National Labor Relations Board gives Northwestern players the right to unionize

[primetime]

Everything you quoted there is completely wrong, but it's what I'd expect from an individual who clearly has an ax to grind.

As with graduate students, tuition remission would be included as part of the deal, meaning only the stipend would be taxable income (as upstater1 and I were discussing earlier in the thread while comparing graduate students and student-athletes) and then the lifetime learner credit would basically kick tax liability on that down to $0. Likewise, Northwestern and other universities provide health insurance coverage for all employees, so football players would not be any different. All students who receive financial aid receive this "privileged tax status" so it's not in any sense of the term privileged.

 

[pencilneckgeek]

Schools lose money on sports.

I don't see how that's relevant. There are lots of businesses that lose money. That doesn't exempt them from labor laws. The student-athletes want to unionize, and they are now permitted to do so. Whether it's a for-profit company paying dividends to shareholders, a non-profit where executives line their pockets, or a business that routinely loses money, that doesn't change anything. They just have to deal with it.

 

[TruthSeeker]

So I'm thinking that the right to unionize doesn't mean a whole lot. This gives them the opportunity to bargain but doesn't get them any money (which some people seem to be assuming); it just means that they can ask for something as a group instead of as individuals. Of course, NCAA rules prohibit giving of money so that's a non-starter from my perspective.

Naturally, this could be one of many stepping stones to paying (some) athletes. Of course, the vast majority of athletes can't be paid because there's no money to pay them. Ultimately, paying athletes in colleges is likely just a way to kill the golden goose depending on exactly how the laws are written and interpreted. At best, it will separate more schools from each other as some schools will pay more and others less. At worst, many colleges sports could decline or be eliminated as schools attempt to balance the money being paid out in some sports with cutbacks in other sports.

 

[SB39]

I don't see how that's relevant.

It's very relevant because the whole basis of this bid to unionize is the fact that universities are making millions of dollars off the "work" of the student athletes.

It is true the universities make money when you isolate (men's) basketball and football, but the overall department isn't doing quite so well.

 

[primetime]

It's very relevant because the whole basis of this bid to unionize is the fact that universities are making millions of dollars off the "work" of the student athletes.

It is true the universities make money when you isolate (men's) basketball and football, but the overall department isn't doing quite so well.

Actually the basis of the bid to unionize was that student-athletes are legally employees of the university based on the labor they provide, and that as employees this entitles them to rights as workers which include the right to organize and bargain collectively with their employers. The implications of that are not within the scope of the decision. I don't think you necessarily understand how law works.

 

[SB39]

Actually the basis of the bid to unionize was that student-athletes are legally employees of the university, and that as employees this entitles them to rights as workers. The implications of that are not within the scope of the decision.

The basis of their claim that they are "employees" stems from the fact that they are generating millions and millions of dollars for the university. You sure don't see the Northwestern University Women's Pole Vault team making this move to unionize.

 

[primetime]

The basis of their claim that they are "employees" stems from the fact that they are generating millions and millions of dollars for the university. You sure don't see the Northwestern University Women's Pole Vault team making this move to unionize.

Did you read any of the briefs or the decision? The basis of their claim that they are employees stems from the fact that they are required to work over 40 hours a week in non-academic activities. The decision uses the Brown case, which found that graduate students are not legally employees, as a comparison, as the extra work graduate students have to do is 'academic' while student-athletes perform non-academic labor to earn their academic scholarships (note that the jurist here is probably winking at the fact that the graduate student-not-labor claim upheld by a conservative NLRB is also very weak but will use that precedent to establish student-athletes as workers to then allow a challenge to Brown based on that).

The revenue they generate for their employer is completely irrelevant to the case. Employee is a legal status that has nothing to do with how profitable your employer is. The outcome of your (collective) bargaining will have something to do with how much production and revenue your labor generates but that's not within the scope of law.

The subject of this thread should really be "NLRB decides that Northwestern players have legal status as employees of the university and therefore have rights of workers"

 

[SB39]

The revenue they generate for their employer is completely irrelevant to the case.

That statement alone shows how little you know about this case.

Like I said, get back to me when the women's pole vaulting team unionizes.

 

[primetime]

That statement alone shows how little you know about this case.

Like I said, get back to me when the women's pole vaulting team unionizes.

The women's pole vaulting team is free to unionize or not - just as you are in whatever field you work in (as long as you're not a grad student!). They may feel that they have no need to organize and bargain collectively with their employers, but as they are now considered workers, they have that right.

Football and men's basketball players have much more power (a strike by the Alabama football team could cause hell to break loose in the state) but their power is completely insubstantial in whether the conditions of their labor entitle them to rights as workers. Which is what the judge said. That's how the law works, man.