NE/CIN observations

[patsfan-1982]

Exactly. People are confusing last couple of years Moreno with this years Moreno. We don't have a back on the roster that is playing the caliber of football that Moreno is playing THIS year.

last year Stevan Ridley had 490 yards rushing and 4 TD's through the first 5 games when you have a team like the pats had last year and like Denver has this year that can score 35 a game with a unstoppable QB teams forget about the RB. Knowshon Moreno has been in the NFL for 5 years now he is a average back as best

 

[DocHoliday]

last year Stevan Ridley had 490 yards rushing and 4 TD's through the first 5 games when you have a team like the pats had last year and like Denver has this year that can score 35 a game with a unstoppable QB teams forget about the RB. Knowshon Moreno has been in the NFL for 5 years now he is a average back as best

He's running much harder than he ever has. I wouldn't say he's the same player.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Great post. I would just say that, in terms of the offensive line, Cincy is a heavy blitzing team and the Patriots are probably the worst team against the blitz in the NFL right now. Simply put, you know when they are going to run, and you know when they are going to pass. They lack the offensive talent to do anything to make you pay for taking risks. If you think about it, the three most versatile players- Gronkowski, Hernandez, and Vereen, were all guys that could lineup and help with the running or passing game, be a short threat, mid-threat, and deep threat all at once. Because of this versatility, the Pats could take advantage of mismatches and make you pay for blitzing.

Now... well, what exactly can they do? Throw an ill-timed deep pass to a rookie? Make you pay with a four-yard slant that Amendola/Edelman catches while falling to the turf?

A good defensive coordinator will have his team pins its ears back all game, and simply use the numbers advantage of being able to send in the linebackers and safeties without having to pay the price. It is so obvious when the Patriots are throwing the ball now and none of their receivers are a threat to break anything open.

The offensive line had to face a great D-Line (maybe the best in the NFL) along with blitzes almost all game. Of course they are going to look bad.

 

[supafly]

Exactly. People are confusing last couple of years Moreno with this years Moreno. We don't have a back on the roster that is playing the caliber of football that Moreno is playing THIS year.

Hopefully Ridley can get some additional carries instead of the RBBC philosophy that we've been seeing lately when he comes back.

I just think that the old "we're definitely better at running the ball than they are" has gotten MUCH closer this year, and that a strong argument can be made that Denver is actually even more effective through the first 1/3 of the season.

The strong passing game and high powered offense are scoring at will, which is obviously opening up the run for them. I just find it difficult to agree with the notion that we're definitely better than they are in that specific area, at least so far.

Another area many fans say that we're definitely better is the offensive line. Normally I would agree with this too, but when Manning can get rid of the ball in 2 seconds or less, he's going to avoid pressure and make his offensive line look much better than ours, so it's a matter of perspective. It's going to be hard to debate that they are the better team in this area too, especially when Manning can get through most games without even getting a hand on him. That was something that we used to be able to brag about too. Not so much through the first 5 games in 2013 though.

The bottom line is that the Broncos are doing a very, very good job so far in many areas, and I think that is only fair to point that out. Others may see it differently, and that's fine, but the truth is that we're not performing up to the same rate so far through the first 1/3 of the season. The good news is that we're still 4-1, and that there is plenty of time to grow and make progress--which is normally the staple of a Belichick coached team as it proceeds throughout its schedule into the stretch run.

 

[DarrylS]

The offensive woes appear to be related to less options and less confidence in those options..

Our screen game is not respected, so a D line can just take off... there is not any creativity here.

Our TE game is non-existent, Gronk will be back, but AH really f..ed this up...

Brady is not showing any confidence in the new guys..

This is heresy, but Brady seems somewhat off and less creative than previously..

It will get better, but our expectations need to be tempered...

The Bronco's look phenomenal, but lets see how they look in January...

 

[ausbacker]

Exactly. People are confusing last couple of years Moreno with this years Moreno. We don't have a back on the roster that is playing the caliber of football that Moreno is playing THIS year.

No, that is not the case. We have two RBs. One was injured and didn't play this week. The team has used him pathetically because he fumbled in week 1. The other star in the making is on short term IR. Both are more than capable of providing what Moreno has shown this season.

I have my finger pointed at BB and JM for this headscratcher.

 

[supafly]

The other star in the making is on short term IR. Both are more than capable of providing what Moreno has shown this season.

I have my finger pointed at BB and JM for this headscratcher.

We may be having the same discussion for a 3rd year in a row regarding Shane Vereen again, as he may not even have the capacity to show enough this season when he returns in week 11. We will likely see "flashes" again, but it'd have been nice to see a full season's worth of what he can offer.

I still wish that we'd have just kept the roster spot open for the reported 3-4 wks instead of turning the 3-4 wk injury into a surefire 10 week layoff, but Belichick was just trying to take advantage of the rule and open up a roster spot.

As far as Moreno's ability goes, you could probably put one of us back there and we'd look pretty good running the ball behind some of those holes that are created in that high powered offense, so I don't think it's based on some great ability that he has or anything. I'm just pointing out that what was once considered an "up" on them has now become quite a narrowed gap, and may even point to their favor--at least it has so far this year through 5 games anyway. As you noted, that may change as the season wears on--not that it really matters that much anyway. Luckily, we don't have to match up vs DEN aside from week 12, so we can get wins in a different manner as long as they come to play in the postseason when it really matters.

 

[Fencer]

Brady is not showing any confidence in the new guys..

This is heresy, but Brady seems somewhat off and less creative than previously..

Of course Brady's decision-making is off; he has less information than he's had in most other seasons. Not only are guys new, but they're on steep learning curves (we hope), so he literally doesn't know what they'll do right or wrong any given gameday.

 

[manxman2601]

Interestingly, Alfonzo Dennard wasn't targetted once.

I noticed that during the game. Was that down to his coverage or Dalton's limited throws to WRs I wonder? Anyone know who he was covering most of the time? I presume Marvin Jones and/or Sanu.

 

[Nunchucks]

Too many drops by receivers, really that was the difference in the game. Defense played great!

 

[DarrylS]

Of course Brady's decision-making is off; he has less information than he's had in most other seasons. Not only are guys new, but they're on steep learning curves (we hope), so he literally doesn't know what they'll do right or wrong any given gameday.

My eyeball test is telling me there is more to this than an easy, obvious answer.... Brady seems really off and less creative.

We have seen him make chicken salad out of chicken shyt before, but not this year..

 

[Nunchucks]

My eyeball test is telling me there is more to this than an easy, obvious answer.... Brady seems really off and less creative.

We have seen him make chicken salad out of chicken shyt before, but not this year..

No, the easy answer is the receivers have to hold onto the ball. I've never seen a group drop more passes than this group.

 

[Halifax_Pats_Fan]

I know some people tend to blame Brady but I just don't think he has the confidence in his wideouts.

How could Brady have declined so much in a year. It's the personnel.

Yes he has made some bad decisions but I don't believe all of those mistakes are his fault. Without having any proof I could clearly be talking out of my ass...but that is just the feeling i get.

Even with the return of Gronk and the maturing of these receivers they still have to PERFORM...as does the QB.

The boys have a lot of work to do, esp. that offensive line. As 12 goes so does the NEP...no time means no points and although our defense looked good yesterday, they are still not at the point where they alone can win us games....

We are however 4-1 and we have a good test coming into our house (which I still can't believe I will be at!!!) Sunday. This will be a real litmus test as to where we are.

We are in the thick of it and that is great news as a fan...

 

[nflfan123]

New England yesterday 0 penalties for 0 yards... it's getting absolutely pathetic the level of favoritism showered on the Pats. Why is that? Well...

Robert Kraft holds all the cards with the television networks. They aren't going to let his team lose. Remember, (a) Kraft is also a board member at Viacom, CBS's parent and (b) CBS actually has an equity stake in the Patriot Place commercial mall/development. How no one in the media has ever really brought them up or focused on those conflicts never ceases to amaze me....

0 penalties for 0 yards - Cincinnati Bengals Message Boards - Forums

 

[RIpats88]

really, I put this one on the coaching staff...its easy to blame the receivers/brady...but when you are facing that Cinci defensive front you want to keep them off guard...brady had no time

they were running the ball great in the first half...but as soon as Blount fumbled it they stopped running. Its alot to ask of the offensive line when you are just telling the other teams defense "we are just going to throw it every play"...the defense knows they can just get after the QB

i've seen this before in most of the teams playoff losses...one thing goes wrong and they go away from the gameplan

 

[pencilneckgeek]

100% I'd take a team that has a reliable defense and an offense that has struggled in 2/5 games thus far with a slew of injuries to some of it's top weapons, over a team that has had a putrid defense the last 2 seasons and not proved they can stop anyone in January. As great as Manning is, he's not going to carry that team without improvement defensively and so far they're looking like the same vulnerable group. If you'd rather go into January most likely relying on a 40 year old Peyton Manning outgunning teams and putting up 30+ PPG that's fine but at the very least, insinuiating that I'm on drugs because I feel otherwise is a pretty extreme view brother.

In today's NFL, you better look for a productive offense, because even the best defenses get scored on plenty by the best offenses. Recall that Denver was one Joe Flacco prayer and a defensive lapse that even Tavon Wilson would be hard pressed to replicate away from the Superbowl last year. Nobody in the AFC has shown that they can compete with Denver yet, and their defense will be getting it's best player back in two weeks.

 

[pencilneckgeek]

I blame McDaniels and Belichick's pigheadedness for this. The Patriots need to stop ******* about and just run their best back. When Vereen is back I'd be happy to see Boldin and Blount get less than 3 touches per game each.

I'm less concerned with their depth management and running back rotation early in the year than I am with McDaniel's play-calling. I'd like to see more in-your-face aggression and a little less cleverness. Calling a play-action version of the stretch play on the second play of the game put the offensive line and Brady in an impossible position and set the tone for the day. Handing-off to Blount in the backfield instead of running the sneak was likewise ridiculous.

I'm glad to have him and Boldin around to spell Ridley and Vereen, but they are much slower to the hole than our top two backs. Blount simply take forever to get up to speed, and Bolden's decision making has been downright Maroney (yes, this is an adjective) at times. Bolden twice made ill-advised cutbacks that turned a likely 3 -yard gain into a loss and failed to turn upfield on at least one occasion on the stretch play. I hadn't considered that a shortcoming of his, but it was on full display yesterday. In the end, both backs had bad games, which contributes in large part to the abandonment of the running game.

 

[Deus Irae]

I'm less concerned with their depth management and running back rotation early in the year than I am with McDaniel's play-calling. I'd like to see more in-your-face aggression and a little less cleverness.

They don't currently seem to have the horses for this. I think Brady's making things pretty clear today, without actually saying it:

“We’ve got to start making the plays that NFL players make,” Brady said. “If we don’t, we’re going to continue to struggle and not score points and put too much pressure on our defense.

Tom Brady Unhappy With Patriots Lack of Execution on Offense, Says They Need to Start Making Plays NFL Players Make | New England Patriots | NESN.com

 

[crypto]

Now you're making excuses, as well as ignoring how the Jets and Bills games played out. The Broncos just gave up 48 points and won. The Patriot just held their opponent to 13 points, and lost.

p sure 4-1 teams with 14.0 opponent ppg have historically finished better than 5-0 teams with 27.8 opponent ppg

 

[ThatllMoveTheChains!!!]

In today's NFL, you better look for a productive offense, because even the best defenses get scored on plenty by the best offenses. Recall that Denver was one Joe Flacco prayer and a defensive lapse that even Tavon Wilson would be hard pressed to replicate away from the Superbowl last year. Nobody in the AFC has shown that they can compete with Denver yet, and their defense will be getting it's best player back in two weeks.

You also better have a defense that's able to limit an average offense to less than 40 points... Because generally those best defenses hold those best offenses to ~30pts.

It'd be hard for anyone that's not delusional to recall that since... you know they were playing in the divisional game...

They've played two AFC teams, and while the Cowboys aren't in the AFC I think most would agree they showed they can compete with the Broncos and there are better AFC teams. Their best defensive player better make a huge difference or something else better change on that defense because it's a huge concern right now.