Trey Flowers: “We’ve got six, we want seven.”

[mgteich]

$2M a year may mean nothing if you spend all of your money every year. On the other hand, $2M is likely worth $100K for LIFE.

So, it a matter of whether a number in a bank means something to player. For many, the number is irrelevant. They are the ones who are poor by the time they are 50.

At that level, it doesn't matter one bit with regard to your lifestyle. Not one iota. 15 million or 17 million? It's a number, little more, and hundreds of thousands become rounding errors.

I live in SoCal in the winter. The place is full of huge income folks - right down the street from me, on the Strand in South Bay (Hermosa/Manhattan), you can't touch a house for under 10m - and many in the 20m+ range (and there's rarely anyone staying in them, either, even though they're not for sale).

10% matters a lot more to someone making under a 100k than it does to someone making 500k...and matters a lot more to someone making 500k than it does to someone making 10m+. The actual dollar figures are a lot higher, sure, but the effect of that difference becomes less important as income increases (basic economics: the diminishing marginal utility of money). Once you get a salary into 7, 8 figures, it's just a number in a bank. You want to buy something? Buy it?

Worrying about affordable health care? Umm, no.

Worrying about retirement? Only if you're incredible stupid with your wealth.

 

[50-yard-line]

$2M a year may mean nothing if you spend all of your money every year. On the other hand, $2M is likely worth $100K for LIFE.

So, it a matter of whether a number in a bank means something to player. For many, the number is irrelevant. They are the ones who are poor by the time they are 50.

100k/year for life means a lot less when it's the 20th 100k/year for life, as in, it means next to nothing.

Again, the difference between having 25m in the bank or 30 million in the bank at retirement is negligible. If you want to talk at the lower levels - the 1-4m guys, the money difference will matter a lot more. Once you start carving between numbers like 14m - 17m, you're in irrelevant territory regarding financial security.

And no, the high-end, big money players who wind up poor in today's pricing for high-end athletes in the big four US sports are the ones who get ripped off by brokers/managers, or take huge risks and make very stupid investments, particularly those who think their ability to win on a field is the same thing as winning in business (see: Schilling, Curt - and he's not even "poor" after his wipe-out, by any means).

 

[mgteich]

I respect your view. I believe that there are many players (and wives, and agents) who take a different view.

100k/year for life means a lot less when it's the 20th 100k/year for life, as in, it means next to nothing.

Again, the difference between having 25m in the bank or 30 million in the bank at retirement is negligible. If you want to talk at the lower levels - the 1-4m guys, the money difference will matter a lot more. Once you start carving between numbers like 14m - 17m, you're in irrelevant territory regarding financial security.

And no, the high-end, big money players who wind up poor in today's pricing for high-end athletes in the big four US sports are the ones who get ripped off by brokers/managers, or take huge risks and make very stupid investments, particularly those who think their ability to win on a field is the same thing as winning in business (see: Schilling, Curt - and he's not even "poor" after his wipe-out, by any means).

 

[Deus Irae]

I respect your view. I believe that there are many players (and wives, and agents) who take a different view.

If by "many" you mean "damn near every single one ", I agree with you.

 

[50-yard-line]

I respect your view. I believe that there are many players (and wives, and agents) who take a different view.

Money is ego. Highest paid = BEST! in many minds. But with that, I mean the $$$$$ reported on a contract, not the net after taxes.

Agents? Of course - their resume is built on shiny huge deals.

Look at all the Free Agents who flock to the California NBA and baseball teams.

 

[patman52]

At that level, it doesn't matter one bit with regard to your lifestyle. Not one iota. 15 million or 17 million? It's a number, little more, and hundreds of thousands become rounding errors.

I live in SoCal in the winter. The place is full of huge income folks - right down the street from me, on the Strand in South Bay (Hermosa/Manhattan), you can't touch a house for under 10m - and many in the 20m+ range (and there's rarely anyone staying in them, either, even though they're not for sale).

10% matters a lot more to someone making under a 100k than it does to someone making 500k...and matters a lot more to someone making 500k than it does to someone making 10m+. The actual dollar figures are a lot higher, sure, but the effect of that difference becomes less important as income increases (basic economics: the diminishing marginal utility of money). Once you get a salary into 7, 8 figures, it's just a number in a bank. You want to buy something? Buy it?

Worrying about affordable health care? Umm, no.

Worrying about retirement? Only if you're incredible stupid with your wealth.

Well all I can say is that It would matter to me if I got 9 mill or 10.5 mill. Would it be the be all and end all, no. but it would have a significant bearing on my decision.

 

[50-yard-line]

Well all I can say is that It would matter to me if I got 9 mill or 10.5 mill. Would it be the be all and end all, no. but it would have a significant bearing on my decision.

The question was about living somewhere based on tax, not size of contract.

 

[jah]

Money is ego. Highest paid = BEST! in many minds. But with that, I mean the $$$$$ reported on a contract, not the net after taxes.

Agents? Of course - their resume is built on shiny huge deals.

Look at all the Free Agents who flock to the California NBA and baseball teams.

I dunno. It might be different in the NFL. I have to assume the constant big free agent signings in Jacksonville and Miami year after year have at least something to do with income tax.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Anyone on this board who is saying they would take millions less on a first contract needs to get their head examined

 

[JMC00]

Anyone on this board who is saying they would take millions less on a first contract needs to get their head examined

If the difference in guaranteed money between going somewhere new or staying was less than 10m I would absolutely think of and probably take less if I was comfortable professionally and personally where I was at

 

[RobertWeathers]

If the difference in guaranteed money between going somewhere new or staying was less than 10m I would absolutely think of and probably take less if I was comfortable professionally and personally where I was at

That's a financial evaluation not a personal one. $10m is a substantial chunk of change. I guess it depends on the total amount. If it's $200m vs $190m and you have family, friends and championships I would agree

 

[Zuma]

Anyone on this board who is saying they would take millions less on a first contract needs to get their head examined

I agree but at the same time I look at retired players who left the Pats for more $...for some IMO they are thinking “Damn...I would have had a ring if I stayed...maybe that ring would have helped me get to the HOF”.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I agree but at the same time I look at retired players who left the Pats for more $...for some IMO they are thinking “Damn...I would have had a ring if I stayed...maybe that ring would have helped me get to the HOF”.

Yeah. You'd have to ask them if they regret taking the cash

 

[ralmat55]

We like to romanticize it and say players play for rings. That only comes into play for players at the end of their careers having already made their money.

What the Patriots offer is an environment of success which allows players to build, rebuild or maintain their value as a football player that can help a team win games and be paid accordingly.

Most players don’t give home team discounts either. Instead, they recognize that they are more likely to maintain their value and earn more in the long term by taking less in the short term. If Flowers or any Patriot free agent takes less to remain with the Patriots, it will be because they have made this calculation and not out of loyalty or some desire for a gaudy piece of jewelry they’ll keep in a box at a bank.

 

[Ring 6]

100k/year for life means a lot less when it's the 20th 100k/year for life, as in, it means next to nothing.

Again, the difference between having 25m in the bank or 30 million in the bank at retirement is negligible. If you want to talk at the lower levels - the 1-4m guys, the money difference will matter a lot more. Once you start carving between numbers like 14m - 17m, you're in irrelevant territory regarding financial security.

And no, the high-end, big money players who wind up poor in today's pricing for high-end athletes in the big four US sports are the ones who get ripped off by brokers/managers, or take huge risks and make very stupid investments, particularly those who think their ability to win on a field is the same thing as winning in business (see: Schilling, Curt - and he's not even "poor" after his wipe-out, by any means).

My 2 cents. You can’t speak for anyone else. Many nfl players that made multi millions end up broke. Gronk still (supposedly) hadn’t spent a nickel of his NFL pay.
There careers are very short. If you live a lifestyle of someone who makes 10 mill a year and only make it for 8 years, you now have to live the entire rest of your life on what you saved in 8 years.
Assuming you net 5 of the 10 and save 50% of it after 8 years of making 10 mill and spending like you make 5 you have 20 left to last a lifetime.

 

[Adam Seward]

Could Pats pursue ex-Chiefs LB Houston?

Could be a solid plan B or C. I wonder if two big names on the market helps keep the cost down vs just one available amongst many suitors.

 

[supafly]

Could Pats pursue ex-Chiefs LB Houston?

Could be a solid plan B or C. I wonder if two big names on the market helps keep the cost down vs just one available amongst many suitors.

I could be wrong, of course, but it just seems like Houston is going to be too expensive for what he does. He’s mostly a pure pass rusher, and while he’s still pretty good, he seems to have taken a step or two back since he peaked in 2014.

If anything—and this may be something of an unpopular opinion—I think that Bennett could be the plan B at a reasonable cost. In my eyes, he would likely replace more of what Flowers brings in terms of being able to move both inside and out, as well as setting the edge and being able to provide a pass rush.

 

[GodBrady]

We like to romanticize it and say players play for rings. That only comes into play for players at the end of their careers having already made their money.

What the Patriots offer is an environment of success which allows players to build, rebuild or maintain their value as a football player that can help a team win games and be paid accordingly.

Most players don’t give home team discounts either. Instead, they recognize that they are more likely to maintain their value and earn more in the long term by taking less in the short term. If Flowers or any Patriot free agent takes less to remain with the Patriots, it will be because they have made this calculation and not out of loyalty or some desire for a gaudy piece of jewelry they’ll keep in a box at a bank.

Speaking of romanticizing... another area fans really have their blinders on is when they forget that no matter what, Trey Flowers is playing football for a living.

Worst-case scenario, Trey Flowers plays for the worst team in the league and misses the playoffs. At the end of the day, he's still playing ****ing game for a living. It's not like playing for the Jets is the equivalent of working a stressful entry-level retail job, whereas playing for the Patriots is working a cushy white-collar office job. It's more like cushy white collar job versus slightly different cushy white collar job.

Sometimes people frame this argument as if it's "okay, would you rather make $17M and be miserable, or make $15M and be happy?" Hell, we routinely hear that Belichick runs a super tight ship. Playing for the Patriots is arguably higher-stress and takes a bigger toll than other franchises. I get that pro athletes are competitive and that winning matters; that said, I'm sure they have the perspective to know that they still have lives outside of the game and that winning or losing isn't life or death.

 

[SBLIII]

Thank you for your contributions.

 

[patchick]

The marginal value of every extra dollar certainly decreases as a person's income goes up--it's no longer make or break in paying your rent, or letting your kids go to college without drowning in debt. It decreases, but it doesn't disappear. After a certain point, it changes. It's no longer just about lifestyle or "making sure your family is taken care of."

If I had an extra couple of million dollars, I admit it would go to straight to my retirement account to make sure I keep living comfortably for the foreseeable future. If I had millions beyond that, though, things would start getting interesting. As it happens, jewelry and yachts are not interesting to me. But making that cool business idea I've always had a reality? Heck yeah, that's interesting. Not to mention picking out local organizations and schools that are important to me and giving them endowments that would change their future, and potentially the future of hundreds of people they touch. Maybe even buying in to our corrupt political system by donating enough money to make political leaders listen to what I care about.

IOW, when the question comes up in these discussions, "Why does he even care about 10 vs. 15 million? He's set for life either way, right?" My thought is always "That's only the tip of the iceberg of what money can do."