NFL GAME DAY DISCUSSION Week 5 Other Games

[Ghost of Autumn]

Freaking Bears. I was hoping the pats would be the only "shock the world" result this week.

 

[PaulThePat]

Wow, give an underperforming QB a top quality WR1 and things happen. Who knew? Maybe the Pats should try that sometime.

 

[condon84]

yet people here claim that fields is a huge bust...well if Fields is a bust then Mac is a bust too because Mac does not perform better nor is Fields in a better situation than Mac. Fields coaching sucks

Both are busts this far.

Fields is physically superior. Even if his mechanics are terrible he still has a rocket arm. He also can lean on his athleticism to make plays with his legs. He can't read and decipher NFL defenses is his problem.

 

[Rob0729]

Last night was a total damnation of Belichick's philosophy against paying for top receiver talent. DJ Moore is the Bears' passing offense. Fields passed for 282 yards and 4 TDs last night and 230 yards and 3 TDs were to Moore. Fields spread the ball around a lot more the week before, but Moore still had 131 yards and a TD. From a QB that three weeks ago was written off as a complete bust.

Next year, whether it is Mac Jones or a rookie or another veteran at QB, the Pats need to invest in WR talent. There is no ifs and or buts about it. If Belichick is unwilling to do it, he needs to go. We have seen what Tua and Jalen Hurts and Kirk Cousins were before and after getting top receiver talent. It is now a proven fact, you either need an elite QB or surround the QB with top receiver talent. It is far, far easier to surround a average QB with top receiver talent than get an elite QB.

 

[upstater1]

Wow, give an underperforming QB a top quality WR1 and things happen. Who knew? Maybe the Pats should try that sometime.

Justin Fields >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mac Jones

The Bears also have 4 losses with DJ Moore.

That being said, I'd love to have him on the Patriots. BUT... Mac would be unable to accomplish what Fields has.

And let's not forget the trade for DJ Moore and what it took to bring him to the Bears.

 

[upstater1]

Last night was a total damnation of Belichick's philosophy against paying for top receiver talent. DJ Moore is the Bears' passing offense. Fields passed for 282 yards and 4 TDs last night and 230 yards and 3 TDs were to Moore. Fields spread the ball around a lot more the week before, but Moore still had 131 yards and a TD. From a QB that three weeks ago was written off as a complete bust.

I mean, they have 4 losses. You have this idea that Belichick doesn't like good WRs, which is absurd.

AND you neglect the fact that DJ Moore was TRADED to the Bears. How do you imagine the Patriots could've inserted themselves into that trade given what both teams gave up? Did we have the #1 overall pick last year?

 

[lancerman]

Last night was a total damnation of Belichick's philosophy against paying for top receiver talent. DJ Moore is the Bears' passing offense. Fields passed for 282 yards and 4 TDs last night and 230 yards and 3 TDs were to Moore. Fields spread the ball around a lot more the week before, but Moore still had 131 yards and a TD. From a QB that three weeks ago was written off as a complete bust.

Next year, whether it is Mac Jones or a rookie or another veteran at QB, the Pats need to invest in WR talent. There is no ifs and or buts about it. If Belichick is unwilling to do it, he needs to go. We have seen what Tua and Jalen Hurts and Kirk Cousins were before and after getting top receiver talent. It is now a proven fact, you either need an elite QB or surround the QB with top receiver talent. It is far, far easier to surround an average QB with top receiver talent than get an elite QB.

Yeah it’s weird to me that Fields best game in his career coming off the back of his star receiver having a monster performance is being used against Mac when everyone in the league has criticized the Pats for not getting him a stud WR.

If anything the fact that Fields can look half competent when his top WR balls out, that Trevor Lawrence turned it around when they paid for a WR, that Tua went from a bust to a hero after they went on an aggressive WR, how Allen turned it around after getting Diggs, etc is a massive indictment on us “zigging when the league zags”. Like there is a blueprint and it shows results. Our way hasn’t, and there really haven’t been any success stories in the league doing it our way in a long time.

 

[Rob0729]

I mean, they have 4 losses. You have this idea that Belichick doesn't like good WRs, which is absurd.

AND you neglect the fact that DJ Moore was TRADED to the Bears. How do you imagine the Patriots could've inserted themselves into that trade given what both teams gave up? Did we have the #1 overall pick last year?

Belichick will not invest in the offense like he does the defense. Case and point, even after Gonzalez went down, the two biggest needs on this team is OT and WR. What did Belichick immediately do? Trade for a CB.

Belichick has only once in his time with the Patriots tried to get a top WR. Randy Moss. And that was only because he was a distressed asset and he got him at a bargain basic price.

It is a fact that Belichick believes he can win with a strong defense and running game and a efficient passing offense that doesn't make mistakes. He mocked Dmitroff for spending a high draft pick on Julio Jones because the Falcons could have gotten a WR in the second or third round. He doesn't receiver help. He will pay for middle of the road talent and if the Pats get lucky they might turn out to be more like Welker. He didn't even give a competitive offer to DeAndre Hopkins.

 

[mike_usagisan]

Belichick will not invest in the offense like he does the defense. Case and point, even after Gonzalez went down, the two biggest needs on this team is OT and WR. What did Belichick immediately do? Trade for a CB.

Belichick has only once in his time with the Patriots tried to get a top WR. Randy Moss. And that was only because he was a distressed asset and he got him at a bargain basic price.

It is a fact that Belichick believes he can win with a strong defense and running game and a efficient passing offense that doesn't make mistakes. He mocked Dmitroff for spending a high draft pick on Julio Jones because the Falcons could have gotten a WR in the second or third round. He doesn't receiver help. He will pay for middle of the road talent and if the Pats get lucky they might turn out to be more like Welker. He didn't even give a competitive offer to DeAndre Hopkins.

I think he thought Parker was better than Hopkins, and seeing the QB School videos show me how often Parker is getting open and Mac isn't getting it to him, makes me think Bill is right. Plus Hopkins isn't lighting any worlds on fire in Tennessee. If Higgins is available in free agency and Bill doesn't pull that trigger, I'm going to be triggered.

 

[Pape]

Belichick will not invest in the offense like he does the defense. Case and point, even after Gonzalez went down, the two biggest needs on this team is OT and WR. What did Belichick immediately do? Trade for a CB.

so, in the secondary, we are down jonathan jones, jack jones, marcus jones, isaiah bolden & then lose christian gonzales... and you have an issue with the Patriots getting a sweetheart deal from the chargers to bring back JC Jackson?

Belichick has only once in his time with the Patriots tried to get a top WR. Randy Moss. And that was only because he was a distressed asset and he got him at a bargain basic price.

Only once? What you say below basically says that is a ******** statement, doesn't it?

It is a fact that Belichick believes he can win with a strong defense and running game and a efficient passing offense that doesn't make mistakes.

Thats an honest to god wtf statement if ive ever seen one... and having exactly what you described as bad is exactly what we need... Its a quarterback that can actually run an effective offense which scores points is whats missing in New England right now...

He mocked Dmitroff for spending a high draft pick on Julio Jones because the Falcons could have gotten a WR in the second or third round. He doesn't receiver help. He will pay for middle of the road talent and if the Pats get lucky they might turn out to be more like Welker. He didn't even give a competitive offer to DeAndre Hopkins.

Mocked? Thats a completely unfair and very disingenuous statement on your part. The actual quote from "War Room" by Michael Holley says “Thomas, I’m just telling you as a friend. I wouldn’t do it.”

Where's the mockery? - Be specific.

 

[Rob0729]

I think he thought Parker was better than Hopkins, and seeing the QB School videos show me how often Parker is getting open and Mac isn't getting it to him, makes me think Bill is right. Plus Hopkins isn't lighting any worlds on fire in Tennessee. If Higgins is available in free agency and Bill doesn't pull that trigger, I'm going to be triggered.

I haven't watched enough game film to know who is getting open or not. So I cannot speak to that. I do know others like Lazar and Bedard seem to disagree with you. But I don't know.

But even so. Parker is not a legitimate #1 receiver by any standard. Hopkins was last year.

I don't know what Hopkins' lack of product is caused by this year. He is leading the Titans in receptions and yards despite being injured and has more receptions and yards than any Patriots player. Don't watch Titans games. Not sure if he just lost a step or for another reason.

 

[Rob0729]

so, in the secondary, we are down jonathan jones, jack jones, marcus jones, isaiah bolden & then lose christian gonzales... and you have an issue with the Patriots getting a sweetheart deal from the chargers to bring back JC Jackson?

Only once? What you say below basically says that is a ******** statement, doesn't it?

Thats an honest to god wtf statement if ive ever seen one... and having exactly what you described as bad is exactly what we need... Its a quarterback that can actually run an effective offense which scores points is whats missing in New England right now...

Mocked? Thats a completely unfair and very disingenuous statement on your part. The actual quote from "War Room" by Michael Holley says “Thomas, I’m just telling you as a friend. I wouldn’t do it.”

Where the mockery? - Be specific.

I don't have a problem with the Pats bringing back Jackson. I have a problem with the fact that the Pats have a serious issue at RT and receiver and they are doing nothing to bring someone in to fix the problem like they did with the defense.

What other time did Belichick bring in a top WR? Welker was nothing but potential in Miami. If he was a top receiver, the Dolphins would have matched the offer. OchoCinco was done. He brought in a series of washed up former elite WRs. Who?

If you think Mac Jones is THE PROBLEM with the offense right now, you are not watching the games. You get better QB in here, he is still playing on an offense that cannot run the ball, an o-line that cannot pass protect, and receivers who cannot get open quickly. Mac Jones may not be the answer for this team, but he certainly isn't the biggest problem.

And I will admit that mocked was the wrong word. I couldn't remember the actual comment. I thought it was stronger than that.

BTW, you didn't like me making snarky comments in the past to you. And I promised you that I would try to tone it down with you. But now you come at me with nothing but snark. I don't care. I am a big boy and can handle it. But don't cry to me if I give it to you.

 

[upstater1]

Belichick will not invest in the offense like he does the defense. Case and point, even after Gonzalez went down, the two biggest needs on this team is OT and WR. What did Belichick immediately do? Trade for a CB.

Belichick has only once in his time with the Patriots tried to get a top WR. Randy Moss. And that was only because he was a distressed asset and he got him at a bargain basic price.

It is a fact that Belichick believes he can win with a strong defense and running game and a efficient passing offense that doesn't make mistakes. He mocked Dmitroff for spending a high draft pick on Julio Jones because the Falcons could have gotten a WR in the second or third round. He doesn't receiver help. He will pay for middle of the road talent and if the Pats get lucky they might turn out to be more like Welker. He didn't even give a competitive offer to DeAndre Hopkins.

The biggest need was CB. We had 2 guys back there, Bryant and Wade. Clearly it was CB. We have 4 of them hurt.

What WR do you want the Patriots to trade for anyway? He wouldn't be a top one.

The middle paragraph is just nonsense speculation. We gave up a 2nd rounder for Sanu, we gave up a 1st rounder for Brandin Cooks. You have no idea what we've tried to do to bring in top WRs. I mean, if I follow the rumors and speculation, it's clear they tried to trade for Fitzgerald before Fitzgerald was washed up. They also tried to get Anquan Boldin but Boldin nixed it. We lost on Derrick Mason as well.

If I'm supposed to go with your rumors and speculation, why wouldn't I also believe all the rumors and speculation listed above?

 

[upstater1]

I haven't watched enough game film to know who is getting open or not. So I cannot speak to that. I do know others like Lazar and Bedard seem to disagree with you. But I don't know.

But even so. Parker is not a legitimate #1 receiver by any standard. Hopkins was last year.

I don't know what Hopkins' lack of product is caused by this year. He is leading the Titans in receptions and yards despite being injured and has more receptions and yards than any Patriots player. Don't watch Titans games. Not sure if he just lost a step or for another reason.

Hopkins has been at half his previous production for 4 straight years now. He is half the WR he used to be, and it's not a new thing. I'm not even talking about his missed games. I'm talking about production WHEN he plays. Granted, I only saw him a couple times a year when he was in Arizona, but during a year ( last year) in which the Patriots struggled to contain top WRs, we had Hopkins totally locked down last year (and that was without our top CBs).

 

[Rob0729]

The biggest need was CB. We had 2 guys back there, Bryant and Wade. Clearly it was CB. We have 4 of them hurt.

What WR do you want the Patriots to trade for anyway? He wouldn't be a top one.

The middle paragraph is just nonsense speculation. We gave up a 2nd rounder for Sanu, we gave up a 1st rounder for Brandin Cooks. You have no idea what we've tried to do to bring in top WRs. I mean, if I follow the rumors and speculation, it's clear they tried to trade for Fitzgerald before Fitzgerald was washed up. They also tried to get Anquan Boldin but Boldin nixed it. We lost on Derrick Mason as well.

If I'm supposed to go with your rumors and speculation, why wouldn't I also believe all the rumors and speculation listed above?

The Pats biggest need was and is RT. The Pats are getting back Jonathan Jones and Jack Jones. Not a great CB situation, but manageable. The Pats are playing with four offensive linemen because whoever they put at RT is useless. Whether it is Anderson, Lowe, Sow, or Reif. They all have sucked in that position.

Sanu was not a great WR. The guy never had a 1,000 yard season. At his best, he was a solid #2 WR. I will give you Cooks. But they traded away as quickly as they traded for him. He was an one year rent of player.

And rumors they tried to get someone is not proof they tried to get someone. There are rumors all the time about the Patriots. Half the time it is the Pats just asking about the availability of players without showing strong interest for trade.

 

[Rob0729]

Hopkins has been at half his previous production for 4 straight years now. He is half the WR he used to be, and it's not a new thing. I'm not even talking about his missed games. I'm talking about production WHEN he plays. Granted, I only saw him a couple times a year when he was in Arizona, but during a year ( last year) in which the Patriots struggled to contain top WRs, we had Hopkins totally locked down last year (and that was without our top CBs).

Hopkins was a solid #1 receiver when he got back from his suspension last year. The guy had 717 yards and 3 TDs in 9 games last year. If you take the average of that and figure it out for 17 games, he would have had 1354 yards and 6 TDs last year. I know it doesn't work that way, but it shows he performed like a solid #1 receiver last year with no real QB.

 

[upstater1]

The Pats biggest need was and is RT. The Pats are getting back Jonathan Jones and Jack Jones. Not a great CB situation, but manageable. The Pats are playing with four offensive linemen because whoever they put at RT is useless. Whether it is Anderson, Lowe, Sow, or Reif. They all have sucked in that position.

Sanu was not a great WR. The guy never had a 1,000 yard season. At his best, he was a solid #2 WR. I will give you Cooks. But they traded away as quickly as they traded for him. He was an one year rent of player.

And rumors they tried to get someone is not proof they tried to get someone. There are rumors all the time about the Patriots. Half the time it is the Pats just asking about the availability of players without showing strong interest for trade.

When are we getting back Jack Jones?
Who are the RT we can trade for?

I listed a bunch of WRs we either got or traded for. But beyond that there was a lot of speculation on the guys we tried for but didn't get, from Mason, to Boldin to Fitzgerald. All this is a crapshoot and it doesn't happen for lack of trying. The idea we DON'T want great WRs is just absurd.

 

[Pape]

If you think Mac Jones is THE PROBLEM with the offense right now, you are not watching the games. You get better QB in here, he is still playing on an offense that cannot run the ball, an o-line that cannot pass protect, and receivers who cannot get open quickly. Mac Jones may not be the answer for this team, but he certainly isn't the biggest problem.

And I will admit that mocked was the wrong word. I couldn't remember the actual comment. I thought it was stronger than that.

BTW, you didn't like me making snarky comments in the past to you. And I promised you that I would try to tone it down with you. But now you come at me with nothing but snark. I don't care. I am a big boy and can handle it. But don't cry to me if I give it to you.

Dude, Based on what you have said, bring it on... I sent you that PM because you were acting like a little ***** in the Mac Jones thread by trying to constantly belittle me because you are an insecure little ****... Oooohhh poor me, everybody is attacking me, so i just attack you for no ****ing reason.... I was trying to be nice to you because i liked you as a poster... You constantly keep speaking out the other side of your mouth, trying to play things to make your self look good... You want to continue with the personal attacks? This time you will get them flung right back in your face...

Mac Jones is the ****ing problem... Has been for years... He's the same ****ing player in 2023 as he was in the later half of 2021... No different. No growth. No better. No worse. The only thing we can count on with him is losing games vs good teams. Open your ****ing eyes and watch the games

 

[TheRainMaker]

Bears paid a LOT of money for Tremaine Edmunds.. Why?

Desperation. Overall, he wasn’t very good in Buffalo.

 

[Rob0729]

Dude, Based on what you have said, bring it on... I sent you that PM because you were acting like a little ***** in the Mac Jones thread by trying to constantly belittle me because you are an insecure little ****... Oooohhh poor me, everybody is attacking me, so i just attack you for no ****ing reason.... I was trying to be nice to you because i liked you as a poster... You constantly keep speaking out the other side of your mouth, trying to play things to make your self look good... You want to continue with the personal attacks? This time you will get them flung right back in your face...

Mac Jones is the ****ing problem... Has been for years... He's the same ****ing player in 2023 as he was in the later half of 2021... No different. No growth. No better. No worse. The only thing we can count on with him is losing games vs good teams. Open your ****ing eyes and watch the games

LOL! I think after this little meltdown. I think we are done. I am sorry I had you so unhinged.

BTW, if I really cared about "making myself look good" I wouldn't be saying things that make all the Mac haters so insane. I really don't care what you or anyone else thinks of me.