Pats draft Darren McFadden

[MetalBleachers]

All the more reason to take a player like McFadden.

Here are the stats of another prolific RB out of Arkansas. Averaged over 5 ypc and accumulated 2,350 yards in his career: http://web1.ncaa.org/d1mfb/playerDetail.jsp?yr=2003&org=31&player=4

His name? Cedric Cobbs.
I don't have a ton of faith in Arkansas' offense (see their former QB trying to figure out Jacksonville's O as a WR). I've never seen McFadden make a solid blitz pickup. Yes, he's a great college RB, as was Cobbs, as was Ron Dayne and Ricky Williams.

New England won two of three SBs with Antawain Smith. They have a very good RB in Maroney, a great backup in Sammy Morris and the prototypical third down back in Faulk, with Evans and Eckel to pick up short yardage.

They won't draft McFadden. They need athletic linebackers and cover CBs. They'll draft a sixth- or seventh-round RB (or UDFA) like Justise Hairston last year and try to fit him onto the PS. Look for Xavier Omon of NW Missouri State or Jalen Parmele of Toledo.

All this said, they'll probably go out and draft Cal's Justin Forsett in the third.

 

[iapatsfan]

No, because obviously the need for a running back is not there when there are higher priorities, especially cornerback and linebacker. Your disdain for Maroney is illogical.

I don't have disdain for Maroney. I think he's a decent RB. He was getting outplayed by a veteran FA RB before got hurt however. I just feel the opportunity to get a player like McFadden is too much to pass up, especially if Maroney can bring us enough value to fill our defensive holes.

 

[ATippett56]

Moss alone will be a 6M cap hit, most likely. "But it can be signing bonus"...uhhh his deal would likely be 3-4 years, so 1/3 to 1/4 of the signing bonus and the salary would hit. It's likely to be an incentive laden contract and the incentives would be categorized as likely to be earned, I'd guess.

The salary cap hit for Randy Moss will probably be closer to $7.5 million, possibly $8 million if he keeps up this current pace. Remember, Randy Moss produced big time against the Indianapolis Colts not Donte Stallworth. During the fourth quarter against the Colts, Randy Moss was Brady's first option not Donte Stallworth.

 

[iapatsfan]

why would the pats trade with denver and help them out???

How are we helping them out by trading them an often injured 12-15 carry / game RB for a 1st or 2nd round pick? Are you telling me you would fear facing a Broncos team with Maroney at RB? Are you serious? I'm sure he'd make all the difference in the game with his 12-15 carries. Of course he would have to dress for the game and not be on the sideline in street clothes.

 

[ATippett56]

I don't have disdain for Maroney. I think he's a decent RB. He was getting outplayed by a veteran FA RB before got hurt however. I just feel the opportunity to get a player like McFadden is too much to pass up, especially if Maroney can bring us enough value to fill our defensive holes.

Who cares? The Patriots have one of the most prolific offenses in NFL history with Maroney and Faulk at the running back position. The Patriots defensive needs next season far outweigh any incremental offensive improvements the Patriots may gain by drafting another running back.

 

[ATippett56]

How are we helping them out by trading them an often injured 12-15 carry / game RB for a 1st or 2nd round pick? Are you telling me you would fear facing a Broncos team with Maroney at RB? Are you serious? I'm sure he'd make all the difference in the game with his 12-15 carries. Of course he would have to dress for the game and not be on the sideline in street clothes.

You were probably showing the door to Willie McGinest earlier in his career, as well.

 

[nowayback]

pats wont pay for a low 1st round pick, too risky to tie up so much money. unless there was someone like l. taylor. they will trade down.

15 and after. first good db's and lb's as listed by scouts inc are supposed to go at around 11.

http://sports-ak.espn.go.com/nfl/draft08/index

looks like there are many with good ratings...esp compared to 2007. maybe someone like jenkins cb at 11.
who knows what BB thinks though??

 

[iapatsfan]

Who cares? The Patriots have one of the most prolific offenses in NFL history with Maroney and Faulk at the running back position. The Patriots defensive needs next season far outweigh any incremental offensive improvements the Patriots may gain by drafting another running back.

I agree with your assessment of our offense as it currently stands. However, I think you would agree that as the weather worsens, we are going to have to rely a lot more on our running game. Do you really think Maroney can get the job done? Why do you think the last 2 QB's to hold the passing TD record have come from Miami and Indy? The weather is not a factor for most of their games. Brady is not going to break the pasing TD record only because his Nov. and Dec. home games are going to be played in weather better suited for the running game.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Sorry but comparing Cobbs to McFadden is a total joke. Cobbs was a 4th round selection and nowhere near as highly regarded as McFadden this year. Hell some scouts feel that Mcfadden may be more talented than Adrian Peterson who just romped for an NFL record 296 yards this past week.

The evidence is pretty clear when you look at who and where RBs were taken in the draft (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfldraft/draft04/tracker/round?round=1). Which running backs were drafted ahead of Cobbs in 2004? Steven Jackson, Kevin Jones, Tatum Bell, Julius Jones, and Greg Jones in the 1st and 2nd rounds. No RBs were selected in the 3rd round, Mewelde Moore was ahead of him in round 4, and Cobbs was the 32nd, and dead last pick of the 4th round. McFadden meanwhile projects to be a top 5 overall pick in the 2008 draft, a top 10 at the very worst.

If scouts thought Cobbs was any good in a shallow draft for runningbacks do you think he would have lasted until the very last pick of the 4th round?? This is the worst comparison I've heard in years. Next thing you'll be comparing Antowain Smith to Adrian Peterson... or Maroney to Landanian Tomlinson. And FYI Evans and Eckel are scrubs. Evans only grades better than Patrick Pass imo because he doesn't fumble the ball every time he takes a good hit. Neither of these guys are even close to Dillon's ability to punch the ball into the endzone in goal line situations.

Here are the stats of another prolific RB out of Arkansas. Averaged over 5 ypc and accumulated 2,350 yards in his career: http://web1.ncaa.org/d1mfb/playerDetail.jsp?yr=2003&org=31&player=4

His name? Cedric Cobbs.
I don't have a ton of faith in Arkansas' offense (see their former QB trying to figure out Jacksonville's O as a WR). I've never seen McFadden make a solid blitz pickup. Yes, he's a great college RB, as was Cobbs, as was Ron Dayne and Ricky Williams.

New England won two of three SBs with Antawain Smith. They have a very good RB in Maroney, a great backup in Sammy Morris and the prototypical third down back in Faulk, with Evans and Eckel to pick up short yardage.

 

[patriotsdynasty12189]

Cowboys really like McFadden and have 1 first rounder. Trade our 1st rounder for both of their 1st rounders and one of their young linebackers.

 

[ATippett56]

Do you really think Maroney can get the job done?

Yes for two reasons. First, Maroney does not return kickoffs this season. Thus, Maroney is less likely to be injured this season than last. Two, the Patriots were moving the ball effectively in the first half against the Colts when Laurence Maroney was established in the ground game. Josh McDaniels, for some unknown reason, abandoned the running game with Laurence Maroney on third offensive drive of the game (with 2:47 left in the first half) and subsequently the Patriots offense ground to a halt.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playb...ayPage=tab_play_by_play&season=2007&week=REG9

 

[carolinatony]

Defense.
We need to draft Defense in the next draft! A LB would be nice.

 

[ATippett56]

Defense.
We need to draft Defense in the next draft!

Meanwhile, some people just don't get it!

 

[ATippett56]

Here are the stats of another prolific RB out of Arkansas. Averaged over 5 ypc and accumulated 2,350 yards in his career: http://web1.ncaa.org/d1mfb/playerDetail.jsp?yr=2003&org=31&player=4

His name? Cedric Cobbs.
I don't have a ton of faith in Arkansas' offense (see their former QB trying to figure out Jacksonville's O as a WR). I've never seen McFadden make a solid blitz pickup. Yes, he's a great college RB, as was Cobbs, as was Ron Dayne and Ricky Williams.

The irony of the 2004 NFL Draft for the New England Patriots with regard to Cedric Cobbs:

http://www.turnertheburner.com/

http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?season=2004&round=round1

128 Cedric Cobbs RB Arkansas New England Patriots
154 Michael Turner RB Northern Illinois San Diego Chargers

 

[VJCPatriot]

Cowboys really like McFadden and have 1 first rounder. Trade our 1st rounder for both of their 1st rounders and one of their young linebackers.

If the Cowboys trade us Demarcus Ware and a 1st round pick for the right to select DMac, I'd pull the trigger in a NY minute, but that's just not gonna happen.

So if McFadden is there and there is nobody else more highly rated on the Patriots board available, I'll gladly draft the stud who will be the Pats equivalent of Thurman Thomas, Jamal Lewis, or Bo Jackson in his prime. The Patriots already have one of the most potent offenses in the NFL, add a 2,000 yard back into the mix and you are assured dynastic dominance for at least the next 5 years.

Let's take a quick look at the scouting reports and various articles on McFadden.

I talked to a defensive coach from one of Arkansas' earlier foes this week, and here's how he summed up McFadden's value: "Ohio State's quarterback [Troy Smith] will win the Heisman, and he's very deserving, but I want to see someone else who impacts a game more on offense than McFadden does. There's nobody in the country who does as much. He'll run it inside and out, and then all of a sudden they've got him throwing a post route [against LSU] or a bootleg pass for a touchdown [against Louisiana-Monroe]."

So we see here that not only is McFadden a great runner but he has the versatility to throw the football for certain plays. This kind of versatility is exactly what BB craves. McFadden is not only a starting RB, he's also an emergency QB.

"The first thing we talked to our kids about was, 'Do not try to tackle him high, because he's as physical a runner as anyone in the country, maybe at any level, and if you attack him high you'll face a very strong stiff-arm.' McFadden can also lower his pads and run through you, even though he does run high at 6-2. Tackling him high is darn near suicide. There was a cornerback at South Carolina that tried it, and he nearly killed the kid.

Mcfadden is a very physical runner who runs downhill. He's the kind of workhorse that BB desires. Maroney has not been so good at running in between the tackles. Mcfadden gives the Patriots that tough inside running game.

"His bread-and-butter is the power game, because he's a downhill runner, but what they've done with him in that single-wing quarterback position, by running the speed sweep with Felix Jones, is just ridiculous. You have to pick your poison there, and say, 'Are we going to stop the inside part of this or the speed sweep?' In actuality you'd need 12 or 13 guys to stop all of the options.

McFadden has already excelled in a dual back system where he shared the ball with Felix Jones. With McFadden and Maroney, teams would similarly have to pick their poison. McFadden and Maroney would be complementary players since Maroney seems to do better on the outside than the inside.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/luke_winn/12/01/sec.preview/index.html

Thoughts: In my opinion, McFadden is a more instinctive runner than Reggie Bush when he came out in 2006, and the best running back in the SEC since Bo Jackson…Productive running backs out of that conference seem to have a better track record adapting to the NFL…McFadden is an elite prospect right now and probably a top 3 pick next April.
http://walterfootball.com/pro2008dmcfadden.php

So the better question might be: Is Darren McFadden worthy of two first round draft picks? Absolutely; he is a complete running back with power, size and speed. He can get that first down on a 4th and one, but he also has the speed to take that same hand off all the way to the end zone. He has great hands and can catch the ball very well out of the backfield. He even has a decent arm and has thrown a TD pass or two in his career. He is the type of player that defenses must account for on every play. Plus, who else would they draft? Cornerback? Receiver? Maybe, both are needs, but there isn't either a corner or receiver that just jumps out at you as a "must have" first round talent.
http://www.nfldraftdog.com/NFL Team Columns/dallas_cowboys_nfl_team_column.htm

 

[Cassanova792]

Who cares? The Patriots have one of the most prolific offenses in NFL history with Maroney and Faulk at the running back position. The Patriots defensive needs next season far outweigh any incremental offensive improvements the Patriots may gain by drafting another running back.

Adding Darren McFadden is not incremental, it will be a huge and i mean HUGE upgrade. Im not hating on Maroney by all means because i think he will be a good back, but DMac is a RB for the ages i swear by it. Like I stated eariler before, if you had a Chris Chambers (a solid WR) on your team but had the opportunity to draft Randy Moss would you do it?

Contrary to your belief, i think that drafting a defensive player especially in the first round will give us marginal improvement. There are some amazing defensive players in the second round and later that can be potential superstars. And again, this ALWAYS been the case with the Patriots. Only defensive players drafted in the first round are Seymour, Wilfork and Warren. But this was necessary to make for a stronger 3-4 based system. At that time, they were the best options to there goals. Every other Patriot defensive player has come mostly in the deeper draft or FA. And from the looks of it, the Patriots have been doing a fine job to this philosophy.

I truly dont think some of you guys grasp how much value certain players are in regard to the need of the team. Yes our needs are DB and LB, but its certainly not worth wasting a first round pick when you can get almost as good of quality in the later rounds. D-Mac though not necessary to our success, drafting him WILL provide a far greater value than Laurenitas. Again, Imagine if A. Peterson were playing for the patriots right now. How could you not argue it is not a significant improvement on the OVERALL offense. It would make out team literally impossible to completely defend the entire game. Also think of how much better Peterson would be if the vikings actually had a passing game? Think he is good now? How well do you think he would do with our Oline and Offense? Peterson gets these yardages against teams putting 8 men in the box at all times as well as he only gets about 15-20 snaps a game.

I have witnessed both players in there college days and i can tell you right now that given the opportunity I would choose DMac over Peterson despite not even playing in 1 game in the NFL. Like Peterson, Dmac plays against constant 8 men run stopping defenses because of Arkansas anemic passing game and yet he still manages to average 7 yards a carry. Darren just ran for 323 yards last week without even breaking a sweat, not to mention he is a POWER back who has the speed to also break out on the outside. Darren would be phenomenal in the cold weather and snow where it would be absolutely critical to establish a power running game. This guy is a game changer and literrally a back of the ages.

 

[ATippett56]

Contrary to your belief, i think that drafting a defensive player especially in the first round will give us marginal improvement. There are some amazing defensive players in the second round and later that can be potential superstars. And again, this ALWAYS been the case with the Patriots. Only defensive players drafted in the first round are Seymour, Wilfork and Warren. But this was necessary to make for a stronger 3-4 based system. At that time, they were the best options to there goals. Every other Patriot defensive player has come mostly in the deeper draft or FA. And from the looks of it, the Patriots have been doing a fine job to this philosophy.

I truly dont think some of you guys grasp how much value certain players are in regard to the need of the team. Yes our needs are DB and LB, but its certainly not worth wasting a first round pick when you can get almost as good of quality in the later rounds.

You just don't get it. Asante Samuel and Randall Gay will be unrestricted free agents. If Asante Samuel is looking for Nate Clements money, you can forget about him coming back. As for Randall Gay, there may be a team with more cap room willing to pay more than the Patriots will allow. Thus, the Patriots could be down to one proven cornerback on the team next year. As for quality cornerbacks in the later rounds, do you want to wait until the fourth season to develop a quality cornerback? Meanwhile, I can foresee some retirements in the linebacker position next year.

 

[Cassanova792]

You just don't get it. Asante Samuel and Randall Gay will be unrestricted free agents. If Asante Samuel is looking for Nate Clements money, you can forget about him coming back. As for Randall Gay, there may be a team with more cap room willing to pay more than the Patriots will allow. Thus, the Patriots could be down to one proven cornerback on the team next year. As for quality cornerbacks in the later rounds, do you want to wait until the fourth season to develop a quality cornerback? Meanwhile, I can foresee some retirements in the linebacker position next year.

Im afraid you dont get it. How is drafting a player like a Laurenitas or a Philipps going to solve all these problems? how is drafting ONE defensive player going to help with the other issues you mentioned? Is Laurenitas going to play CB to? Is Philipps going to line up behind Wilfork? Somewhere along the lines you will see an UNPROVEN player somewhere on defense because the Patriots WILL draft defense like they ALWAYS DO in the deeper draft. To me, it would defy logic to why you would want to waste a first round pick, especially with such a high pick? Again, if this was the 15-20 pick in which case Dmac would most likely be drafted anyway, then yes we should definately start off with a key defensive player. But this year, that is not the scenario... which brings up the question....WHY not get the SAFEST as well as the MOST TALENTED player in the first round? I guarentee you Dmac WILL give you the best bang for your buck and become a contributor instantly. Its a pretty obvious choice



Keep in mind that drafting a RB is far more safer and better in getting the best quality and production relative to there projected rankings. The QB and defensive positions usually rank amongst the worst.

 

[ATippett56]

I agree with not drafting McFadden if something isn't done with Denver. Denver is going to need a RB, and this isn't going to be a deep draft for that position. With the lack of depth in this draft, Shannahan may be willing to offer a 1st rounder for a guy he so badly wanted 2 yrs ago. If he is willing to do this, this becomes a no-brainer. We then have Denver's 1st, Oakland's 3rd and our 2nd and 3rd round picks to build LB and DB depth.

Why would Denver trade with the New England Patriots when running back Michael Turner will be an unrestricted free agent in 2008?

 

[ATippett56]

Im afraid you dont get it. How is drafting a player like a Laurenitas or a Philipps going to solve all these problems? how is drafting ONE defensive player going to help with the other issues you mentioned? Is Laurenitas going to play CB to? Is Philipps going to line up behind Wilfork? Somewhere along the lines you will see an UNPROVEN player somewhere on defense because the Patriots WILL draft defense like they ALWAYS DO in the deeper draft. To me, it would defy logic to why you would want to waste a first round pick, especially with such a high pick? Again, if this was the 15-20 pick in which case Dmac would most likely be drafted anyway, then yes we should definately start off with a key defensive player. But this year, that is not the scenario... which brings up the question....WHY not get the SAFEST as well as the MOST TALENTED player in the first round? I guarentee you Dmac WILL give you the best bang for your buck and become a contributor instantly. Its a pretty obvious choice



Keep in mind that drafting a RB is far more safer and better in getting the best quality and production relative to there projected rankings. The QB and defensive positions usually rank amongst the worst.

First, I guess you never heard of trading down, which the Patriots have done in the past. It's not drafting one player but a whole slew of defensive players for the Patriots next season. If you draft an offensive player with the fourth pick in the draft, the Patriots will have to wait until the last pick in the second round to select a defensive player. If the Patriots trade down with the Dallas Cowboys (the only franchise with two first round selections in the 2008 NFL Draft), then the Patriots will have two first round draft picks to select defensive players. Thus, the Patriots could possibly end up with five first day draft picks which would be utilized to restock the defense at the linebacker and cornerback position.

Second, I'm sick and tired of Patriots fans bashing Laurence Maroney on this message board. If Josh McDaniels would allow Laurence Maroney 20 carries a game, then the Darren McFadden speculation would cease. I guess one of most historic offenses since the NFL-AFL merger just isn't enough to satisfy some Patriots fans.