The Bill megathread (HC at UNC, girlfriend, etc.)

[Bill Lee]

And most importantly… where did Brady come from? Did he appear from the mist like Excalibur, did he land on the lawn of Foxboro like Superman? No, he was a developmental QB who needed a lot of work to become who he was. If he landed in Arizona instead of New England, anyone outside of a Michigan fan would not even know his name.

Truth.

TB12 almost didn't get drafted by us, either. IMO there's a very good chance he doesn't get drafted and doesn't make any team, or he gets drafted and gets cut in camp, one and done. He got damn lucky that he got picked by us, and that we kept him around long enough for him to light a fire under his ass and start putting in the work to hone his skills. Tom himself says his rookie year was ****, and that he only kicked it in gear once he read a coach's report about his many weaknesses in the off season after his rookie year.

Even once he got the starting job, there still was a huge set of Drew Bledsoe supporters who thought he should have the job back. It was BB who recognized he could build a winning team around TB12's skill set. A different coach very well could have chosen to stick with the big tall QB with the rifle arm that was drafted #1 overall.

I get why people adore Tom, but it's not like he was this sure-fire #1 prospect that anyone could develop. If anything, that person was Drew. Tom was a very rough prospect coming out of college. Being drafted in the sixth round says it all. Tom could very well have failed to develop in a different place under a different coaching staff.

 

[Bill Lee]

One time. That HOF coach will be in the HOF because of the HOF QB. Still not an answer to my question tho

And that HOF QB became a HOF QB because the HOF coach had the balls to promote him over the QB his team picked #1 overall and made the best-paid player in the league.

 

[lancerman]

And that HOF QB became a HOF QB because the HOF coach had the balls to promote him over the QB his team picked #1 overall and made the best-paid player in the league.

You mean that coach saw that the future HOF QB was better than the current QB in practice but still decided to go with older worse QB because he had more experience and was paid more. Then an injury forced his hand.

 

[sb1]

And that HOF QB became a HOF QB because the HOF coach had the balls to promote him over the QB his team picked #1 overall and made the best-paid player in the league.

Did he though? Brady didn't start the season. He only played once Drew got hurt.

Sure he could have put Drew back in later in the season when he was ready but the team was winning with Tom. I don't know how many coaches would have switched them back if the team was consistently winning. If you switch them back at that point then you're the Buffalo Bills with Doug Flutie and Rob Johnson.

 

[lancerman]

Did he though? Brady didn't start the season. He only played once Drew got hurt.

Sure he could have put Drew back in later in the season when he was ready but the team was winning with Tom. I don't know how many coaches would have switched them back if the team was consistently winning. If you switch them back at that point then you're the Buffalo Bills with Doug Flutie and Rob Johnson.

Very few coaches would have switched back to a QB who was 5-13 in his most recent stretch when the current QB was winning.

 

[signbabybrady]

Did he though? Brady didn't start the season. He only played once Drew got hurt.

Sure he could have put Drew back in later in the season when he was ready but the team was winning with Tom. I don't know how many coaches would have switched them back if the team was consistently winning. If you switch them back at that point then you're the Buffalo Bills with Doug Flutie and Rob Johnson.

Very few coaches would have switched back to a QB who was 5-13 in his most recent stretch when the current QB was winning.

Delusions of BB haters. Kraft basically told him he was risking his job with his choice.

 

[lancerman]

Delusions of BB haters. Kraft basically told him he was risking his job with his choice.

You will find very few instances in history where a coach had a QB who was currently on a year plus run under .300 and put him in over a QB who was winning at a higher rate than the team had done in several years.

I know you want to defend Bill, but keeping Brady was a no brainer, it wasn't some brilliant strategic move that only someone as wise as Bill Belichick would make. It Maye went 0-2 and then got injured this year and Ben Woolridge went on a 6 game winning streak, there's zero chance Vrabel pulls him until he see's him stumble and is justified.

 

[signbabybrady]

You will find very few instances in history where a coach had a QB who was currently on a year plus run under .300 and put him in over a QB who was winning at a higher rate than the team had done in several years.

I know you want to defend Bill, but keeping Brady was a no brainer, it wasn't some brilliant strategic move that only someone as wise as Bill Belichick would make. It Maye went 0-2 and then got injured this year and Ben Woolridge went on a 6 game winning streak, there's zero chance Vrabel pulls him until he see's him stumble and is justified.

I know you want to hate BB but regardless of you stating it was a no brainer it still was a brilliant move made by Bill Belichick that would lead to multiple championships and decades of success.

Equally as brilliant was recognizing there was something there and carrying 4 QBs and developing that talent so that he was ready when he got his chance.

Then not resting on past success and continuing to coach him hard and using him as a tool to run/coach the entire locker room.

Their names will forever be linked together as the greatest duo in sports.

 

[Thelonious]

This is false, the fanboys here diminish the “team” aspect of football regularly. Moreover my annoyance with this take has less to do with Bill and more to do with the countless other players who contributed to this run.

Ty Law, Seymour, Adam V and on and on… these guys were studs. They weren’t good because Tom made them good. Tom was a snot nosed kid in 2001 and so were most of these fanboys recalling how it supposedly was. SB1 was clearly ten years old and only remembers a superhero appeared and saved the day. It’s hero worship… pure foolishness. Tom needed Seymour, Mankins and Wilfork as much they needed him.

And most importantly… where did Brady come from? Did he appear from the mist like Excalibur, did he land on the lawn of Foxboro like Superman? No, he was a developmental QB who needed a lot of work to become who he was. If he landed in Arizona instead of New England, anyone outside of a Michigan fan would not even know his name.

Or..."if Bill had ended up anywhere other than where Tom did" . . .

I think we agree that each was essential to their shared accomplishments. No other view is logical. In the end, Tom was no longer capable of playing QB at a high level, and Bill was no longer able to coach/GM at a high level. Sic transit Gloria Mundi.

Tom managed his end more elegantly than Bill has to this point, Lord knows. That's the difference. Maybe Bill will develop the self-awareness needed to avoid the dismal end toward which he presently seems headed. I hope so.

Time hath, my lord, a wallet at his back,
Wherein he puts alms for oblivion,
A great-sized monster of ingratitudes:
Those scraps are good deeds past; which are devour'd
As fast as they are made, forgot as soon
As done: perseverance, dear my lord,
Keeps honour bright: to have done is to hang
Quite out of fashion, like a rusty mail
In monumental mockery. - Shakespeare

The tusks which clashed in mighty brawls
Of mastodons, are billiard balls.

The sword of Charlemagne the Just
Is Ferric Oxide, known as rust.

The grizzly bear, whose potent hug,
Was feared by all, is now a rug.

Great Caesar's bust is on the shelf,
And I don't feel so well myself. - Guiterman



Behold now, surely somewhere there is death:
For each man hath some space of years, he saith,
A little space of time ere time expire,
A little day, a little way of breath.

And lo, between the sundawn and the sun,
His day's work and his night's work are undone;
And lo, between the nightfall and the light,
He is not, and none knoweth of such an one. - Swinburne

 

[lancerman]

I know you want to hate BB but regardless of you stating it was a no brainer it still was a brilliant move made by Bill Belichick that would lead to multiple championships and decades of success.

Equally as brilliant was recognizing there was something there and carrying 4 QBs and developing that talent so that he was ready when he got his chance.

Then not resting on past success and continuing to coach him hard and using him as a tool to run/coach the entire locker room.

Their names will forever be linked together as the greatest duo in sports.

Everything you listed is something any coach would do.

 

[signbabybrady]

Everything you listed is something any coach would do.

Says you. But again regardless of who else you think might have done the same it was Bill who did it. And Bill who kept it going for decades. Only one coach has 8 rings.

 

[lancerman]

Says you. But again regardless of who else you think might have done the same it was Bill who did it. And Bill who kept it going for decades. Only one coach has 8 rings.

Only one coach had the GOAT QB. Actually I take that back. So did Arians. He had a .500 SB win rate with Brady.

 

[signbabybrady]

Only one coach had the GOAT QB. Actually I take that back. So did Arians. He had a .500 SB win rate with Brady.

And they both were the benefit of 20 years of Bill's work. Tampa should give Bill a ring.

 

[signbabybrady]

 

[signbabybrady]

 

[sb1]

Tampa should give Bill a ring.

I agree, yes they should. Bill was the one who foolishly let him walk out the door to the Bucs. One of the biggest GM blunders you'll ever see anywhere in any sport at any time. Maybe Bill wanted to prove the dynasty was all him. That's just silly - as illustrated by his .426 win pct post Brady.

 

[Bill Lee]

Did he though? Brady didn't start the season. He only played once Drew got hurt.

Sure he could have put Drew back in later in the season when he was ready but the team was winning with Tom. I don't know how many coaches would have switched them back if the team was consistently winning. If you switch them back at that point then you're the Buffalo Bills with Doug Flutie and Rob Johnson.

Ok, so you credit Bill for making the right choice. Got it.

There's plenty of teams who don't get these choices right.

We should know, we're the team that did the whole Plunkett / Grogan / Eason thing.

It's not as easy as it looks.

 

[lancerman]

And they both were the benefit of 20 years of Bill's work. Tampa should give Bill a ring.

Yeah they should give him a ring for being stupid enough to drive Brady to them lol

 

[lancerman]

Ok, so you credit Bill for making the right choice. Got it.

There's plenty of teams who don't get these choices right.

We should know, we're the team that did the whole Plunkett / Grogan / Eason thing.

It's not as easy as it looks.

Name a coach that would bench a QB on a winning streak for a QB that had a sub .300 record over the last full season of games.

ALL of the risk at that point was in benching Tom and starting Drew. If you put Bledsoe in and it disrupts whats going on, all the blame goes on Belichick for screwing up a good thing. If you start Brady you save face by not rocking the boat AND if he stumbles at all, you have the fallback of going back to Bledsoe. There wasn't a real decision to be made there. You keep the good thing going until the situation changes.

The reality is most teams just simply don't get these choices.

 

[signbabybrady]

I agree, yes they should. Bill was the one who foolishly let him walk out the door to the Bucs. One of the biggest GM blunders you'll ever see anywhere in any sport at any time. Maybe Bill wanted to prove the dynasty was all him. That's just silly - as illustrated by his .426 win pct post Brady.

Made up narrative