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Salary Cap doesn't equal parity

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by everlong, Feb 7, 2019.

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  1. everlong

    everlong Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Since 2000 only 6 AFC teams and 12 NFC teams have made the SB. Only 5 AFC teams and 6 NFC teams have won the SB. Overall the AFC is 12-7. Of the teams below 8 comprised the 12 playoff participants from this past season. Had Pittsburgh not imploded (play laugh track), Denver not lost Sanders and Harris for the stretch run it could have been higher.

    From the rest of the league are there any teams who can break the monopoly? Minnesota, Dallas, Cleveland and especially KC will be the hot teams in the prediction threads but if one from each conference breaks through that would make 12/32 different winners in 20 years. Granted NE's domination has titled the numbers some what.

    Baltimore 2 2
    NE 9 6
    Denver 2 1
    Indy 2 1
    Pitt 3 2
    Oakland 1 0

    NYG 3 2
    Seattle 3 1
    Carolina 2 0
    Philly 2 1
    TB 1 1
    Rams 2 0
    Arizona 1 0
    Chicago 1 0
    NO 1 1
    GB 1 1
    SF 1 0
    Atlanta 1 0

    Team wins Makes it even more glaring. 6 teams have over 100 less wins than NE and 1 has over 100 less than Pitt.

    NWE 225
    PIT 197
    IND 190
    GNB 184
    PHI 181
    BAL 176
    DEN 175
    SEA 171
    NOR 170
    DAL 160
    SDG / LAC 157
    ATL 157
    MIN 155
    NYG 154
    KAN 154
    CAR 152
    TEN 151
    CHI 149
    MIA 144
    CIN 143
    NYJ 141
    STL / LAR 135
    SFO 135
    ARI 132
    TAM 131
    WAS 129
    BUF 127
    HOU 121
    JAX 121
    OAK 118
    DET 111
    CLE 93

    Playoff wins, NE has as many as #2+3 combined but from Minnesota to to the 4 teams not shown because they don't have a playoff win that equal 15 teams and they have equal to the Patriots 30 wins. You know it's skewd when the NYJs have more playoff wins than the bottom 7 franchises combined. This is all with giving Oakland and TB credit when neither has been relevant since 2002 which you can see by both being in the bottom quarter of season win total.

    NWE 30
    BAL 15
    PIT 15
    PHI 14
    IND 13
    SEA 13
    GNB 12
    NYG 10
    NOR 9
    CAR 8
    DEN 7
    ATL 6
    SFO 6
    NYJ 6
    ARI 5
    STL / LAR 5
    SDG / LAC 5
    MIN 4
    OAK 4
    DAL 3
    TEN 3
    TAM 3
    CHI 3
    JAX 3
    HOU 3
    KAN 2
    MIA 1
    WAS 1

    Good franchises who have the salary cap figure out, breed a good culture where winning comes first are always going to rise to the top. When Bill and Tom finally leave I know we won't be winning at the clip of the past 20 years but I bet the Krafts make the right hires to right the ship. Yes you need the QB but they'll figure that out too. Maybe they end up with a middle of the road guy but I don't see them going through Ponder after Losman after Leaf either.
     
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  2. borg

    borg PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    75% of NFC teams reaching the SB in 19 years is definitely a display of parity.
    NE's success (9 in 19) is the outlier

    Having a quality QB on a rookie contract is a huge advantage (2001-4)
    Having a great QB take 60 cents on the dollar is a huge advantage.
    Knowing an AFCE title is your floor every year and the real season begins in January is a huge advantage.
    Having a HC/GM with an economics degree is a huge advantage
    Having 2 decades of HC/QB continuity is a huge advantage
    etc

    Parity exists....NE just ignores it
     
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    Last edited: Feb 7, 2019
  3. Sicilian

    Sicilian Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    As Borg said, NE is an outlier. Parity doesn't mean everyone gets a turn winning, just that rules are set to make it harder to continue winning without a reset at some point.
     
  4. borg

    borg PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The Rams had the finest ingredients but the chef burnt the meal.
    BB prepared his famous Shepherd's Pie and the team feasted
     
  5. Simpelton

    Simpelton In the Starting Line-Up

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    Parity doesn't mean what some people think it does.

    What Parity means, and what it absolutely SHOULD mean, is that the thing that separates the haves from the have-nots is competence rather than money. Incompetent teams will still surf the basement, supercompetent teams will still dominate the league.

    The meaning of Parity is that you can't simply Steinbrenner your way to success. And the NFL is actually doing a pretty good job of that kind of parity. Even terrible teams can pay their players, and even excellent teams have to carefully weigh the pros and cons of bringing in additional talent.

    That said there is absolutely no way to enforce any kind of competence parity without a system of relegation. Which as we all know is something that is simply never going to happen. At the very least, the salary cap is doing a great job of letting the smartest teams in the league dominate and giving very poor teams a chance to get lucky if they play their cards right.

    For the record I would be all for creating a 12 team "shadow league" based in relatively open markets, that would allow you to relegate perennial underperformers to the shadow league and promote other, hungrier teams into their place... but that'd never get through the ownership. You could probably come up with a list of 12 towns to host NFL2 teams easily enough.
     
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  6. turkeyneck

    turkeyneck In the Starting Line-Up

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    The salary cap imposes complexity. Some organizations handle complexity better than others. In a complex environment, those most "complexity agile" will have a competitive advantage. The Pats are the masters of complexity in the NFL. Ironically, a mechanism imposed in order to equalize teams has handed a competitive advantage to the team that the NYJFL* most wants regressed to the mean.
     
  7. RelocatedPatFan

    RelocatedPatFan Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Theoretically, if you had a draft every year of all players, you might achieve competence parity - or closer to it. But that would be too crazy and not allow fans to have any type of bond with a team.

    Still great coaches would have the advantage as they always will.
     
  8. ALP

    ALP Pro Bowl Player

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    As has been posted, I think the end result, or equality of outcome that is sought, is mostly achieved, but depends largely on one factor:

    If your quarterback is any good: the teams since 2001 w good quarterbacks have won SBs, the ones without good QBs have not

    We just happen to have the GOAT, so we take what a good qb team would do (day Pitt), and take it a step further

    Then you add not just a great coach to it, which also helps, but the GOAT as well, so we tilt things even more

    A great qb (or one that plays great in at least some stretches) and great coach will prob get you 1-2 SBs in 10 years
     
  9. Simpelton

    Simpelton In the Starting Line-Up

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    And they always should. The salary cap allows competence to be the thing that separates great teams from terrible ones and we should all be 100% all for that.

    Our organization just happens to be absolutely insanely competent right now.
     
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  10. XLIX

    XLIX Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    “Parity” simply means teams have equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome.
     
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  11. 1960Pats

    1960Pats PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I have a solution (other than banning the Pats) and that's to have a salary cap scale. The top team each year starts at a certain figure and for each draft position drop you add 1.5 million. The #32 team picking would have a 46.5 million higher cap than #1.
     
  12. BlueThunder

    BlueThunder PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter Weekly Picks Winner

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    For some reason, that scaled salary cap would only give the Patriots an even bigger advantage....LOL
     
  13. Triumph

    Triumph Pro Bowl Player

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    Bingo.

    Just like in the USA.
     
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  14. Urgent

    Urgent In the Starting Line-Up

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    His’n and your’n my friend.
    You are right.
    I’d still bet on Belichick.
     
  15. Jimke

    Jimke Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    The Patriots win despite little salary cap room and poor draft position simply because
    they are smarter than everybody else.
     
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  16. patsfanincleveland

    patsfanincleveland Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    ....and have the smartest, best looking fan base.
     
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  17. maust1013

    maust1013 Just Another Guy PatsFans.com Supporter Weekly Picks Winner

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    The cap, rookie wage scale draft, FA and scheduling are all designed to defeat what New England has done. That New England has stayed on top simply proves something we've always known, at the end of the day the smartest guy in the room is still the smartest guy in the room. Oh, you also can't fix stupid...not even with duct tape.
     
  18. patsfanincleveland

    patsfanincleveland Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    If equality of outcome was desired, the league is going in the wrong direction because in today's league teams either have (or don't have) a franchise QB.

    The rules would have to mitigate not magnify that condition.
     
  19. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I've been talking about this for years........the same thing that intends to equalize the league prevents teams from doing anything about an instance such as a coach/QB combination....they're just going to have to wait it out and hope that coach doesn't find another QB
     
  20. tasmlab

    tasmlab Starting QB, won 20 SBs, number is retired PatsFans.com Supporter

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    My quick guess is that quality of coach, GM, staff and owner are completely independent from the salary cap, scheduling, and other parity-seeking actions. And probably completely more important and bigger advantages.

    IMO, it makes football more interesting and the salary cap a great idea. In one of the most physical, violent sports with the biggest number athletes, brains and decision making still rules the roost.
     
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