Who to take at #21?

[chunkypony]

Since I don't know what position BB will draft at #21, here's who I think we should take at each position:
ILB: Demeco Ryans
OLB: Tamba Hali
RB: DeAngelo Williams
S: Laron Landry
WR: Derek Hagan

 

[MDPATSFAN]

Dillon and Faulk will be back. I have no idea why everyone wants White. Groom, schroom, we need help in other areas. Even if Dillon and Faulk are no better than this year, they're OK (barely) and we have much bigger needs than RB.

Disagree..The running game needs to be priority number one. They gained 650 less yards on the ground this year compared to 2004. That's translates to more of sacks for Brady and more time on the field for the defense. A marquis RB is a must!

Without a good running game they are arguably not a complete football team.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Disagree..The running game needs to be priority number one. They gained 650 less yards on the ground this year compared to 2004. That's translates to more of sacks for Brady and more time on the field for the defense. A marquis RB is a must!

Without a good running game they are arguably not a complete football team.

I just don't see it as viable. They're already paying Dillon and Faulk about $7M combined next year and will be close to 15% of the cap just in RB if they get a "marquis" RB. I know we need to get a running game going but I think it's going to have to be with what we have.

 

[DaBruinz]

Disagree..The running game needs to be priority number one. They gained 650 less yards on the ground this year compared to 2004. That's translates to more of sacks for Brady and more time on the field for the defense. A marquis RB is a must!

Without a good running game they are arguably not a complete football team.

Unfortunately, your statements are backed up by reality.

The Patriots, with a makeshif O-line, actually gave up fewer sacks per pass attempt than they did last year.

Brady was sacked 26 times on 474 pass attempts last year, with a "marquis" Running game, while this year, he was sacked 26 times on 530 pass attempts.

Now, I DO agree that without a good running game, the Pats aren't a complete football team. However, they won the SB against Carolina without a "good" running game. And this year's running game was the equivalent of 2003's running game.

 

[MDPATSFAN]

Yeah and we went 10-6 this year playing in a much weaker AFC East.

In 2005 our $7 Million Running attack only produced 878 yards and two 100 yard rushing performances! UNSAT!

Now I hope I'm wrong and Dillion bounces back from injury and certainly BB is looking at this. If we get the same performance next season it will be a long year.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

In 2005 our $7 Million Running attack only produced 878 yards and two 100 yard rushing performances! UNSAT!

I don't think anyone disagrees. But the way their contracts are, we're going to be hit with a $7M or so cap hit whether we keep them or not. So we might as well keep them. But that means if we bring in a new, proven guy, we're closing in on $10M or so just for RB.

 

[MDPATSFAN]

Man we are in bad shape here...Denver has Bell and Anderson for about $4M a year.

 

[DaBruinz]

I just don't see it as viable. They're already paying Dillon and Faulk about $7M combined next year and will be close to 15% of the cap just in RB if they get a "marquis" RB. I know we need to get a running game going but I think it's going to have to be with what we have.

Belichickfan -
I think that the Pats will look at both free agency and the draft to add a "future" running back. They could take LenDale White or another RB only if they feel he is the best VALUE of all the players they feel are 1st round picks.

 

[DaBruinz]

Yeah and we went 10-6 this year playing in a much weaker AFC East.

In 2005 our $7 Million Running attack only produced 878 yards and two 100 yard rushing performances! UNSAT!

Now I hope I'm wrong and Dillion bounces back from injury and certainly BB is looking at this. If we get the same performance next season it will be a long year.

MD - It seems you have a problem with understanding that players get injured. The Pats had tons of money sitting on the sidelines during the season not producing. And you seem to be putting the blame SQUARLELY on Dillon and Faulk and NONE of it on the O-line.

This idea of equating money with production and not taking into consideration all the factors that affect those two people shows a warped concept of reality.

 

[DaBruinz]

Man we are in bad shape here...Denver has Bell and Anderson for about $4M a year.

This is just dumb. How can you compare the salary of a 2nd year player and a 6th year player who is only a 2nd year starter to a 9 year vet (9 year starter) and a 7 year vet and think you are comparing apples to apples. Especially when Dillon and Faulk missed 13 games. Injuries happen. You can't ignore them. Nor can you sit there and compare them the way you are doing.

The Pats may or may not pick up Dillon's option this year. If they don't, then we know that Dillon will only be here one more year. If they do, then they feel that Dillon will be productive beyond this coming year.

 

[Fanfrom1960]

Unfortunately, your statements are backed up by reality.

The Patriots, with a makeshif O-line, actually gave up fewer sacks per pass attempt than they did last year.

Brady was sacked 26 times on 474 pass attempts last year, with a "marquis" Running game, while this year, he was sacked 26 times on 530 pass attempts.

Now, I DO agree that without a good running game, the Pats aren't a complete football team. However, they won the SB against Carolina without a "good" running game. And this year's running game was the equivalent of 2003's running game.

I think Brady was hit a lot more times though. Not sure why sacks and hits on the QB weren't in proportion. Brady himself said he was sorer on Mondays this year than in other years. He may be good at moving around, especially stepping up in the pocket, but he's not the most mobile QB out there. I think better protection for the QB should be a very high priority. The Pats have enough quality, or potentially quality offensive linemen though, don't they? Maybe it's just a matter of more experience for the new guys and more time working as a unit?

 

[MDPATSFAN]

Corey seemed tentative instead of blasting through people this season. That being said you could see the limp most of the season, so I give him mucho props for being one lion hearted SOB!


In regard to injuries, yes they overcame alot and they were directly involved in the losses. However a good running game is critical, less pressure on the quarterback and the Defense doesn't get points scored of them when they are kickin back on the bench watchin a clock consuming drive. There were too many three and outs last year and too much on Brady's shoulders. I'm not saying they have to go run crazy like Denver or Pittsburgh, but if Brady has a 100 yard rusher chances are the team wins.

I loved what Pittsburgh did to the Colts in the 2nd half...something like 15 straight running plays while superstar Pay-A-ton wallowed in his own choke-ocrity on the bench.

 

[DaBruinz]

I think Brady was hit a lot more times though. Not sure why sacks and hits on the QB weren't in proportion. Brady himself said he was sorer on Mondays this year than in other years. He may be good at moving around, especially stepping up in the pocket, but he's not the most mobile QB out there. I think better protection for the QB should be a very high priority. The Pats have enough quality, or potentially quality offensive linemen though, don't they? Maybe it's just a matter of more experience for the new guys and more time working as a unit?

Unfortunately, this is where we disagree. I think that the Pats could stand to have an upgrade in their depth positions. Both at guard and at tackle. Gorin is just horrendous and I think he is paying someone off at Stats, Inc. because there is no way he only had 2 sacks allowed. Ashworth is only marginally better because he can play both LT and RT.

One of the things that was VERY distrubing was all the late hits that QBs were taking this year without any calls. There were numerous ones in every game that I watched. This is an issue that NEEDS to be addressed at the winter meetings.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

According to Dale and Holley this AM the title of this thread is a little off. The non playoff teams are drafting 1-20 in order of finish. The 4 teams who were beaten in the first round are drafting 21-24. As one of the 4 teams who bowed out this week we will be drafting either 25 or 26 dependent on what the tie breaker is with the Redskins who also finished 10-6. Chicago will draft 27 and Indy 28 by virtue of their regular season records.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I think DaBruinz is right on the money here. Upgrade the OL. The whole reason Dillion got hurt/attacked the line tentatively is because of the line. Mankins had a huge learning curve in the first 10 games of the season and missed a ton of assignments. That left Dillion to take on DT's instead of LBs and Ss. Also Gorin is much better at run blocking than pass blocking while Ashworth is the exact opposite. Not to mention that Graham got hurt because he had to constantly help with the blocking. Neal was, in my opinion the second most dissapointing player on the team this past year. (Wilson was #1.) Opposing DL figured out Neal and shed him with regularity this past year.
I expect Mankins to grow by leaps and bounds next year based on his last 6 games of 2005. With a healthy Koppen and Light returning, the left side of the line looks decent. Ashworth and Neal could both leave in the offseason, which leaves us very thin over there. And even if they stay, there needs to be an upgrade over there.

OT's in the draft that should fall to us in round #2.
Whitworth (LSU)
Trueblood (BC)
Scott (Texas)

OG's that should be available in round #4.
Lentz (Michigan)
Sims (Ohio State)
Allen (Texas)

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

According to Dale and Holley this AM the title of this thread is a little off. The non playoff teams are drafting 1-20 in order of finish. The 4 teams who were beaten in the first round are drafting 21-24. As one of the 4 teams who bowed out this week we will be drafting either 25 or 26 dependent on what the tie breaker is with the Redskins who also finished 10-6. Chicago will draft 27 and Indy 28 by virtue of their regular season records.

They are wrong, we are #21. Evidently they corrected themselves later according to another thread.

 

[upstater1]

Unfortunately, this is where we disagree. I think that the Pats could stand to have an upgrade in their depth positions. Both at guard and at tackle. Gorin is just horrendous and I think he is paying someone off at Stats, Inc. because there is no way he only had 2 sacks allowed. Ashworth is only marginally better because he can play both LT and RT.

One of the things that was VERY distrubing was all the late hits that QBs were taking this year without any calls. There were numerous ones in every game that I watched. This is an issue that NEEDS to be addressed at the winter meetings.

We have Light, Koppen and Kaczur coming back. You're not going to find better upgrades for backup tackles than Gorin/Ashworth. If we sign Neal, then I'd say we're set at the OL. Not many teams will have backups with the experience level of Gorin/Ashworth/Hochstein. A couple late-rounders, UFAs, maybe. But not in the first 5 rounds.

 

[SamBam39]

Based on need I would think CB or LB will be a strong consideration.

wr, rb, ss are also picks but I think they'll expect rodney back sometime next year, and they have wilson, sanders & scott.

they are probably gonna grab a stud corner to replace ty law and team with samuel & hobbs (& maybe gay) to give us strong talented depth, something lacking.

LB crew is getting older. Willie, tedy, even vrabel will need some youthful help soon. They grabbed claridge last year, look for them to seek more youthful talent.

they may fill in with rb, wr. remember they got givens in 7th round. curtis martin went in 3rd round. Watch for cb & Lb early.

 

[drew4008]

For anyone wanting LaRon Landry... he is returning to school.

And DeMeco Ryans is better suited to be a 4-3 OLB.

 

[nickw308810]

There is a slim chance that LenDale White is around when we have to pick. The only stud back may be Laurence Maroney, who though he is small and fast still carried the ball 40+ times in games for Minnesota this year. Not that it matters, but I figured I would list the last draft Drew and I did at another website. Probably have already seen it, but I didn't know.
1st round Mathis Kiwanuka DE/OLB BC
2nd round Antonio Cromartie CB FSU
3rd Round Greg Blue S Georgia
3rd Round Greg Lee WR Pittsburgh