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Tanking for Trevor

2021 Patriots Season:
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Pick Results: MIA: 0% at NE: 0%

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Sep 12th

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Sicilian

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
I don't think that what happened with Luck and the Colts is proof that tanking doesn't work per se. But it is proof that having the "next guy" doesn't mean jack if you don't surround him with a good enough team.

I also think that finding the next QB capable of winning a Super Bowl for us will be easier (slightly) than those who tried in the last 20 years because that QB won't have to beat Tom Brady every year. Maybe someone like Mahomes takes over as the dream killer, but chances are we're going to see a regression to the mean once Brady retires, where winning one Super Bowl is awesome and winning two makes you the best in the modern game.
 

TB_Helmet

In the Starting Line-Up
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
The last QB that was the number 1 pick that was worth throwing a season away for was Peyton Manning.

Any other QB that was worth throwing a season away for was not taken at #1.
 

jah

Official PatsFans Gamer
PatsFans.com Supporter
The last QB that was the number 1 pick that was worth throwing a season away for was Peyton Manning.

Any other QB that was worth throwing a season away for was not taken at #1.

Is it even worth throwing a season away for Peyton? You get 1 ring out of that tradeoff.
 

XLIX

Pro Bowl Player
Is it even worth throwing a season away for Peyton? You get 1 ring out of that tradeoff.
How blessed we are that we can so casually dismiss a strategy that results in "only" 1 ring.

10 different teams have won the past 16 Super Bowls. That means 22 teams haven't won a Super Bowl in the past 16 years. So I'd say most of them would be happy with a strategy that results in "only" 1 ring over the life of a star QB.
 

jah

Official PatsFans Gamer
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How blessed we are that we can so casually dismiss a strategy that results in "only" 1 ring.

10 different teams have won the past 16 Super Bowls. That means 22 teams haven't won a Super Bowl in the past 16 years. So I'd say most of them would be happy with a strategy that results in "only" 1 ring over the life of a star QB.

Ask Eagles fans if they're okay with just one (they aren't). You get one ring by building a good team and getting lucky, not by tanking.

Also, name one time this strategy got a team even one ring.
 

XLIX

Pro Bowl Player
Ask Eagles fans if they're okay with just one (they aren't). You get one ring by building a good team and getting lucky, not by tanking.
OK I'll ask Eagles fans if they're ok with one ring. And you go ask Bills fans, Titans fans, Browns fans, Lions fans, Bengals fans, Bears fans, Redskins fans and Cardinals fans the same question.
Also, name one time this strategy got a team even one ring.
I never said the strategy worked. Tanking isn't a good strategy (that's why the NFL has no draft lottery). But that wasn't the question you asked. You asked: "Is it even worth throwing a season away for Peyton? You get 1 ring out of that tradeoff." The answer is yes, for most teams it would be worth the tradeoff of throwing away a full season to get 1 ring.
 

DropKickFlutie

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Tom Brady won the Citrus Bowl in a comeback and then beat Alabama in the Orange Bowl in a comeback.


Couldn't hurt to find a QB from a major conference who showed repeat moxy in huge stadiums....

.
 

Palm Beach Pats Fan

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
PFT has an article about how SF going 4-12 last year was instrumental in setting them up for this year's run. They didn't tank, per se, just didn't have a backup for JG and had many other key injuries. Getting Bosa & having other stockpiled picks really helped.

Maybe they are the 1-in-10 example where a really crappy season sparks lasting excellence.

49ers are now happy they went 4-12 a year ago
 

primetime

Pro Bowl Player
Tom Brady won the Citrus Bowl in a comeback and then beat Alabama in the Orange Bowl in a comeback.


Couldn't hurt to find a QB from a major conference who showed repeat moxy in huge stadiums....

.

Come on. Tom Brady was a once in a lifetime thing, 6th round Hall of Famers don't fall out of trees. Tanking isn't the best course but the best QBs still come in the 1st round.
 

MainePatsFan26

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
I don't think that what happened with Luck and the Colts is proof that tanking doesn't work per se. But it is proof that having the "next guy" doesn't mean jack if you don't surround him with a good enough team.

I also think that finding the next QB capable of winning a Super Bowl for us will be easier (slightly) than those who tried in the last 20 years because that QB won't have to beat Tom Brady every year. Maybe someone like Mahomes takes over as the dream killer, but chances are we're going to see a regression to the mean once Brady retires, where winning one Super Bowl is awesome and winning two makes you the best in the modern game.
I see Mahomes hobbling way too often to believe he'll be around in ten years. The guy could win four Super Bowls by then, if he gets a defense, but his tendency to get dinged will hurt his longevity.
 

Foxypats

Pro Bowl Player
If we were to seriously tank for anyone, we all know that Goddell will find a way to say we say we have""no integrity"" and take away our 1st round pick. It does not matter if several other teams have done it before, " it's now the big bad Patriots and it must be stopped ".
 

Froob

Independent Investigator & pliable af
PatsFans.com Supporter
I really don't think the Colts tanked. They wouldn't have signed Collins and later benched Painter if that were the case.
 

Clonamery

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
I really don't think the Colts tanked. They wouldn't have signed Collins and later benched Painter if that were the case.
Wut? Records with Painter, 0-9; Collins 0-3; Orlovsky 2-3.

After 1 game, no, 1 quarter, it should have been clear to the Colts that Painter was not an NFL starting QB. Tankity, tank, tank, tank.
 

Froob

Independent Investigator & pliable af
PatsFans.com Supporter
Wut? Records with Painter, 0-9; Collins 0-3; Orlovsky 2-3.

After 1 game, no, 1 quarter, it should have been clear to the Colts that Painter was not an NFL starting QB. Tankity, tank, tank, tank.
Why bench him at all? Caldwell would go on to get Painter in Baltimore, he clearly liked the guy for some strange reason.

The biggest flaw in the tank theory is that management and the coaching staff was fired. Why would they tank with no assurance they were coming back unless Irsay backstabbed them? I think we would have heard from Polian by now if he was screwed over.
 

sb1

Pro Bowl Player
Wut? Records with Painter, 0-9; Collins 0-3; Orlovsky 2-3.

After 1 game, no, 1 quarter, it should have been clear to the Colts that Painter was not an NFL starting QB. Tankity, tank, tank, tank.

Orlovsky was 30-37 353 yards, 2TD 1 pick in the game that season vs us. o_O Still amazed that Pats team was a drop away from winning the Super Bowl
 

Clonamery

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
Why bench him at all? Caldwell would go on to get Painter in Baltimore, he clearly liked the guy for some strange reason.

The biggest flaw in the tank theory is that management and the coaching staff was fired. Why would they tank with no assurance they were coming back unless Irsay backstabbed them? I think we would have heard from Polian by now if he was screwed over.
Fair. But turning to Collins was nothing but a name change.
 
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