* 2012 Draft Defensive Ends *

[captain stone]

Great work as always, OTG. One suggestion, if possible: at the end of each player's eval,
could you add a line describing that player's ability - or lack thereof - to fit into whatever
scheme Bill plans on using in 2012?

When taking the best fit for the NEP into consideration, whom would you have chosen at 62
of the mock draft game thread: Cam Johnson, Jake Bequette, Billy Winn or Tyrone Crawford?
(If you could only choose 1 of those 4, of course. Barron, Still & McClellin were the first 3 picks.)

 

[Leemo]

Re: From http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2012-nfl-mock-draft

6. New England Patriots (via St. Louis – Projected)
Quinton Coples, DE, North Carolina (Scouting Report)
When Bill Belichick wants a guy, he gets his guy – be that by trading down or trading up. In this case, Belichick finally cashes in his two first round picks for a guy that can play nearly every position in both odd and even fronts: 5-tech, 4-3 DE, 4-3 DT, 3-4 OLB, Elephant LB. Trading the #27 and #31 comes up a bit light on the trade value chart, but St. Louis seems very interested in trading down again.


NE PAtriots draft Would this make everyone Happy or what????--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd be distraught.

 

[Off The Grid]

Great work as always, OTG.

One suggestion, if possible: at the end of each player's eval,
could you add a line describing that player's ability - or lack thereof - to fit into whatever
scheme Bill plans on using in 2012?

GOD, no!!

Sorry to disappoint, Brother Stone, but this process is consuming ENOUGH.

I can't IMAGINE how much Blood + Treasure it would cost me to go through every one of those guys and try to apply them towards whatever I GUESS Mad Bill's up to, next year!!

I've got enough on my plate as it is.

However, I've already been planning ~ next week, I think ~ to go through and boil down my own opinion of best fits and values for us, after I've worked my way though the pile I currently face.

After that, I'll try my hand at a fresh Mock, I reckon.

I should stress, however, that that's pure speculation: anyone who follows this team knows that a "base" Defense is a dubious term around here. Therefore, speculating who might fit becomes...interesting!!

And thanks for your kind words, Bro.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Re: From http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2012-nfl-mock-draft

6. New England Patriots (via St. Louis – Projected)
Quinton Coples, DE, North Carolina (Scouting Report)
When Bill Belichick wants a guy, he gets his guy – be that by trading down or trading up. In this case, Belichick finally cashes in his two first round picks for a guy that can play nearly every position in both odd and even fronts: 5-tech, 4-3 DE, 4-3 DT, 3-4 OLB, Elephant LB. Trading the #27 and #31 comes up a bit light on the trade value chart, but St. Louis seems very interested in trading down again.


NE PAtriots draft Would this make everyone Happy or what????--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is a very interesting trade possibility.

First it very clearly fills a long existing hole,if you consider Coples an elephant backer.

Second when motivated Coples is clearly the best senior in this draft.

And I agree with you 100%, St. Louis would probably be willing to take a little less than the trade value chart to get out of the #6 hole.

 

[manxman2601]

Re: From http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2012-nfl-mock-draft

This is a very interesting trade possibility.

First it very clearly fills a long existing hole,if you consider Coples an elephant backer.

Second when motivated Coples is clearly the best senior in this draft.

And I agree with you 100%, St. Louis would probably be willing to take a little less than the trade value chart to get out of the #6 hole.

I think the Jags might be the better bet to trade down as per the proposed trade. The Rams are rebuilding and with their amount of first rounders over the next few years aren't in need of extra picks, they just need to maximise the picks they need. for the Jags, their no 7 spot and their desire to draft high character guys doesn't lend itself to #7 (can see Coples and Floyd not being on their board). However, @27 and 31, they get first shot at the second tier pass rushers and WR's. Rueben Randle, Andre Branch plus their own second rounder would be a very nice haul for them I'd think.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Re: From http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2012-nfl-mock-draft

This is a very interesting trade possibility.

First it very clearly fills a long existing hole,if you consider Coples an elephant backer.

Second when motivated Coples is clearly the best senior in this draft.

And I agree with you 100%, St. Louis would probably be willing to take a little less than the trade value chart to get out of the #6 hole.

I'm lukewarm on the guy. Physical specimen with skills who almost seems like a project in many ways. Dominating to digressing one Saturday to the next. For a top 10 pick he has a lot of learning to do about hand placement,snap counts and will probably be eaten up at the pro level until he learns some of the basics.

Measureables are fantastic. Versatility is there though he seems to play the 5 better than the 1 or 3 naturally. Personally I think he is more of a 10-15 guy myself. Every college player is a project in a sense but I think we may be better served taking a chance with a SMALL move up on Cox, Brockers or Still. And then going with a LB like McClellin in the 2nd for a better overall front 7. They are all projects but I'd feel better about not mortgaging multiple 1st and 2nd round draft picks for guys who have question marks.

I'll reiterate. The only instant impact players worth moving into the top 10 imo are Luck,RG3,Claiborne and Richardson. They are the 4 blue chippers that project as top 5 talent. No one else in this draft passes the eye test better and I'd be ok with the latter two considering who are QB is.

 

[ATippett56]

NFL Draft Scout Rankings, From Prep to Pro Coverage - Powered by the Sports Xchange

 

[ATippett56]

Vinny Curry

Vinny Curry | Marshall, DE : 2012 NFL Draft Scout Player Profile

 

[SeymourTrophies]

I'm starting to like Mercilus with the more I see of him. He's a pass-rusher first, no doubt, but he's actually respectable against the run and even with less core strength than the ideal, he will square up with lineman and hold his ground more than some give him credit for. The nice moves and the obvious burst are just a bonus.

Then there's Upshaw, who won't last to us anyway...

 

[Snake Eyes]

I'm starting to like Mercilus with the more I see of him. He's a pass-rusher first, no doubt, but he's actually respectable against the run and even with less core strength than the ideal, he will square up with lineman and hold his ground more than some give him credit for. The nice moves and the obvious burst are just a bonus.

Then there's Upshaw, who won't last to us anyway...

I'll have to look at more footage of him. The good thing is that core strength can be developed.

 

[Patriot Missile]

I'm starting to like Mercilus with the more I see of him. He's a pass-rusher first, no doubt, but he's actually respectable against the run and even with less core strength than the ideal, he will square up with lineman and hold his ground more than some give him credit for. The nice moves and the obvious burst are just a bonus.

Then there's Upshaw, who won't last to us anyway...

I'm fine with Mercilus if BB is. Used to think his size would be an issue as a DE but then you look at Andre Carter and you have to throw that out the window. Mercilus is actually carrying more weight, albeit Carter is a chiseled specimen with no body fat. Mer-cy-lus with some time could very well play 4-3 end with more teaching from a great vet like Carter. LB would probably take a couple of seasons imo.

I love what the coaches are saying about how hard he works and was surprised to find out his defensive coordinator was Vic Koenning. He also coached Demarcus Ware at Troy btw.

Every player is a crap shoot but in some ways his stat sheet reminds of Osi Umenyiora. And the guy does have one hell of a tomahawk chop from the edge. I'm not sure if his initial burst is a enough to really get after the QB at an elite level at the next level but he can cover sideline to sideline in a hurry.

Again picking 27th is against us. It almost seems that any player we really like seem out of range without a trade up. Whether it be Brockers, Still, Ingram, Cox etc. This draft is just not deep enough at other positions to make the cards fall right for us through the looking glass. I'm sure someone will fall but are you willing to take that chance?

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I'm fine with Mercilus if BB is. Used to think his size would be an issue as a DE but then you look at Andre Carter and you have to throw that out the window. Mercilus is actually carrying more weight, albeit Carter is a chiseled specimen with no body fat. Mer-cy-lus with some time could very well play 4-3 end with more teaching from a great vet like Carter. LB would probably take a couple of seasons imo.

I love what the coaches are saying about how hard he works and was surprised to find out his defensive coordinator was Vic Koenning. He also coached Demarcus Ware at Troy btw.

Every player is a crap shoot but in some ways his stat sheet reminds of Osi Umenyiora. And the guy does have one hell of a tomahawk chop from the edge. I'm not sure if his initial burst is a enough to really get after the QB at an elite level at the next level but he can cover sideline to sideline in a hurry.

Again picking 27th is against us. It almost seems that any player we really like seem out of range without a trade up. Whether it be Brockers, Still, Ingram, Cox etc. This draft is just not deep enough at other positions to make the cards fall right for us through the looking glass. I'm sure someone will fall but are you willing to take that chance?

The Illinois defense played a very aggressive scheme and I am not so sure how that translate to a BB read and react defense. Mercilous is not sudden off the edge and he may need another pass rush move or two other than the chop.

If we are playing Denver and Denver has the ball at our 40 yard line and it is 3rd and 8, who has the better chance of screaming off the edge with his hair on fire and sacking Manning or forcing Manning to throw the ball away, Mercilous or Irvin? Which one of them could make Manning change the protection scheme just by being lined up on the LOS?

For a situational pass rusher, I go for the most sudden player everytime.

 

[Patriot Missile]

The Illinois defense played a very aggressive scheme and I am not so sure how that translate to a BB read and react defense. Mercilous is not sudden off the edge and he may need another pass rush move or two other than the chop.

If we are playing Denver and Denver has the ball at our 40 yard line and it is 3rd and 8, who has the better chance of screaming off the edge with his hair on fire and sacking Manning or forcing Manning to throw the ball away, Mercilous or Irvin? Which one of them could make Manning change the protection scheme just by being lined up on the LOS?

For a situational pass rusher, I go for the most sudden player everytime.

Not too many sudden players in this draft as far as explosiveness off the line of scrimmage. So I guess they are going to just have to get lucky and hope one pans out if that's what they are looking for.

 

[Off The Grid]

My Short List

Two things about Defensive Ends...

1 ~ Like their counterpart Offensive Tackles, Defensive Ends are the athletic Grizzlies ~ and in the case of classic "43" Schemes, not really Grizzlies at all!! ~ so Lateral Agility is every bit as important for success as is Core Strength.

2 ~ There are really two kinds of Defensive Ends, aren't there? The Classic "43" type, who tend to be smaller and faster, and can almost universally at least be considered for Flanker duty ~ that's "OutSide LineBacker", Earthllings!! ~ and the larger "34" Defensive Ends...Of course, the latter are often D Tackle Convertibles.

Indeed, there is no hard and fast rule, as the lines between "positions" often get murky or even overlap...

But I figure "What the Hell??" ~ most players have multiple roles at the next level, anyway!!

What I'm doing here is attempting to make things easier to navigate, by separating the "43" Ends from the "34" Ends...Of course, I could break it down further ~ as I did, last year ~ or even create additional categories for players such as Mel Ingram, who has potential as Under Tackle, Defensive End, and Flanker!! Hah!! Or I could really break things down by "43" and "34" here and elsewhere...I'm not sure that'd be much help, though!! Enjoy!!

***

Super Sized "34" Defensive Ends

Dominique Hamilton ~ 6.5/312 ~ UFA ~ 3rd-4th

Potential Starter!! Dominique Hamilton projects unremarkable Core Strength, playing at Tackle as he does with Mizzou, but he displays an impressive Coil and Core Flexibility, and I have a strong feeling that he'd look far more effective ~ considering his height, which is a great disadvantage in the interior ~ if he moved out to Defensive End at the next level.

And he commands an impressive level of Athleticism.

Hamilton gets excellent reviews for his Work Ethic as well, and I believe that all he needs is the Opportunity at the next level, and he will very likely develop into a stalwart starting Defensive End!! Sleeper!!


Defensive End / Flanker Convertibles

Cam Johnson ~ 6.3/267 ~ 3rd-4th ~ 2nd-3rd

Starter!! Cam Johnson isn't particularly dynamic in any aspect of the game, but he really has no weaknesses to speak of, either, and both the raw Core Strength and Athleticism, combined with impressive levels of both Savvy and Work Ethic, are there to become a stalwart starter at the next level.

And of all potential Flanker Convertibles, he showed very impressive Verticity when asked to Turn + Burn!!

Cam Johnson is my kind of Prospect: Under the Radar and not especially flashy, and will certainly need work, but with tremendous Savvy, Work Ethic, Attention to Detail, and underrated athleticism!! Deal!!

Scott Smith ~ 6.6/261 ~ UFA ~ 4th-5th

Potential Starter!! Scott Smith is raw as hell, and has been walloped with a Year Long suspension in the past.

That cut his Texas Tech career in half, as he is also a JuCo Transfer. As a result, while he has been explosive in the two seasonal segments he's played in, he is flying miles under the radar, and with "Character" concerns.

But he commands an outstanding Burst off the Snap, excellent Core Flexibility ~ albeit raw Core Strength, at this point ~ and absolutely tremendous Work Ethic.

I get the distinct impression that we're looking at a Past that shows Bad Judgment, not Bad Character.

He's also a former BasketBall standout, which speaks volumes about his Athleticism. Cross Training, baby!!

To be sure, he's a Boom or Bust Prospect, but that's tremendous Value for...nothing!! Sleeper!!

Props to National FootBall Post's Wes Bunting for his discovering yet another deeply buried gem!!

Notes

1 ~ Needless to say, I don't say ANY direct "34" Defensive End conversions from College to the Patriots Scheme, as Dominique Hamilton ~ who I like very much!! ~ is actually a Defensive Tackle Convertible who I had to drag over here from the D Tackles, due to the 10000 unit limit on Posts!!

2 ~ Cam Johnson is a guy I really like ~ a guy Brother Manx first brought up, if memory serves ~ and reminds me of a more athletic version of Rob Ninkovich ~ a true Scrapper who command surprising Verticity in Pass Coverage!!

3 ~ Scotty Smith is a SERIOUS Dark Horse, and is Red Flagged...But I LOVE this kid!!

 

[Snake Eyes]

2 ~ Cam Johnson is a guy I really like ~ a guy Brother Manx first brought up, if memory serves ~ and reminds me of a more athletic version of Rob Ninkovich ~ a true Scrapper who command surprising Verticity in Pass Coverage!!

People won't be able to process this, can't you think of a black guy to compare him to?

 

[State]

Although he may be called a one-year wonder, no one can doubt Mercilus's toughness.

I just uncovered this nugget of information: Mercilus acted like it was no big deal when his index finger was severed in a weight room accident.

*Whitney Mercilus*|*Illinois,*OLB*:*2012 NFL Draft Scout Player Profile
Read entry "3/18/12"

He not all that sudden as Ochmed says, but I like his upbringing--hardworking Haitian parents in Akron, Ohio--and his toughness was on display.

 

[Off The Grid]

Although he may be called a one-year wonder, no one can doubt Mercilus's toughness.

I just uncovered this nugget of information:

Mercilus acted like it was no big deal when his index finger was severed in a weight room accident.

*Whitney Mercilus*|*Illinois,*OLB*:*2012 NFL Draft Scout Player Profile
Read entry "3/18/12"

He not all that sudden as Ochmed says, but I like his upbringing--hardworking Haitian parents in Akron, Ohio--and his toughness was on display.

Well, I'd be lying if I didn't say that bumped'm up a notch in my book, as well.

Great Nugget, Brother State.

 

[cstjohn17]

I tried to find the video with no luck... Coples was on the set of NFL Live with Bruschi and Marcellus Wiley and man oh man. That kid is big.

I know he has a high bust factor, blah, blah, blah but the dude is huge. Made Bruschi look like a first grader and towered over Wiley.