Felger: Pat's glass still half-empty

[PatsSteve1]

The Pats have had a virtually unprecedented run of success that the "experts" all said was impossible -- now they continue to prophesize doom and gloom -- so maybe I'm a bit skeptical of THEM; maybe I'm drinkin' the proverbial kool aid...know what?, it tastes damn sweeeet![/QUOTE]

* Well, Dude there was nothing wrong with what Felger and nothing wrong with being skeptical. Every FA that's been brought in has not been a success and I guess at least Felger recalls that, dude.

 

[spacecrime]

And you got something "good" to say about Gramatica and Jones?? Well I dont. Some of you are major homers and see everything as a good move. Fine Jones and Gramatica are 'depth' nothing wrong with that. But to be dissapointed because Felger has nothing good to say about them .

So you think it is homerism to say Fleger sifted facts to mention MG's only two bad seasons, without mentioning the good deasons or the surgery that followed? I would say that you and Felger are deliberately showing a bias by picking only the facts that support the decision you've already made, and ignoring any fact which might contradict it.

There are some who think that Michael Stone, Chad Scott, Hank Poteat, Don Davis, etc, are better SS than Jones. Evidently you are one. But everyone who holds a different opinion than you is automatically a homer? That's the old, "This is my opinion and if you disagree something is wrong with you" stance.

That said, some of us recognize that BB and SP has brought us a few Lombardi's in the last few years, and by signing players most of us had little hope for, players who ended up winning the Championship. So we think that just maybe, BB knows a little more than some of us. Not you, but some of the rest of us. That is why we are sometimes willing to re-look at players that BB/SP select.

 

[PatsSteve1]

That said, some of us recognize that BB and SP has brought us a few Lombardi's in the last few years, and by signing players most of us had little hope for, players who ended up winning the Championship. So we think that just maybe, BB knows a little more than some of us. Not you, but some of the rest of us. That is why we are sometimes willing to re-look at players that BB/SP select.[/QUOTE]

* I don't really disagree with that, and I know you weren't quoting me in your reply, but one can't just look at the good players BB/Pioli have brought in without rememebering the Donald Hayes's and Duane Stark's. There's noone I'd rather have doing the chossing than BB/Pioli but 2002 and last year weren't the greatest of FA years. IMO, the FA's they've signed this year from other teams could go either way. They could be duds or good enough to do thier jobs and let others make the big plays. Maybe even make a couple themselves. Hard to tell on April 9th. I don't think anyone should be thinking the worst on 4/9 or thinking the 4th Lomardi is on the way either.

 

[SoonerPatriot]

I don't understand why some (like everyone on NEST) says there's "NO WAY" Caldwell can replace Givens. When he was starting he was putting up similar 3-4 catch a game numbers. He has the size and with a 2 year contract is playing for the money in two years. He's also a touch faster than Givens, let's see if he can get it done but it's nuts to say he cannot do it.

He'll get his shot. The only problem is if he can't get it done it will probably (but not definately) too late to do anything about it by that time and we will be stuck with a player that hasn't demonstrated a lot of productivity in his career. Maybe he just needs a change of scenery, or maybe he's just not that good. Either wa we'll find out, but again, if it's the latter options will be limited. I don't think people who write about this team should be expected to jump for joy and praise the signing of a player like they did when we traded for Dillon when that player hasn't show much at all in four or five years in the league.

 

[Aqua4Ever04]

://patriots.bostonherald.com/patriots/view.bg?articleid=134008&format=&page=2

Once again, Felger sifts his facts with a fine comb to make his point. Ranking on free agent signings Jones and Gramatica, he has nothing good to say about either. No mention at all in a 6 line paragraph about Gramatica's injury and rehab, just his 2004 record and absence last season.

Felger holds out as the only hope the weakness of the schedule and covers his bases by subliminally mentioning the possibility of 12 wins and a division title. Never knowledgeable as a football reporter, Felger now writes like radio talk show host "taking a stand" from a weak position in order to compete with a stronger opponent, which, in fact, he is.

Well grabbing a Dolphins reject shouldn't make you very happy and grabbing a guy who gets hurt for celebrating shouldn't make you do cartwheels either. I like this guy because he knows that the Pats run is over and the Fins will own the East for years to come.

 

[spacecrime]

one can't just look at the good players BB/Pioli have brought in without rememebering the Donald Hayes's and Duane Stark's.

Or Steve Martin. But just because they ALL didn't work out does not mean that BB/SP hasn't done a terrific job of selcting low cost FAs to fill out SB winning rosters.

Yeah, we won three superbowls in four years, but don't forget we signed Donald Hayes?

Tha's better than: All our FAs worked out well but we never made it to the Superbowl?

Sounds like that Colts fan, what's-his-name. Or our new Doofin Troll-Toy.

 

[Pats726]

The only good thing about Felgers radio show is that it allows me to turn off WEEI's yelling show (which only gives me a headache). Actually, another plus is that Felger will talk more football on his show than any other show in Boston, especially during the off season.

That said, Felger has changed and not for the better. Since the only local guests he can get are the ones banned from WEEI, such as Wrong Borges and Nick the **** Cafarto, they have polluted his mind and he is no longer able to see things clearly.

I also think Felger resents being 100% wrong about his thinking that the Patriots had to and would be keeping AV - had he only done his job, it was clearly evident that AV decided long ago to leave for reasons none of us will ever fully understand (not even Adam IMHO).

There is no reason for him to have not reported Gramaticas injuries and given him at least a chance to return to previous form, Caldwell could be very good, but again Felger gives him no chance, finally, T/Jones is a great pick up - instantly, our special teams just got faster, harder hitting and without a doubt BETTER. Why nothing but a passing "unknown" comment from him about Mitchell (I think he is very good)? Finally, he really offered no judgement on Warfield at all. Where is the other side of the coin Michael? He used to really presnet both sides, pro and com before he offered his opinion - lately, he cannot be bothered.

I wish he would stop and realize what got him where he is and return to his old style of unbiased, informative real information. Once upon a time he was very hardworking and it used to show in his work. It seems now he works too hard on his on air persona.

I agree with a lot of what you said about MF...and it is so so sad that he has been less objective and has instead followed Bordes down the road of negativity and poor thinking. It's all about the ratings and boosting him, but to me he shows again and again how
totally off the mark he is..how much of a pompous snail he is and how little he really knows. If he were writing in GB when younger he would have trashed Lombardi.

 

[PatsSteve1]

Or Steve Martin. But just because they ALL didn't work out does not mean that BB/SP hasn't done a terrific job of selcting low cost FAs to fill out SB winning rosters.

* I said there's no one I'd rather have doing the FA choosing, but when FA's are signed like Caldwell or Tebucky types, they could go either way. Duds or guys that really help out.

 

[arrellbee]

Well grabbing a Dolphins reject shouldn't make you very happy and grabbing a guy who gets hurt for celebrating shouldn't make you do cartwheels either. I like this guy because he knows that the Pats run is over and the Fins will own the East for years to come.

Better get a competent QB before you start counting your chickens.

 

[Aqua4Ever04]

Better get a competent QB before you start counting your chickens.

Culpepper is the 5th rated passer of all time. I don't think you were aware of that were you? I know my Fins inside and out and am a very knowledgable fan.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Well grabbing a Dolphins reject shouldn't make you very happy and grabbing a guy who gets hurt for celebrating shouldn't make you do cartwheels either. I like this guy because he knows that the Pats run is over and the Fins will own the East for years to come.

If you're talking about Felger, he may be brash and annoying but he isn't stupid. He actually thinks Culpepper will help you more than hurt you, which isn't saying much, although that remains to be seen. But he doesn't think your beloved 'fins are winning anything anytime soon. Nor does he think the Pats run is anywhere near over - not as long as Belichick and Brady remain.

FYI knowing your 'fins and knowing anything about football are obviously two seperate and distinct skill sets, as your mere existence here easily proves.

 

[the taildragger]

* Well, Dude there was nothing wrong with what Felger and nothing wrong with being skeptical. Every FA that's been brought in has not been a success and I guess at least Felger recalls that, dude.

...that smells like a comeback...

I can't respond to the first comment because I don't understand it. With the second comment you seem to be trying to explain/defend(?) Felger. If so, don't worry, I've heard him loud and clear: EVERY SINGLE MOVE THE PATS HAVE MADE SUCKS...THEY'VE DONE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING RIGHT. Please correct me if I've mischaracterized him.

and forgive those of us who prefer to take a wait and see approach to the offseason rather than pretend -- like Felger -- that we know all and that BB is clueless...please accept my sincere apology for being such an ass kissing kool aid drinker

 

[fgssand]

Culpepper is the 5th rated passer of all time. I don't think you were aware of that were you? I know my Fins inside and out and am a very knowledgable fan.

Hey Mr. indside /out knowledgeable fan - I suppose Marino is # 1 or something - put them both together and you end up with NO championships. Enjoy yourself now while you still can, the season will start in about 5 months and then your misery returns.

 

[arrellbee]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua4Ever04
Culpepper is the 5th rated passer of all time. I don't think you were aware of that were you? I know my Fins inside and out and am a very knowledgable fan.

Hey Mr. indside /out knowledgeable fan - I suppose Marino is # 1 or something - put them both together and you end up with NO championships. Enjoy yourself now while you still can, the season will start in about 5 months and then your misery returns.

I'll add to fgssand:
p.s. Peyton Manning is also one of the top rated passers of all time. Hmmmm.

Do you agree that if you are 'very knowledgable' that you would have to project more than just raw passing stats ?? ?? I think, correct me if I am wrong, that your basic premise is that the Dolphins are going to now be a dramatically winning team - and you seem to believe that Culpepper will be a significant factor in that. OK. So you would have to project his stats onto the Dolphin team. You would have to take into account the type of receivers that he had when he achieved the stats and determine whether the receivers that he will have with the Dolphins are the type of receivers that will give him the same opportunity to have such good ratings. You would have to ask (without too much predjudice) if the Dolphins offensive unit is actually better overall than the Vikings offensive unit - because Culpepper's individual 'stats' didn't translate into a winning offense with the Vikings.

So it depends on which way you are 'very knowledgable'.

p.s. Peyton Manning is also one of the top rated passers of all time. Hmmmm.

 

[spacecrime]

* I said there's no one I'd rather have doing the FA choosing, but when FA's are signed like Caldwell or Tebucky types, they could go either way. Duds or guys that really help out.

All the signings could go either way. Anyway can be a bust or turn to crap befoer your eyes. Or blossom.

Good players lose it. lazy underachieves see the light. Players learn technique. they get motivated after being cut a couple times.

Any player you sign late in FA, after everyone else has passed, is a gamble. But they are cheap, and that is how you build quality depth, by getting quality players cheap, as opposed to signing 10 or 15 UDFAs to fill out the lower third of your roster at $220,000 each, or wahtever the rookie minimum is.

If you hit half great players and half duds for low $$$, you are way ahead of hte game. Youk can cut most of the duds, and the ones you are stuck with are more than compensated for by all the good players you got.

It's when you get conservative and fearful, when you want to make sure that you don't get any duds, that you totally miss out on quality inexpensive palyers.

Was anyone here excited when BB signed David Patten from the Arena league, or Roman Phifer from the old folk's home? Signing Patten looked a lot worse at the time that signing Tebucky Jones does now.

We took a chance on Patten, but we did sign a pair of quality receivers from Phila: CHarles Johnson and Torrance Small. Patten was the gamble, the guy who was likely to be a dud. Instead he was #2, and Johnson and small vanished into the woodwork. That year BB gave 1.5 mil ot CB Terrence Shaw and minimum to OTIS.

You just don't know. You take the losses and duds in stride, acknowledging that they are NOT mistakes, but part of the process.

Don't worry about the Donald Hayes's and Steve Martin's. They are part of the process that nets the Mike Vrabels and Rodney Harrisons.

 

[spacecrime]

Felger. If so, don't worry, I've heard him loud and clear: EVERY SINGLE MOVE THE PATS HAVE MADE SUCKS...THEY'VE DONE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING RIGHT. Please correct me if I've mischaracterized him.

No correction necessary. The funny thing is that he acts like he knows so much more about personnel than BB/SP. Like he is the guys who studied tape on the guy, and worked with him, and interviewed him, etc.

Nope, Fleger can tell by recalling TV broadcasts who is worthy and who is not.

Yeah, we do the same, we all have our favorites. But we are fans. We sometimes fall in love with a guy or hate him because of a single game or even a single play. He is supposed to be a reporter. He is supposed to give us the big picture. Not rant like a newbie fan.

I used to like him a lot. Then came Curran, and then Reiss. And away went Felger, down the drain.....

 

[PatsSteve1]

Was anyone here excited when BB signed David Patten from the Arena league, or Roman Phifer from the old folk's home? Signing Patten looked a lot worse at the time that signing Tebucky Jones does now.

* True enough, but there was also some here who had Duane Starks making people forget Ty Law and Biesel was going to step right in and replace Te3d Johnson. Overall BB/Pioli have done a great job at this. But even they don't know how it's going to rurn out. BB often says it takes 4-6 games before he knows what kind of team he has. I thought they really did thier best overall FA job in 2001 when they brought in a boatload of UFA's and they mostly did good jobs and they won a SB with them. And BB was as surprised as anyone about that telling his longtime friend Ernie Adams after that game, "can you beileve we won the SB with that team?"

And how did this thread degenerate into a Dolphins smack topic?