PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Reiss' take on the final roster


Status
Not open for further replies.
Unless Yates or Mruc are available to them.

and sending them Yates or Mruc would be worse...in the short-term. If they take Elgin now, it really does them no good until a year or two. Casale had some funny comments about how small Elgin is for a lineman. he needs to bulk up
 
Last edited:
Yes, I overstated a bit. But, I believe that pioli has signed Washington with the idea of taking one year to evaluate, as you stated "a one year shot" NOT a three pre-season game shot.

And just BTW, the starters in 2008 could very well be Stallworth and Washington. I think the idea from the beginning was for the two to compete with Jackson for starting spots, with Welker at the slot forever (well, for as long as Brown was there). Yes, I understand that Moss could be extended.

I don't know if Pioli really decided that Washington is the future of this club. I can argue that the way Pioli structured Washington's contract that he wasn't all that sure that he could be the future of this team, but he was willing to take an one year shot. Washington signed a one year deal with an option for several more. The option bonus makes it near impossible for the Pats to pick up unless Washington is a starter by the end of the season or at least a serious contender for a starting job in 2008. Otherwise, they can let Washington go after this season with insignicant affect on the cap.

I think the case for Washington is that he is a bigger target than Caldwell, he does have more natural talent than Caldwell (athough he has yet to show that he can convert that natural talent into actual playing ability yet in his career), and he plays special teams.
 
Last edited:
Yes, I overstated a bit. But, I believe that pioli has signed Washington with the idea of taking one year to evaluate, as you stated "a one year shot" NOT a three pre-season game shot.

But they might have only needed that amount of time to make an evaluation. It isn't as if the guy was a complete unknown coming in here.
 
Unless Yates or Mruc are available to them.

I don't see the Pats cutting/trading Yates since they just signed him to a long term extension. I could see the Jets taking Mruczkowski. But I believe that Elgin plays better than Mruczkowski, in all honesty.

Could the Jets or any other team bypass Elgin for someone else? Yep. They sure could. But I believe that, because of his age and how good his technique is, that Elgin will be a valuable commodity on the waiver market.

Needless to say, its going to be an interesting next few days.
 
and sending them Yates or Mruc would be worse...in the short-term. If they take Elgin now, it really does them no good until a year or two. Casale had some funny comments about how small Elgin is for a lineman. he needs to bulk up

Elgin has bulked up. He is 290 lbs. Here is the listing for the other centers and guards on the team:
Hochstein - 305 lbs.
Koppen - 296 lbs.
Neal - 305 lbs
Mankins - 310 lbs (biggest interior lineman)
Mruczkowski - 305 lbs
Yates - 305 lbs
Patrick - 280 lbs

Elgin isn't the smallest, weighing in less than Patrick, but he's not that far off from being up there with Koppen. And, with a year in the program, I could see him putting on another 10 lbs, though we'll never know about it since the Pats really don't update the weights on a yearly basis.
 
Do we really have the most valuable guard cuts in the entire league? The jets will pickup a guard or two, that may or may not include one of ours.


Elgin has bulked up. He is 290 lbs. Here is the listing for the other centers and guards on the team:
Hochstein - 305 lbs.
Koppen - 296 lbs.
Neal - 305 lbs
Mankins - 310 lbs (biggest interior lineman)
Mruczkowski - 305 lbs
Yates - 305 lbs
Patrick - 280 lbs

Elgin isn't the smallest, weighing in less than Patrick, but he's not that far off from being up there with Koppen. And, with a year in the program, I could see him putting on another 10 lbs, though we'll never know about it since the Pats really don't update the weights on a yearly basis.
 
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/2007/08/roster_thoughts.html

Thinks Vinny won't be on the roster to start if Gutierrez looks like he's going to get picked up by another team.
Troy on PUP to start the season
Mills cut and Thomas on PUP for TE
Has Lua and Rogers making it at LB
Tory James cut and Mike Richardson on IR or practice squad at DB
Questions whether Wilson (actually first I've seen it mentioned) was hurt Fri night, if so James sticks at CB

  • QB - I don't see Vinny or Gutierrez on the roster, Vinnie to shadow and Gutierrez to PS. As usual local fans \ media over value our players. Gutierrez is ok but I don't think too many times with put him on their 53 man roster because he won't know their systems.
  • RB - At first I thought they may look for a short yardage specialist but they have ok success in the pre-season in these situations. Morris is not a classic bruiser but he can catch out of the backfield and plays special teams.
  • WR - Caldwell, Gaffney and Washington are in a dead heat. Gaffney's injury may set him back. Flip a coin.
  • TE - Agree with his three Benjamin Watson, Kyle Brady, Marcellus Rivers but I add Mills. He has played in goal line situation and special teams.
  • OL - Injuries to Hochstein and Yates may play a factor. Agree with his picks with 2 of the 3 (Elgin, Hilliard and Oldenburg) getting a shot at the PS.
  • DL - His assessment is bang on. This unit could be great if the big 3 see significant time on the field together.
  • LB - I don't see Lua sticking, he could end up on the PS.
  • CB - I move Merriweather out of this mix, he looks like a Safety to me. I add James and send Richardson to the PS.
  • Safety - Wilson's injury caused some concern. I move Merriweather into this group and cut Mitchell.
 
Do we really have the most valuable guard cuts in the entire league? The jets will pickup a guard or two, that may or may not include one of ours.

Most valuable? Who knows. Value, like beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

What I do know is that Mangini has plucked just about every cast off he could from the Pats. (Poteat, Ventrone). What I do know is that Elgin's abilities aren't a secret and he's looked very good in pre-season for a rookie.

Being that Mangini, Davidson of the Panthers and Crennel of the Browns all have intimate knowledge of how the Pats O-line is trained, I would think they'd look there first if they had a need.
 
Elgin has bulked up. He is 290 lbs. Here is the listing for the other centers and guards on the team:
Hochstein - 305 lbs.
Koppen - 296 lbs.
Neal - 305 lbs
Mankins - 310 lbs (biggest interior lineman)
Mruczkowski - 305 lbs
Yates - 305 lbs
Patrick - 280 lbs

Elgin isn't the smallest, weighing in less than Patrick, but he's not that far off from being up there with Koppen. And, with a year in the program, I could see him putting on another 10 lbs, though we'll never know about it since the Pats really don't update the weights on a yearly basis.

I don't think any team or website updates weights, so you pretty much have to go with the visual, or reporters, if the weight change is noteworthy.
 
  • QB - I don't see Vinny or Gutierrez on the roster, Vinnie to shadow and Gutierrez to PS. As usual local fans \ media over value our players. Gutierrez is ok but I don't think too many times with put him on their 53 man roster because he won't know their systems.
  • RB - At first I thought they may look for a short yardage specialist but they have ok success in the pre-season in these situations. Morris is not a classic bruiser but he can catch out of the backfield and plays special teams.
  • WR - Caldwell, Gaffney and Washington are in a dead heat. Gaffney's injury may set him back. Flip a coin.
  • TE - Agree with his three Benjamin Watson, Kyle Brady, Marcellus Rivers but I add Mills. He has played in goal line situation and special teams.
  • OL - Injuries to Hochstein and Yates may play a factor. Agree with his picks with 2 of the 3 (Elgin, Hilliard and Oldenburg) getting a shot at the PS.
  • DL - His assessment is bang on. This unit could be great if the big 3 see significant time on the field together.
  • LB - I don't see Lua sticking, he could end up on the PS.
  • CB - I move Merriweather out of this mix, he looks like a Safety to me. I add James and send Richardson to the PS.
  • Safety - Wilson's injury caused some concern. I move Merriweather into this group and cut Mitchell.

Why would you get rid of Mitchell, who is an ace on special teams? It doesn't make sense.
 
how does it work exactly? if they want to put a player on the ps, I know they have to cut him. Afterwards, he must pass through waivers. If another team picks a guy up, like Elgin, does that mean he must make that team's 53? Or can they put him right on their ps?

IIRC when a team plucks a player off another team's PS, they must keep him on their 53 man active roster for at least 3 weeks.
And he's guaranteed three weeks salary ( at least $285K divided by 17 x 3=$50K) versus $4700 per week on PS ($4700x3=$14.1K)
 
Last edited:
Why would you get rid of Mitchell, who is an ace on special teams? It doesn't make sense.

I haven't seen Micthell make a tackle yet, I gave his spot to Mills but I can be convinced either way. I see Mitchell, Baker, Wesley and Richardson in a battle for the last secondary spot.
 
Not sure why you think the 5th wide out wont be used much..

Because 5th receivers never get used very much on offense. They generally play on ST, are gameday inactives and gather in a handful of passes for the year. Why would you put Caldwell in that position? You put a ST ace, rookie or reclaimation project there.

when there are health issues with a few ahead of the fifth.

If you are saying keep Caldwell as the 5th WR just in case one of the top 4 get hurt, that seems like a poor use of that roster spot and a slap to Caldwell who has been a real team guy to this point. If you are saying keep Caldwell as the 5th WR because the top 4 can't take the field (Gaffney, Moss), then he really wouldn't be the 5th WR and my ramblings don't apply.

plus we spread the ball around and use lots of spread formations.

The Minnesota game last year was about the only game I can remember when a 5th WR was active/useful. I'm not saying that Caldwell isn't one of the top 53 or one of the top 5 WR. What I'm saying is that you don't put a veteran WR who has reached his potential in that roster spot. I agree that injuries could make the point moot, but I will be surprised if Caldwell or Gaffney make the roster as the 5th WR.
 
Couple of observations...

- first, its great to be in this position, that our backups are creating such a competition. It bodes well for the team.

- Why not hire Vinny as a QB "coach", and have him on the sidelines for games...I don't think Vinny is here to play, just to advise.

- Caldwell/Washington/Gaffney. So much depends on the state of Gaffney's injury, but I only see 2 of these 3 sticking around.

- Mills..I don't think he would make it to the PS. So if he's cut, he's gone. C'est la vie.

- I think Elgin sticks.

- With so much cap available, don't be surprised if the pats stash some players on IR.
 
I haven't seen Micthell make a tackle yet, I gave his spot to Mills but I can be convinced either way. I see Mitchell, Baker, Wesley and Richardson in a battle for the last secondary spot.

Game 1
(12:45) 5-D.Baugher punts 42 yards to TB 24, Center-66-L.Paxton. M.Jones to TB 30 for 6 yards (24-M.Mitchell).

Game 2
-S.Gostkowski kicks 68 yards from NE 30 to TEN 2. 33-M.Griffin to TEN 20 for 18 yards (53-L.Izzo). PENALTY on NE-24-M.Mitchell, Encroachment

Game 3
-S.Gostkowski kicks 72 yards from NE 30 to CAR -2. 37-N.Goings to CAR 22 for 24 yards (24-M.Mitchell).

(14:31) 5-D.Baugher punts 36 yards to CAR 16, Center-66-L.Paxton. 10-R.Robinson pushed ob at CAR 22 for 6 yards (24-M.Mitchell).
 
Game 1
(12:45) 5-D.Baugher punts 42 yards to TB 24, Center-66-L.Paxton. M.Jones to TB 30 for 6 yards (24-M.Mitchell).

Game 2
-S.Gostkowski kicks 68 yards from NE 30 to TEN 2. 33-M.Griffin to TEN 20 for 18 yards (53-L.Izzo). PENALTY on NE-24-M.Mitchell, Encroachment

Game 3
-S.Gostkowski kicks 72 yards from NE 30 to CAR -2. 37-N.Goings to CAR 22 for 24 yards (24-M.Mitchell).

(14:31) 5-D.Baugher punts 36 yards to CAR 16, Center-66-L.Paxton. 10-R.Robinson pushed ob at CAR 22 for 6 yards (24-M.Mitchell).

He must the strong silent type, ok lets take him instead of Mills.
 
Interestingly, between Gost kicking touchbacks (yeah, and outa bounds too) and the Pats not punting often, we've had little opportunity for ST gunners et. al. to show their stuff. No complaint here.
 
He must the strong silent type, ok lets take him instead of Mills.

There has been a silent battle for the leadership of the rebuilt STs, that few have followed. Neither looks to play much on regular Defense. The Safety situation is deep and if Andrews is kept (another potential ST captain candidate), it gets complicated. The question is does keeping one or the other jeopardize a keeper and useful player on their own nominal position or the other nominal position?

I think the Pats have found three future regulat players at LB beyond the big 5. Woods, Rodgers and Alexander. And possibly Lua, #4, someday. It is true by experience that Woods and Alexander are a very good ST; Rodgers has more ST tackles this preseason than Izzo, and regular starting possibilities as well; and Lua is a question mark. Lua might be a contributor on both ST and regular LB but it is not clear, and he might better be seasoned on PS.

OTOH Hawkins has been cut already at Safety. Did the Pats do that to hold a position for Andrews or Mitchell ? Of for both? If Izzo loses out would he be available on the Shadow roster, more likely than Andrews or Mitchell?. Or would he get snapped up more likely than either alternative?. I think its possible that many teams would evaluate his recent work, and pass on him than they would on the other two alternatives. (If Belichick, like George Allen, says you're done, who are we to argue?)

I add it up as 8 LBs; Lua to PS; and both Andrews and Mitchell are targeted for ST duties and an extra DB position. Izzo goes to the Shadow and Rodgers, Woods and Alexander join the big 5 on the 8 man LB corps.

Don't forget this gets easier and safer, since Chad Brown is already targeted, (by me), to Shadow and callable in an emergency if you only carry 8 LBs, as well as Lua on PS, and Izzo on the Shadow. With injuries common to both LB and STs, it easy to envison Larry rejoining the team later.

Such pleasant problems to have. :p
 
If Reiss is right he has only 1 WR from last year on this year's 53 man roster. Now that's turnover.
 
injuries

make it hard to predict, but I have a couple of changes. A player Reiss overlooked is Rashad Baker, who has an undisclosed injury. If he can play, I say he sticks. Solid STer who was running with Sanders as backup safeties before his injury. Injuries may force BB to try to sneak somebody through. Lua does not stick IMO.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.


TRANSCRIPT: Jerod Mayo on the Rich Eisen Show From 5/2/24
Patriots News And Notes 5-5, Early 53-Man Roster Projection
New Patriots WR Javon Baker: ‘You ain’t gonna outwork me’
Friday Patriots Notebook 5/3: News and Notes
Thursday Patriots Notebook 5/2: News and Notes
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 5/1: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Jerod Mayo’s Appearance on WEEI On Monday
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/30: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Drake Maye’s Interview on WEEI on Jones & Mego with Arcand
MORSE: Rookie Camp Invitees and Draft Notes
Back
Top