Is Tom feeling OK?

[alamo]

Well, proof that, though some Pats fans may be intelligent, they also have some of the dumbest in the league.

The point really is that if Peyton's D had held SD to field goals instead of TD's, or if Brady's D had given up TD's instead of holding to FG's, Brady would have had a much worse choke today than Manning.

You're very right although very few on this board will acknowledge it. Brady has "choked" as much or more than Manning in the playoffs yet because he gets bailed out by his defense, he's incorrectly considered a "big game QB". I don't trust either QB very much in big games against good defenses but at least Manning has shown he can convert first downs and long passes against good defenses, unlike Brady.

You both have no clue that a "choke" is a situational name. Throwing a pick when up by 20 is, from your point of view, just as bad as throwing one when down by 7 on the final drive of the game.

But you are wrong. You can't say "if the Pats defense doesn't do the job Brady would have choked" because that situation never happened so we will never know. If called upon to come from behind to win the game, Brady has shown many times this season he is up to the task. With 9 minutes to go today with a 2 score lead the best way to win the game was to slow it down. Would they have done the same if behind? Of course not.

The FACT is this: even though last week the Indy defense had a bad week, when it came to crunch time Peyton could have won the game by making a play. And he didn't.

 

[PF1996]

You are such a complete joke. You wait for one example of Manning having better stats than Brady and then gloat about it. Too bad stats don't determine champions. Please go back under the rock you crawled out from.

One example??? Did you start watching football yesterday? Manning's career regular season numbers are far superior to Brady's and his playoff numbers are comparable, despite Manning playing with average/poor defenses that placed additional pressure on the offense to score. Pressure that Brady never faced until last year when he choked up the joint in SD and Indy.


The fact is that you cannot dispute anything I've written so like the homer you are, you pull out your 2nd grade rants. Amusing, although sadly predictable.

yeah, Rivers really lit it up, troll...SD scored 12 points!!! Way to really show Brady!!! Yeah! Brady's gone to 4 Bowls in 7 years...MAJOR CHOKE ARTIST!!! Good thing the team carried him!!!

Now tell the attendant you need your Haldol, stat...

Hmmm...when did Rivers become the "best ever QB"? When did I compare Brady to Rivers except to note that Rivers had no trouble completing passes to receivers so obviously the weather was NOT A FACTOR in Brady's choking.

Despite Rivers facing a better defense than the Chargers, despite Rivers being injured, despite Rivers being without his top two weapons, he was still able to march the Chargers up and down the field, unlike Brady who was not injured, or missing any of his offensive weapons.

The fact is that Brady is as much (if not more) of a "choker" as Manning and both the "eye test" as well as the stats support this fact. The fact that Brady has been to 4 SBs in 7 years is a tribute to Belichick and the Pats D. The fact that the Pats have not been to 6 SBs in 7 years is a result of Brady's choking in Denver and Indy.

 

[maverick4]

Manning's career regular season numbers are far superior to Brady's and his playoff numbers are comparable, despite Manning playing with average/poor defenses that placed additional pressure on the offense to score.

Actually they're not even close.
Look them up you moron, Manning throws almost as many interceptions as TD's in the playoffs, while Brady has nearly a 2 to 1 ratio all time in playoff games.

You also conveniently forget to mention that these stats are with Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Clark, Edge/Addai, while Brady played mostly with smurf receivers who have done nothing since they left New England. Branch and Givens, Caldwell and Gaffney, are you kidding me?

As for the 'pressure because of bad defense' argument, you're basically saying Peyton Manning can't handle pressure! Also, the Colts had solid defense last year but Manning still laid an egg during the entire playoffs, if they didn't play the Bears and if Rex Grossman hadn't basically handed over the game, Manning would have choked again!!

 

[PF1996]

You both have no clue that a "choke" is a situational name. Throwing a pick when up by 20 is, from your point of view, just as bad as throwing one when down by 7 on the final drive of the game.

But you are wrong. You can't say "if the Pats defense doesn't do the job Brady would have choked" because that situation never happened so we will never know. If called upon to come from behind to win the game, Brady has shown many times this season he is up to the task. With 9 minutes to go today with a 2 score lead the best way to win the game was to slow it down. Would they have done the same if behind? Of course not.

The FACT is this: even though last week the Indy defense had a bad week, when it came to crunch time Peyton could have won the game by making a play. And he didn't.

WAy to build a strawman to tear down. Hope you had fun because at no point did I state that "throwing a pick when up by 20 is the same as throwing a pick when down by 7". Not one of the examples that I provided of Brady's choking occurred when the Pats were up by 20. Nice try though. Actually, not really.

Let's start with RECENT HISTORY.

YESTERDAY, with his team up by 2 POINTS with an opportunity to increase that lead to at least 5 points, Brady THREW AN INT directly into the defender. It wasn't a great play by the defender, it was a HORRIBLE THROW/DECISION by Brady. He "choked" and the Pats D bailed him out by forcing SD to punt.

The fact is that last year, even though the defense struggled in the second half, that Brady had a chance to make a play to win the game and he DIDN'T. In fact, the "play" he had to make was simply to throw to an open receiver for a FIRST DOWN, NOT A SCORE. He didn't.

Peyton DID make a play to win the game. He threw a catchable ball to Reggie Wayne, which was dropped. He also threw a catchable ball to DAllas Clark, which would have gone for a TD had Clark actually caught the ball. Peyton made the plays as a QB but his receivers let him down. Brady threw inaccurately for most of the day but his receivers and the D bailed him out. Ironic that the QB making the plays is labelled a "choker" because his receivers couldn't hang on to the balls but the QB who didn't make the plays but is bailed out by his teammates is called a "big game QB".

 

[maverick4]

Since PF1996 is a tool who will never face the facts, here they are for all to see.

Peyton Manning's lifetime playoff stats throwing to Marvin Harrison, Wayne, Clark, and Edge/Addai:
21 TD's, 17 INT

Tom Brady's lifetime playoff stats throwing mostly to David Givens, David Patten, Deion Branch, Reche Caldwell, and Jabar Gaffney:
25 TD's, 12 INT

 

[PatsFan24]

WAy to build a strawman to tear down. Hope you had fun because at no point did I state that "throwing a pick when up by 20 is the same as throwing a pick when down by 7". Not one of the examples that I provided of Brady's choking occurred when the Pats were up by 20. Nice try though. Actually, not really.

Let's start with RECENT HISTORY.

YESTERDAY, with his team up by 2 POINTS with an opportunity to increase that lead to at least 5 points, Brady THREW AN INT directly into the defender. It wasn't a great play by the defender, it was a HORRIBLE THROW/DECISION by Brady. He "choked" and the Pats D bailed him out by forcing SD to punt.

The fact is that last year, even though the defense struggled in the second half, that Brady had a chance to make a play to win the game and he DIDN'T. In fact, the "play" he had to make was simply to throw to an open receiver for a FIRST DOWN, NOT A SCORE. He didn't.

Peyton DID make a play to win the game. He threw a catchable ball to Reggie Wayne, which was dropped. He also threw a catchable ball to DAllas Clark, which would have gone for a TD had Clark actually caught the ball. Peyton made the plays as a QB but his receivers let him down. Brady threw inaccurately for most of the day but his receivers and the D bailed him out. Ironic that the QB making the plays is labelled a "choker" because his receivers couldn't hang on to the balls but the QB who didn't make the plays but is bailed out by his teammates is called a "big game QB".

yeah, you are right. all those big games brady has played so well in dont matter, it is only because he had a few picks today. in two games against the chargers brady had 4 picks, manning had 8. last week against a great D brady had the best comp % by a qb ever in the postseason. let me know when manning does that against a good D.

 

[PatsFan24]

btw this is the stuff indy fans use to post about because they know the patriots are a better team and can't make an argument to spin that.

 

[Joker]

The fact that the Pats have not been to 6 SBs in 7 years is a result of Brady's choking in Denver and Indy.

The Pats go to six bowls in seven years and they'd fold the league...since the salary cap was instituted this is supposed to be a wide open league...Brady's excellence has helped overcome that. In Denver the Pats were jobbed by the officials, something you CAN'T acknowledge since Peytie and the boys get EVERY FREAKIN' CALL imaginable at home. Do I have to remind you, troll, that NE was penalized for THE MOST YARDS IN TEAM history earlier this season...BY THE END OF THE 3RD QUARTER!...in YOUR own Peytie Private Playpen, buttressed by YOUR GM and his FOUR STRAIGHT YEARS of changing rules to SUIT HIS QB and offense.

I like that you're so bitter and enraged that you wait until late night early morning and 3 am to unleash your torrent of idiocy...we were waiting for you....enjoy the rest of the post season and remember...your Colts were lucky to even ever win ONE championship in the Patriot era...say hi to the Ravens, chump.

 

[oldskool138]

i think he looks sick.. i bet he has the flu..

You did notice that Matt Light had shaved his beard off. I think those long beards become traps for germs esp. in the winter.

Okay Pats, everybody get the flu this week so you don't have to deal with it next week.

IMO, Brady was "responsible" for 1.5 of the INT's. The first was an awesome play by the CB. The second was was .5 Brady's fault. And the last was all him (that was one of the worst one's I've ever seen him throw. He throws that away and the Pats get three points. Brady needs to remember this down in the red zone with a lead. I don't know what happened to him there.)

They won so I can't complain.

 

[PF1996]

yeah, you are right. all those big games brady has played so well in dont matter, it is only because he had a few picks today. in two games against the chargers brady had 4 picks, manning had 8. last week against a great D brady had the best comp % by a qb ever in the postseason. let me know when manning does that against a good D.

Brady has played well in 5 "big games". The 2003 Carolina game where he was good, the 2004 playoffs where he was consistently excellent and the 2007 Jags playoff game where he was also excellent.

He was decidedly average in 2001 and 2003, excluding the SB. He mostly stunk up the joint in 2005 & 2006 and again in the 2007 SD game (otherwise known as choking). Such inconsistency isn't exactly what I would expect from a "big game QB".

Brady's stat against Jack: 26/28, 262, 3/0,
Jacksonville's defensive stats:
pypg: 213.5 (15th), ypa: 6.74 (13th), compl.%: 58.7 (7th), QB rat: 76.1 (7th)

Mannings stats against Denver: 22/26, 377, 84.6%, 14.50 ypa, 5/0

Denver's defensive stats:

pypg: 176.8 (6th), ypa: 6.16 (9th), compl.%: 53.5 (3rd), QB rat: 76.2 (12th)

I'll summarize for you - Manning had two more incompletions, over a 100 more yards and 2 more touchdowns against a much better defense than Brady faced in Jacksonville.

Any other performances against "good defenses" you would like to compare? How about we compare the results of the Baltimore games this year.

The fact that the Pats have not been to 6 SBs in 7 years is a result of Brady's choking in Denver and Indy.

The Pats go to six bowls in seven years and they'd fold the league...since the salary cap was instituted this is supposed to be a wide open league...Brady's excellence has helped overcome that. In Denver the Pats were jobbed by the officials, something you CAN'T acknowledge since Peytie and the boys get EVERY FREAKIN' CALL imaginable at home. Do I have to remind you, troll, that NE was penalized for THE MOST YARDS IN TEAM history earlier this season...BY THE END OF THE 3RD QUARTER!...in YOUR own Peytie Private Playpen, buttressed by YOUR GM and his FOUR STRAIGHT YEARS of changing rules to SUIT HIS QB and offense.

I like that you're so bitter and enraged that you wait until late night early morning and 3 am to unleash your torrent of idiocy...we were waiting for you....enjoy the rest of the post season and remember...your Colts were lucky to even ever win ONE championship in the Patriot era...say hi to the Ravens, chump.

I'll accept your white flag. No need for you to search for any more homer excuses.

 

[oldskool138]

Any other performances against "good defenses" you would like to compare? How about we compare the results of the Baltimore games this year.

Those guys that play against Brady get paid too. Some players are good at reading Brady some aren't.

Granted, last night Brady had a horrible game but the D bailed him out...but that's what your D is supposed to do.

 

[PatsFan24]

you failed to mention bradys game in super bowl 36, when he lead one of the best drives in NFL history to get MVP in his first year as a starter. you failed to mention played well in the jets game in 2006, and the jags game in 2005. you also failed to defend mannings performances when he was unable to generate many points in the playoff losses the colts have suffered, such as the jets game, the two in new england, and the steelers game. manning last year had 3 tds and 7 ints in the postseason. while you comapre the ravens games, then take a look at the two regular season games in 2007 (since you wanted to compare those) when these qbs faced the chargers. brady has never had 6 ints in a game EVER

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

Brady only threw 11 incompletions, even John Tommose, says he could have been fighting off the flu.. He did not look right in the celebration pics either, he looks sluggish... I know the Chargers played a good defense, but I think he was sick ..

 

[BritPat]

Brady only threw 11 incompletions, even John Tommose, says he could have been fighting off the flu.. He did not look right in the celebration pics either, he looks sluggish... I know the Chargers played a good defense, but I think he was sick ..

Not sure about sick, but there was definitely something wrong with him IMO.

I'm just watching the game again, and quite a few of his passes were sloppy and badly thrown. The one he threw to Moss in the 3rd quarter is probably the best evidence, it was really loose, not the normal tight spiral he throws.

Nothing to worry about though.

 

[FrontSeven]

fighting off the flu.. He did not look right in the celebration pics either, ..

I almost didn't recognize the kid. He was not well. His face was ashen.

 

[ChoWZa]

The sky is falling.

 

[blackglass3]

Brady has played well in 5 "big games". The 2003 Carolina game where he was good, the 2004 playoffs where he was consistently excellent and the 2007 Jags playoff game where he was also excellent.

He was decidedly average in 2001 and 2003, excluding the SB. He mostly stunk up the joint in 2005 & 2006 and again in the 2007 SD game (otherwise known as choking). Such inconsistency isn't exactly what I would expect from a "big game QB".

Brady's stat against Jack: 26/28, 262, 3/0,
Jacksonville's defensive stats:
pypg: 213.5 (15th), ypa: 6.74 (13th), compl.%: 58.7 (7th), QB rat: 76.1 (7th)

Mannings stats against Denver: 22/26, 377, 84.6%, 14.50 ypa, 5/0

Denver's defensive stats:

pypg: 176.8 (6th), ypa: 6.16 (9th), compl.%: 53.5 (3rd), QB rat: 76.2 (12th)

I'll summarize for you - Manning had two more incompletions, over a 100 more yards and 2 more touchdowns against a much better defense than Brady faced in Jacksonville.

Any other performances against "good defenses" you would like to compare? How about we compare the results of the Baltimore games this year.




I'll accept your white flag. No need for you to search for any more homer excuses.

You're right, Brady does suck...how did Marc Bulger do this year? He lead his team to 18-0 and won the MVP award, right?

I would kill myself if I was as negative as you. Please stop being a fan of our team.

 

[aluminum seats]

Wow, 10 pages and counting. I do agree he seemed off, though, be it sickness or whatever. I also think that he might finally be getting worn down by the pressure of perfection--of course he's been magnificient, but it doesn't mean he's not human. This has been a LONG haul......if they pull it off, the emotional release is going to be off-the-charts.

Having said that, imagine future playoff games after this season--this QB & team will be essentially immune to pressure. "What, the Super Bowl? This is nothing....."

 

[fourthandmiles]

Well, you can continue to live in fantasy land.

That we are. 18-0. I still can't beleive it. Am I dreaming?

 

[Pats_AZ]

One example??? Did you start watching football yesterday? Manning's career regular season numbers are far superior to Brady's and his playoff numbers are comparable, despite Manning playing with average/poor defenses that placed additional pressure on the offense to score. Pressure that Brady never faced until last year when he choked up the joint in SD and Indy.


The fact is that you cannot dispute anything I've written so like the homer you are, you pull out your 2nd grade rants. Amusing, although sadly predictable.





Hmmm...when did Rivers become the "best ever QB"? When did I compare Brady to Rivers except to note that Rivers had no trouble completing passes to receivers so obviously the weather was NOT A FACTOR in Brady's choking.

Despite Rivers facing a better defense than the Chargers, despite Rivers being injured, despite Rivers being without his top two weapons, he was still able to march the Chargers up and down the field, unlike Brady who was not injured, or missing any of his offensive weapons.

The fact is that Brady is as much (if not more) of a "choker" as Manning and both the "eye test" as well as the stats support this fact. The fact that Brady has been to 4 SBs in 7 years is a tribute to Belichick and the Pats D. The fact that the Pats have not been to 6 SBs in 7 years is a result of Brady's choking in Denver and Indy.

You mentioned in another post that "if" peyton had the Pats D he would have won.....I thought Indy had the "far better defense"? that's what the stats say no?

I thought Addai was a great running back...Moroney and the Pats run game....i thought the experts said that the Pats had no run game?

Tom brady chokes more than manning? 50 tds and 8 ints. manning hopes he could choke that good!!

Passing the "EYE TEST"? my tells me that Brady and the Pats have 3 SB trophys up to this point and Manning and the Dolts have 1. i believe everyday 3 is always greater than 1. Tom brady owns the TD record with 50 8 ints....Peyton in 04 49 tds and 10 pics. my eyes tell me that here to Brady is better. stop posting junk and be honest and you won't get flamed. if you DO hoestly think what your writing is true than i would reccomend that you check yourself in voluntarily to a clinic and get your head checked.