There hasn't been much discussion about the mental makeup of these QB prospects...

[Force Zero Boomer]

...or he just really likes the color pink.

He's being deliberately subversive, running counter to norms to get attention. If it wasn't considered counter to norms, it wouldn't have been a story, but it was. He's attention seeking, and I've seen pro players like that before (Rodman, TO, for example) who have been bad for their teams in the end. It's a risk, but just a data point. I will not be surprised at all if he turns into a team cancer.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

for all of you that are absolutely terrified of Caleb Williams and his pink phone case and painted nails, the Bears staff spoke to several of his teammates, coaches, administration etc. and couldn't find one person that said a bad word about him. Do a little research and then post on here why he paints his fingernails.

In college he didn't have millions of dollars or an entourage. Look, I hope I'm wrong. We'll see how it pans out. I'll bookmark this post and we can revisit.

 

[BUSTAMOVE]

You look at the evidence, of course. For example, look at how Tom Brady would rally his team on the sideline. Did the player do that in college? How does a player perform in high pressure situations? For example, did he hang in there for some late game heroics despite taking a lot of abuse behind a porous offensive line? Do any of the prospects have criminal records? And there are many other things that could be discussed. For example, Caleb Williams' pink phone and matching fingernails. That strikes me as someone who will want the team to be about him, and that he will be a distraction. I might be reading too much into that one, but it's up for discussion.

And there's more. I know that teams have extensive meetings with players and do personality assessments. Some of the things that come out of those are never reported or just not widely known. For example, Rylan Leaf blew off the Colts pre-draft. That was a big red flag that did come out publicly.

Most of what you say is obvious to even fans
High pressure situations, criminal records, rally of team, etc

The stuff that we will never know but teams will. Is current NFL players and coaches that played and coached a candidate giving their prospective. Leadership, Intelligence and character etc
How smart is he in game management situations and reading defenses and going through progressions. You can get a little of it on interviews but such a small sample.
Teams hire private investigators to try and pry into their private lives. See what type of person they are going to get.

So the obvious has been discussed. Even Caleb’s pink phone

The real stuff that solidifies or disqualifies a candidate we will never know until sometimes years later when someone talks out of turn

 

[BTTA]

No it isn’t common or main stream. Especially in football players. Doesn’t make him a bad guy or anything. However it does show he wants to stand out and be the center of attention. See Cam Newton/ Joe Namath. However I would prefer to have my Qb wait till he has actually done something before he makes it all about him.

Well, I'm gonna go with what my kids, and their friends, tell me. They are generally distributed in high population areas in the northeast and on the west coast, where the majority of Americans live, and where "normal" generally gets started before spreading elsewhere. And I've seen a lot of pink accessorizing on people who otherwise are pretty low key.

It certainly isn't normal in sports circles, but that's a subculture that is far, far from representative of the rest of the population.

 

[ahmed]

It never is even though that's what separates great players from everyone else. Always thought it was weird how NFL never tried harder, through repeatable processes, to measure it.

 

[borg]

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

Most of what you say is obvious to even fans
High pressure situations, criminal records, rally of team, etc

The stuff that we will never know but teams will. Is current NFL players and coaches that played and coached a candidate giving their prospective. Leadership, Intelligence and character etc
How smart is he in game management situations and reading defenses and going through progressions. You can get a little of it on interviews but such a small sample.
Teams hire private investigators to try and pry into their private lives. See what type of person they are going to get.

So the obvious has been discussed. Even Caleb’s pink phone

The real stuff that solidifies or disqualifies a candidate we will never know until sometimes years later when someone talks out of turn

I never claimed it wasn't obvious. I said that I hadn't seen much discussion of it. Now it seems you're claiming that most of that is impossible for us, the fans, to know. Maybe, but that seems a bit too bold. For example, it would be great to know if Drake Maye turned into a petulant rage monster during games. You know, screaming at coaches, like Kelce or Mac Jones. It happens from time to time, even with Brady, but that'd be an interesting data point, and someone here may have watched a bunch of his games and have insight. It may show competitiveness, it may show lack of composure, but it sure would be interesting to discuss. It would also be interesting if he seemed level the whole game, a rock.

And then some of the most interesting posts have been about observations people have made watching whole games with these guys.

I'm just not part of "we can't possibly know any of this" crowd. We may get some tidbits here and there from reporters, from fans, stuff we stumble on ourselves, and all of them are interesting. As far as the "obvious has been discussed" point, no, I don't think it has. There has been very little discussion on character/player traits on this forum (from what I've seen). It's all been about measurables, can he make all the throws, arm strength, the type of offense, mobility, injury history, durability, etc.

If you're not interested, that's cool. If you think we've plumbed the depths, that's cool too. I just disagree.

 

[Jim Beankie]

I started talking about an aspect of it in the BGC 2024 QB thread, specifically looking at press conferences after a big loss. To me they were eye opening. Whether it matters, who knows? I'd like to think so, but it's tough to gauge it since there's a discrepancy in maturity between the 4-6yr QBs and 3 yr ones. The latter are still babies, and some of them acted that way. People can change and evolve for the better over time, though (like Nix), but that's the big unknown with the younger folk.

Edit: If they were ever a child model, that instantly eliminates them.

 

[moosekill]

Well, I'm gonna go with what my kids, and their friends, tell me. They are generally distributed in high population areas in the northeast and on the west coast, where the majority of Americans live, and where "normal" generally gets started before spreading elsewhere. And I've seen a lot of pink accessorizing on people who otherwise are pretty low key.

It certainly isn't normal in sports circles, but that's a subculture that is far, far from representative of the rest of the population.

Your kids and their friends can wear whatever they want. It isn’t common, it isn’t unheard of and once again it isn’t necessarily a bad thing just something to make himself stand out. Ps I have 5 sons between the ages of 34 and 19.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Hopefully the idiot evaluators of Zack Wilson are far away.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Leadership is so important for a qb.

3rd and 10 from your 20 yard line, you have to call a play and convince 10 men in that huddle that you can complete the throw!

None of the qb’s in this draft has leadership skills developed yet, except maybe nix

 

[venecol]

Unless the QB is a total trainwreck like Josh Rosen, there's very little that scouts/teams can do to measure the most important thing for a QB.

Can he read a pro defense (which they've never seen before)? Can he move around the pocket when freaks are about to destroy him? Can he get demolished and then get right back up and stand in there until the absolute final instant when he knows the only result for him other than a completion is pain?

Some of the twerpiest QBs were tough as hell. It was hard to know how they'd stand in there. I've seen the Patriots play in a lot of NFL stadiums and opposing fans always trotted out the ol' "Brady is a Lady" chant.

It all derived from this kind of stuff:

Or this:



Or dancing in Brazil, or kissing his son for 3 seconds on the lips, or the emotional physical bond he shares with Guerrero when Guerrero rubs Brady's loins, all of this is absolutely meaningless.

Brady, the most effeminate QB in recent memory, was the toughest QB in the NFL for 20 seasons. Only Ben Roethlisberger even came close to the level of guts in Brady. Maybe the other teams' scouts were assessing Brady based on his level of manliness.

Or you could talk to their coach.

"I told Bobby that they'd never regret drafting him and that Tom had every intangible you could ask for," Carr recalled by phone. "I remember his first scrimmage as a true freshman, when I was the interim coach and Tom wasn't physically developed yet. The defense just knocked the hell out of him, and he kept getting up. He took a beating and kept standing in there and throwing the ball, and that was the day the whole coaching staff realized just how tough Tom was."

 

[venecol]

It was from the movie Draft Day. Bo Callahan, QB Wisconsin. I put it in italics because it was a joke. That's what I thought of though when reading the post I replied to about no members from the USC team saying a bad word about Caleb Williams.

So you took a conversation about a real QB prospect and immediately thought about a fictional QB character in a movie? Got it.

 

[venecol]

He's being deliberately subversive, running counter to norms to get attention. If it wasn't considered counter to norms, it wouldn't have been a story, but it was. He's attention seeking, and I've seen pro players like that before (Rodman, TO, for example) who have been bad for their teams in the end. It's a risk, but just a data point. I will not be surprised at all if he turns into a team cancer.

Maybe he was just showing support for the women USC basketball players that he showed up to watch.

Or maybe he likes to troll homophobes and anti lgbtq assholes.

Idk. Idc. I could watch this kid all day long. Great pocket movement. Goes through his progressions. Can throw with touch. Can throw it on a rope. To all areas of the field. I hope he drops to #3.

 

[borisman]

So you took a conversation about a real QB prospect and immediately thought about a fictional QB character in a movie? Got it.

The joke in italics was relevant as in if someone would trash their star QB who is projected to be the #1 pick. But someone could dig up dirt on almost anyone if they really tried.
Not sure what your point was but feel free to not enlighten me.

 

[Huckleberry1]

who was that? i can't remember.

Bo Callahan. Seattle. Total bust.

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

who was that? i can't remember.

Wasn't that from the movie Draft Day with Costner?
EDIT- Didn't see Borisman's post.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

Maybe he was just showing support for the women USC basketball players that he showed up to watch.

Maybe!

Or maybe he likes to troll homophobes and anti lgbtq assholes.

Not here to talk about controversial aspects of culture or politics.

Idk. Idc. I could watch this kid all day long. Great pocket movement. Goes through his progressions. Can throw with touch. Can throw it on a rope. To all areas of the field. I hope he drops to #3.

I agree with the above. My biggest concern is his size: there have been *very* few elite quarterbacks in the modern era under 6'2".

 

[Boston Boxer]

In college he didn't have millions of dollars or an entourage. Look, I hope I'm wrong. We'll see how it pans out. I'll bookmark this post and we can revisit.

ah, keeping receipts. His biggest issue is his dad IMO. This kid needs professional representation