Bethel Johnson - Out of NFL
4 - DL Dan Klecko - Out of NFL
4 - DB Asante Samuel - Active, Philadelphia Eagles
5 - OL Dan Koppen - Active, New England Patriots
6 - QB Kliff Kingsbury - Out of NFL
7 - TE Spencer Nead - Out of NFL
7 - LB Tully Banta-Cain - Active, New England Patriots
7 - DL Ethan Kelley - Out of NFL

2002
1 - TE Daniel Graham - Active, Denver Broncos
2 - WR Deion Branch - Active, Seattle Seahawks
4 - QB Rohan Davey - Out of NFL
4 - DL Jarvis Green - Active, New England Patriots
7 - RB Antwoine Womack - Out of NFL
7 - WR David Givens - Out of NFL

2001
1 - DL Richard Seymour - Active, Oakland Raiders
2 - OL Matt Light - Active, New England Patriots
3 - DB Brock Williams - Out of NFL
4 - OL Kenyatta Jones - Out of NFL
4 - TE Jabari Holloway - Out of NFL
5 - DB Hakim Akbar - Out of NFL
6 - TE Arther Love - Out of NFL
6 - DB Leonard Myers - Out of NFL
7 - K Owen Pochman - Out of NFL
7 - LB T.J. Turner - Out of NFL

2000
2 - OL Adrian Klemm - Out of NFL
3 - RB J.R. Redmond - Out of NFL
4 - OL Greg Robinson-Randall - Out of NFL
5 - TE Dave Stachelski - Out of NFL
5 - DL Jeff Marriott - Out of NFL
6 - DB Antwan Harris - Out of NFL
6 - QB Tom Brady - Active, New England Patriots
6 - DL David Nugent - Out of NFL
7 - LB Casey Tisdale - Out of NFL
7 - RB Patrick Pass - Out of NFL

Take a look at that buddy. You will know why we don't have the horses right now. There are blown drafts in there.

Great post. All of the Belichick suck ups can ignore your post if they like. Those with two eyes and an open mind can see what the problem is. Belichick should pass the drafting to someone who knows what they are doing. Taking Tom Brady in the sixth round is used up. Its time to draft some players, of course there is not one player SMART enough to play under Belichick