Celtics 2026-2027 Discussion

[RobertWeathers]

This was inevitable.

New NBA cap rules make is almost impossible for Brad to build a champion around two supermax deals with pot'l JT and JB taking up 70% of the cap.

JB was eligible for an extension 7/26. No way was Brad gonna pay him $142m/2y.

As for the return on the trade, it is what it is. The entire league knew Brad wanted to dump JB and he got what he could get. I'm certain he didn't want to trade him to Philly but it was the best he could do for a return. His track record on deals is too good to be asleep at the wheel on this one.

Not sure Brad can flip George this year. If not, if he can give them 25 minutes/60 games at 17/6/4 at $54m then whatever. The 2027 player option/expiring contract at $56m makes this (hopefully) a 1 year deal.

I don't think Brad is done with the summer horse trading. Derrick White?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

This was inevitable.

New NBA cap rules make is almost impossible for Brad to build a champion around two supermax deals with pot'l JT and JB taking up 70% of the cap.

JB was eligible for an extension 7/26. No way was Brad gonna pay him $142m/2y.

As for the return on the trade, it is what it is. The entire league knew Brad wanted to dump JB and he got what he could get. I'm certain he didn't want to trade him to Philly but it was the best he could do for a return. His track record on deals is too good to be asleep at the wheel on this one.

Not sure Brad can flip George this year. If not, if he can give them 25 minutes/60 games at 17/6/4 at $54m then whatever. The 2027 player option/expiring contract at $56m makes this (hopefully) a 1 year deal.

I don't think Brad is done with the summer horse trading. Derrick White?

White is literally my favorite Celtic of all time but at this point, I could understand if they trade him. That said I feel like our own fans are really undervaluing him. The report was that Minnesota wanted him for either or Reid or Gobert but the Celtics required additional draft compensation.

I get that he had an off shooting year, but his advanced stats were still very good and he had an absurd number of blocks for a guard, it was like twice as many as the next guard. Plus the leadership and composure aspect.

Best plan might be just to see how good the team is and if they can really contend, and if they appear to be a couple years away, perhaps trade him during the season. However, I think people are under the impression that his low shooting percentage indicates age has caught up to him, but when you think about it, his superb athleticism on defense should indicate that age is not that big of a factor for last season. The athleticism does not appear to be in steep decline. White’s only weakness is he doesn’t have the offensive burst and handle to create his own space and shots, hence offensively he is more of a scheme and spacing dependent player..

 

[Vindicate]

It cannot be mentioned enough: a terrible return. Regardless of what the future needed to be for the Celtics, you just traded in division, created maybe the best back court in the NBA, and got a bloated, aged PG.

The only way shade of positivity I am entertaining: I am excited to see JT lead a team full-on and PG will be a decent complimentary piece. I'm also excited for JB to go where he'll be more celebrated by his organization.

I liked JB a lot. Outspoken, not afraid of the media, a great two-way player, a motivator, and more. Sucks that the FO fumbled this as hard as they did. Even if the plan was to oust JB, they ****ed it up big time.

 

[borisman]

Just for the record, PG13 (let's just call him that moving forward, instead of PG) just turned 36. He's not 37. He's not the same player he was when he snapped his leg but if/when healthy can still ball out and play defense. He can lock down someone like Jaylen Brown, as evidenced in their last series.

Also, the picks we get in return are not as bad as when I first heard the news. LAC picks could all be in the lottery. I haven't seen anything about any protections for those picks. That could be a HUGE get in a sense they can also be traded for a better player in the next year or two.

As far as why Brown is no longer here, it's about the money and his overvalue as a player. He was eligible to sign an extension, again, this off-season. That wasn't happening. He wasn't worth it when he became the highest paid player and he's not worth it now. (none of them are but that's another story). I just think JB is highly overrated at this moment in time. He'll punk the sisters of the poor but when it's time to ball out he's not the killer that a top 10 player usually is. And he'll be the third wheel in Philly to Embiid and Maxey. Yes, I think Maxey is the better player of the two.

So, I'm not as angry today as I was yesterday. I think this will work out better than people think. Just not for the people that are impatient and don't want to wait another year before this team REALLY improves to it's championship level contender.

 

[jdlboot14]

Pretty disappointed. We knew JB & JT couldn't co-exist for much longer, but the way it went down - especially what we got for him - makes this feel like a organizational fail. They tipped their hand too early, Brad had no leverage, and it appears JB had soured more knowing his perception by the FO was just trade bait.
Don't know who else they can lure here, but it's going to be Tatum & a bunch of mids this year. Who is going to blossom?
Walsh, Scheierman, Cenac as a rookie??
Pritchard & White will do their thing, but PG is old, and Robinson/Queta/Garza are not dominant inside. Probably a down year.
Good thing the Pats are back at the top!

 

[jimnance]

Best player in professional women's basketball. She would disagree vehemently with the post. She ain't stupid.

Thanks. I dont follow women's hoops. Like watching paint dry.

 

[jimnance]

It cannot be mentioned enough: a terrible return. Regardless of what the future needed to be for the Celtics, you just traded in division, created maybe the best back court in the NBA, and got a bloated, aged PG.

The only way shade of positivity I am entertaining: I am excited to see JT lead a team full-on and PG will be a decent complimentary piece. I'm also excited for JB to go where he'll be more celebrated by his organization.

I liked JB a lot. Outspoken, not afraid of the media, a great two-way player, a motivator, and more. Sucks that the FO fumbled this as hard as they did. Even if the plan was to oust JB, they ****ed it up big time.

I also like JB. Probably like him more off the court than on. He's an interesting and very thoughtful dude. Never knee-jerk. Speaks his mind but tries to look at multiple sides of issues.
As for on the court, which is what truly matters: he has many strengths and always kept working to improve, which he did. But his game still has holes. He's a smart guy but his basketball IQ is not on the same level as DWhite and Tatum. He's a very good player, but not top 10. Somewhere 10-15.
Stevens,oth, us one if the very best in the business.
Too early to say anyone ****ed up. All reasons for trades are not always known immediately. There's a little more yo it than just the initial swap.
Maybe you should be more like JB and not give a knee-jerk reaction to a trade that might take several years to measure it.

 

[Thelonious]

They did not get an adequate return for him. On the other hand, he is an ass. Apparently the real mistake was in misevaluating his lousy character. This happens a lot in sports.

 

[RobertWeathers]

White is literally my favorite Celtic of all time but at this point, I could understand if they trade him. That said I feel like our own fans are really undervaluing him. The report was that Minnesota wanted him for either or Reid or Gobert but the Celtics required additional draft compensation.

I get that he had an off shooting year, but his advanced stats were still very good and he had an absurd number of blocks for a guard, it was like twice as many as the next guard. Plus the leadership and composure aspect.

Best plan might be just to see how good the team is and if they can really contend, and if they appear to be a couple years away, perhaps trade him during the season. However, I think people are under the impression that his low shooting percentage indicates age has caught up to him, but when you think about it, his superb athleticism on defense should indicate that age is not that big of a factor for last season. The athleticism does not appear to be in steep decline. White’s only weakness is he doesn’t have the offensive burst and handle to create his own space and shots, hence offensively he is more of a scheme and spacing dependent player..

Agree 100%. He's is my tier 2 of fav C's of all-time. I keep bringing him up in trade as he has max value right now. No way can they can't trade him now unless they upgrade the G position. Their backcourt defense would become the worst in the league.

Depending on how the season goes he might be a Feb salary dump. Just gotta see how it goes.

 

[Vindicate]

I also like JB. Probably like him more off the court than on. He's an interesting and very thoughtful dude. Never knee-jerk. Speaks his mind but tries to look at multiple sides of issues.
As for on the court, which is what truly matters: he has many strengths and always kept working to improve, which he did. But his game still has holes. He's a smart guy but his basketball IQ is not on the same level as DWhite and Tatum. He's a very good player, but not top 10. Somewhere 10-15.
Stevens,oth, us one if the very best in the business.
Too early to say anyone ****ed up. All reasons for trades are not always known immediately. There's a little more yo it than just the initial swap.
Maybe you should be more like JB and not give a knee-jerk reaction to a trade that might take several years to measure it.

It's a bad trade. it's okay to say it lol. They got a pittance of a return for an MVP-caliber player. That isn't knee-jerk, it is what it is. Even they wanted a lot more but Philly talked them down. They clearly walked themselves into an unfavorable position after the Giannis push. Knee-jerk is calling it the worst trade in Boston history. Fact of the matter is, regardless of where teams end up, they should have gotten more. I don't even doubt that JB "had to leave" - the failure is in the return.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

People saying Jaylen Brown is an MVP caliber player or a great two-way player are also ignoring the advanced stats side of the argument.

The ESPN article goes through this. NBA GM’s seem to be more aligned with myself and the Brown “haters” when it comes to this stuff…

If he’s such an incredible 2 way player and he’s an MVP player why is it that his on off court always year after year shows the team is better with him off the court and their record constantly reflects that as well? This isn’t like a small sample size. It is constant.

Now this is no longer a message board troll thing. It’s made its way into reality as you can see with this lowly return. People were hating on Mark Stein for reporting that this was the case. But in the end, it seems he was closer to the reality of the situation.

If you look at the compensation, it suggests that Brown is probably closer to a top 30 player than a top five player. Because a top 30 player is borderline on whether or not they’re actually worth a max contract. This is why the Celtics needed to take Paul George’s contract in exchange in order to get these draft picks.

And while people are pissed at the Celtics, and I get it, let’s remember that if Jaylen Brown were really a top 10 NBA player, the Bucks absolutely would’ve made the deal for Giannis to begin with.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Agree 100%. He's is my tier 2 of fav C's of all-time. I keep bringing him up in trade as he has max value right now. No way can they can't trade him now unless they upgrade the G position. Their backcourt defense would become the worst in the league.

Depending on how the season goes he might be a Feb salary dump. Just gotta see how it goes.

Well, supposedly, Brad thinks White had a better season than Brown, so if he's going to be traded they must be looking for FIVE picks for him, given that they let Brown go for a lot less (plus a 36 yr old often injured PG)!

I'm being facetious, though I do agree that fans don't value him enough - but I just don't see how you look at Brown's season and White's and say White had a better season, so that's complete spin. (White certainly didn't have a bad season, even with a lackluster playoff performance, but he's not the reason they lost either.)

So I'm fully open to trading White for players and picks, especially now that they are restructuring the team, but I'm prepared to be underwhelmed.

As far as Brown, as others had pointed out, you DO have to consider the context that the Celtics were not going to extend him this season for $142 million over 2 extra years. So if one thinks Brown was already PO'd about being dangled as trade bait after a career season, you have to think he was going to be even MORE disgruntled if they didn't extend him later this month.

Add into that the context that Brown was unlikely to replicate his performance this season with Tatum back and getting shots, that almost forces Brad to trade him now. None of that was a secret, which is why the Celts were not trading from a position of power, as evidenced by this trade that includes a 1st round pick a half a decade from now.

But I'm still like, WTF - you replaced Brown with an injured 36 year old Paul George who actually makes MORE than Brown (for right now anyways) - and all the value you really got were 2 first round draft picks plus one year less on a contract AND you traded him to a division rival who just ousted you in the playoffs?

And that's the best they could come up with???

Celtics rumors: Boston felt Derrick White outperformed Jaylen Brown last season

The Celtics apparently believe that Derrick White had a better season than Jaylen Brown even though the latter finished 6th in MVP voting.

sports.yahoo.com

 

[JoeSixPat]

Agree 100%. He's is my tier 2 of fav C's of all-time. I keep bringing him up in trade as he has max value right now. No way can they can't trade him now unless they upgrade the G position. Their backcourt defense would become the worst in the league.

Depending on how the season goes he might be a Feb salary dump. Just gotta see how it goes.

Well, supposedly, Brad thinks White had a better season than Brown, so if he's going to be traded they must be looking for FIVE picks for him, given that they let Brown go for a lot less (plus a 36 yr old often injured PG)!

I'm being facetious, though I do agree that fans don't value him enough - but I just don't see how you look at Brown's season and White's and say White had a better season, so that's complete spin. (White certainly didn't have a bad season, even with a lackluster playoff performance, but he's not the reason they lost either.)

So I'm fully open to trading White for players and picks, especially now that they are restructuring the team, but I'm prepared to be underwhelmed.

As far as Brown, as others had pointed out, you DO have to consider the context that the Celtics were not going to extend him this season for $142 million over 2 extra years. So if one thinks Brown was already PO'd about being dangled as trade bait after a career season, you have to think he was going to be even MORE disgruntled if they didn't extend him later this month.

Add into that the context that Brown was unlikely to replicate his performance this season with Tatum back and getting shots, that almost forces Brad to trade him now. None of that was a secret, which is why the Celts were not trading from a position of power, as evidenced by this trade that includes a 1st round pick a half a decade from now.

But I'm still like, WTF - you replaced Brown with an injured 36 year old Paul George who actually makes MORE than Brown (for right now anyways) - and all the value you really got were 2 first round draft picks plus one year less on a contract AND you traded him to a division rival who just ousted you in the playoffs?

And that's the best they could come up with???

Celtics rumors: Boston felt Derrick White outperformed Jaylen Brown last season

The Celtics apparently believe that Derrick White had a better season than Jaylen Brown even though the latter finished 6th in MVP voting.

sports.yahoo.com

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Well, supposedly, Brad thinks White had a better season than Brown, so if he's going to be traded they must be looking for FIVE picks for him, given that they let Brown go for a lot less (plus a 36 yr old often injured PG)!

I'm being facetious, though I do agree that fans don't value him enough - but I just don't see how you look at Brown's season and White's and say White had a better season, so that's complete spin. (White certainly didn't have a bad season, even with a lackluster playoff performance, but he's not the reason they lost either.)

So I'm fully open to trading White for players and picks, especially now that they are restructuring the team, but I'm prepared to be underwhelmed.

As far as Brown, as others had pointed out, you DO have to consider the context that the Celtics were not going to extend him this season for $142 million over 2 extra years. So if one thinks Brown was already PO'd about being dangled as trade bait after a career season, you have to think he was going to be even MORE disgruntled if they didn't extend him later this month.

Add into that the context that Brown was unlikely to replicate his performance this season with Tatum back and getting shots, that almost forces Brad to trade him now. None of that was a secret, which is why the Celts were not trading from a position of power, as evidenced by this trade that includes a 1st round pick a half a decade from now.

But I'm still like, WTF - you replaced Brown with an injured 36 year old Paul George who actually makes MORE than Brown (for right now anyways) - and all the value you really got were 2 first round draft picks plus one year less on a contract AND you traded him to a division rival who just ousted you in the playoffs?

And that's the best they could come up with???

Celtics rumors: Boston felt Derrick White outperformed Jaylen Brown last season

The Celtics apparently believe that Derrick White had a better season than Jaylen Brown even though the latter finished 6th in MVP voting.

sports.yahoo.com

Because the most important thing for the Celtics, and most teams, is which player leads to better results on the scoreboard? If you look at it that way then, yes, Derrick White had a better season than Jaylen Brown. On this list, you can see there are role players who pop up because they get carried by great players, but typically the first guy from each team on the list is gonna be their best player. FYI, Queta and Hauser are also in the top 30. This is where Brown is always very very low compared to where you would think.

Plus minus for one game is subject to a lot of randomness and luck. Over a full season, much less so. Over like 3 to 5 years, arguing against it sounds kind of crazy. And that has been a story with white versus brown and their value to the team for the last four years.

Beyond this any Celtics fan is lying through their teeth if they say they would rather have Brown with the ball in his hands on the last possession of the game instead of White. We all know who we trust the most when it matters the most.

2025


2024


2023

2022

 

[bresna]

Because the most important thing for the Celtics, and most teams, is which player leads to better results on the scoreboard? If you look at it that way then, yes, Derrick White had a better season than Jaylen Brown. On this list, you can see there are role players who pop up because they get carried by great players, but typically the first guy from each team on the list is gonna be their best player. FYI, Queta and Hauser are also in the top 30. This is where Brown is always very very low compared to where you would think.

Plus minus for one game is subject to a lot of randomness and luck. Over a full season, much less so. Over like 3 to 5 years, arguing against it sounds kind of crazy. And that has been a story with white versus brown and their value to the team for the last four years.

Beyond this any Celtics fan is lying through their teeth if they say they would rather have Brown with the ball in his hands on the last possession of the game instead of White. We all know who we trust the most when it matters the most.

2025


2024


2023

2022

I wouldn't hang my hat on a +/- rating as some sort of yardstick of greatness. It's a stat that actually highlights players that stay on the floor with a great second unit, as Tatum often did. Why else would Hauser be listed in 2023/24?

Let's see - ask Google AI:
Raw plus-minus (+/-) can be deeply flawed. It only measures the scoreboard difference while a player is on the floor. It heavily penalizes great players stuck with bad bench units and inflates the numbers of role players who happen to share the court with superstars.

Supposedly, Net Rating is a better measuring stick of effectiveness. You know who led the Celtics in Net Rating? Neemias Queta. Does that mean Queta is better than Brown? Hell no. BTW, Hugo was second on the team in Net Rating.

If NBA GMs are skimming over these advanced metrics and cherry-picking ones they like without truly understanding what they really mean, they're morons.

 

[rochrist]

This was inevitable.

New NBA cap rules make is almost impossible for Brad to build a champion around two supermax deals with pot'l JT and JB taking up 70% of the cap.

JB was eligible for an extension 7/26. No way was Brad gonna pay him $142m/2y.

As for the return on the trade, it is what it is. The entire league knew Brad wanted to dump JB and he got what he could get. I'm certain he didn't want to trade him to Philly but it was the best he could do for a return. His track record on deals is too good to be asleep at the wheel on this one.

Not sure Brad can flip George this year. If not, if he can give them 25 minutes/60 games at 17/6/4 at $54m then whatever. The 2027 player option/expiring contract at $56m makes this (hopefully) a 1 year deal.

I don't think Brad is done with the summer horse trading. Derrick White?

We'll be luccky is PG manages 30 games. Look at his record over the past few seasons. It isn't going to get better as he closes in on 37.

 

[rochrist]

They did not get an adequate return for him. On the other hand, he is an ass. Apparently the real mistake was in misevaluating his lousy character. This happens a lot in sports.

Would you care to explain what aspects of his character are lousy?

 

[Thelonious]

Would you care to explain what aspects of his character are lousy?

No, I would not. I'll just say that narcissistic blowhards are not my thing. A chacun son gout.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Beyond this any Celtics fan is lying through their teeth if they say they would rather have Brown with the ball in his hands on the last possession of the game instead of White. We all know who we trust the most when it matters the most.

Yup. Tatum, as it has been for awhile. Which may be part of the issues between the Jays. Brown saying his favorite season was the one without Tatum probably didn't go unnoticed by him either.

I do think that there was more going on behind the scenes between the two of them than we know. I don't think Tatum has yet even said anything about the trade, which is kindof weird for a teammate from a championship team. Some think that Tatum is a big Paul George fan and hence, of all the trades out there, perhaps wanted to play with him - which is short sighted.

But there's still the question of whether the team is better with Paul George or Brown. The PPG tells us that it's Brown, although George actually has a better 3 pt %

I'm thinking we're still going to see a heckuva lot of 3 point shots this season now, and I was hoping they'd get away from that, especially with a lead in crunch time. Maybe they're not done with trades but while I'm open to trading White, I think his leadership and stats you cite make the case to keep him.

That being said, while we were treated to an exciting season in what probably would have been a gap year, we might be looking at a gap year WITH a healthy Tatum this year, which is unfortunate, but we are all cognizant that to contend, they need to spend, and there's limits to that for now.

 

[RobertWeathers]

We'll be luccky is PG manages 30 games. Look at his record over the past few seasons. It isn't going to get better as he closes in on 37.

Agree. What I outlined is aspirational but might come close to justifying the salary.

37 games won't cut it.