AFC Scout: Pats are a disorganized program

[Huckleberry1]

I think they liked Anderson and Lowe and probably hoped Wheatley would progress, plus probably figured they’d bring in an OT in the draft. So they overrated Chuks and the two other holdovers at OT that Wolf and Groh helped bring in last year. That’s disturbing.

Equally disturbing is their misses in acquiring IOL. They expended draft and FA capital on Sow, Jake Andrews, Mafi, Robinson, and Leverett and have bupkis to show for it. I’ll give them credit for Jordan and Brown but there’s been a lot more misses than hits.

Mayo’s not going anywhere, for political and ego reasons, The Scatback and The Nebbish aren’t going to admit their screw up there after one year. Ron Wolf’s kid and Al Groh’s kid will take the hit, and as exemplified above they will richly deserve their severance checks.

Wolf and Groh didn’t bring in anyone last year, those were Belichick’s decisions. Wolf takes responsibility for those he signed and drafted this year. Just because they were there it doesn’t mean it was their choices. And by the same logic Wolf and Groh get no credit for the Gonzalez pick, as that too was Belichick’s decision.

 

[Huckleberry1]

If Mayo is disparaging the roster publicly after talking to Kraft every day it clearly means Mayo has Kraft’s ear, and Wolf is on the way out.

And if they do that then Kraft is a moron and this franchise isn’t going anywhere. Franchises that change GM’s like underwear are the garbage franchises.

 

[captain stone]

I happened to hear part of Mayo's radio interview today. He shared that he speaks to Kraft on a daily basis. He also spent a good deal of time disparaging the roster which I found to be a discouraging message to the team. Long story short, the fix is in and Wolf will be the one to go first.

I certainly hope so. And he can take Al Groh's kid AND our WRs coach with him.

Wolf has been pretty clear that he looks at this year as an evaluation year for who to keep next year. While there is a lot of merit to that strategy, Wolf has been too rigid in his approach. OL is too important a position to ignore when bringing in a new QB. I hope Wolf learned that spending short term money on veterans to plug holes and allow draft picks to develop is not the same as spending the same money on flashy veterans to win a game or two more the next season. I also hope that Wolf is going to build a playoff team now that Maye has done enough to allow the team to invest in other positions.

I hope that Ron Wolf's kid is Fired.

If Mayo is disparaging the roster publicly after talking to Kraft every day it clearly means Mayo has Kraft’s ear, and Wolf is on the way out.

Good; because he deserves to be.

 

[mike_usagisan]

Wolf and Groh didn’t bring in anyone last year, those were Belichick’s decisions. Wolf takes responsibility for those he signed and drafted this year. Just because they were there it doesn’t mean it was their choices. And by the same logic Wolf and Groh get no credit for the Gonzalez pick, as that too was Belichick’s decision.

Wolf and Groh were in the personnel department that assigned the grades to the people Bill brought in. The whole point of turning the keys over to them was that they showed good enough work during the Bill years to warrant promotion. If we discount every decision as a Bill decision, they have no work to show that they deserved to be making personnel decisions now.

 

[dliverey44]

Equally disturbing is their misses in acquiring IOL. They expended draft and FA capital on Sow, Jake Andrews, Mafi, Robinson, and Leverett and have bupkis to show for it. I’ll give them credit for Jordan and Brown but there’s been a lot more misses than hits.

Sounds close enough to Butkus, I'll take him. lol

 

[Toofy]

Are we a playoff team next year. Possibly not.

Will be a 7 or 8 win team next season - possibly.

Will we equal or beat the 4 win record of last season - possibly yes.

And now we did this with an inferior team, rookie QB and rookie HC, DC and OC.

I read somewhere where either stated firing Mayfield's OC in his first year set him back by 3 years. We saw what happened to Mac. Granted, Mac talent level is low, but still...

I really like the QB development that is in place for maye and we need to give AVP credit for it. Donno how many QB whisperers exist on this league. Outside of Ben Johnson , I don't see anyone for whom, We need to fire this staff. Considering the state we are in, not seeing any quit from the team. That's huge.

Maybe AVP and Mayo flourish more when they know there is no noise around their neck. I feel maye development is far more important than wins for 1st 2 seasons. And as we build the team from within and there is increased buy in , wins will start to come.

They should bench Osborne now and get Baker if Maye wants him to add element of speed and unpredictability.

Next season maybe we hire 1 or 2 upshot offensive assistants who also do play calling duties to assist AVP .

 

[borg]

OT: Bears fire their OC today

Note: Chicago has scored 15 more points this season than NE.

Bears fire Shane Waldron, promote Thomas Brown to offensive coordinator

Shane Waldron is out after just nine games as the Bears' offensive coordinator.

www.nbcsports.com

 

[PatsFan2]

OT: Bears fire their OC today

Note: Chicago has scored 15 more points this season than NE.

Bears fire Shane Waldron, promote Thomas Brown to offensive coordinator

Shane Waldron is out after just nine games as the Bears' offensive coordinator.

www.nbcsports.com

With all those WR's and RB yikes glad they passed on Maye: he would be just as good as Daniel with that supporting cast.

 

[Steve102]

That article is a brutal tale down of every... From the head coach, the OC the DC, the position coaches... And the level of talent on the roster...

No cohesion ... Every one doing their own thing across the board... The coaching is not sinking in... Are Mayo & Co just not effective communicators? I dunno for certain, but I'd hazard a guess that's a "yes"...

Bill carried respect even if he lost his fastball as GM. These guys need to have “their” guys so they can get buy in. It’s a mess, not liable to get better until they bring in proper coaches.

 

[UrbanCowboy]

I'm surprised the staff/front office didn't get much of a bump from this win. It seems to me that every team at the bottom looks poorly coached, rudderless, disorganized, directionless, checked out, etc. Continually starting over is what the loser franchises do. I hope we stay the course [ducking...]

 

[Stu Pidassle]

OT: Bears fire their OC today

Note: Chicago has scored 15 more points this season than NE.

Bears fire Shane Waldron, promote Thomas Brown to offensive coordinator

Shane Waldron is out after just nine games as the Bears' offensive coordinator.

www.nbcsports.com

The Pats and their new QB look worlds better than Chicago with all of their weapons on offense. Right now AVP is doing a better job.

 

[BUSTAMOVE]

When did the collaborative approach start, and what was the result?

Did the coaching, played acquisition improve?

I am hoping that Kraft can swallow his ego and identify someone you can bring in and give all of the decision making to.

It worked with BB for a long time.

Is there anyone out there we can bring in, whether a GM or HC, who we can have optimism that they can be given the keys to the kingdom while the Krafts get out of the way?

Having someone like Maye to build around should be a very attractive lure, since the most difficult piece had already been found, and he is so young that the right person could set up the franchise for a long competitive run.

I would think if we were to get a new regime
It would have to be rising star type hires
The good HC's and GM's are usually locked up
Last year there was no attraction from said potential hires to coach this team
Maye may be that attraction needed to turn this around

 

[Brotherblues]

For those questioning Mayo….name me one nfl head coach who could win with the current talent we have on offense? The answer is none.

Nobody is evaluating him strictly on number of wins and losses this season. There are too many fingerprints on that rudder.

What you can evaluate are the words out of his mouth, how he got the job, and what's visible from how he goes about his job. There's certainly enough material there to not just draw a picture but make a whole movie.

 

[SlowGettingUp]

OT: Bears fire their OC today

Note: Chicago has scored 15 more points this season than NE.

Bears fire Shane Waldron, promote Thomas Brown to offensive coordinator

Shane Waldron is out after just nine games as the Bears' offensive coordinator.

www.nbcsports.com

A reminder that some posters here wanted Waldron as OC:

 

[PancakeBlockPaul]

I see this season as the first step in rebuilding to a consistent contender for the long term. Getting a franchise QB is the most important piece of that rebuild, as you don’t win championships without one. It looks like Maye is that franchise QB they needed, although he obviously has a lot of growing to do. The next step is building a great OL, and I think that is where Wolf has to devote this offseason, and possibly the next one to building a great OL. They should be able to get their left tackle in the next draft, although it’s unlikely they will be Orlando Pace or Trent Williams, a guy like Will Campbell could be a Matt Light caliber LT, and that’s definitely good enough to win with. They will have to address the interior OL in free agency, as this draft is light on high quality interior linemen. However, if Wallace can turn into their right tackle then Onwenu can move back inside, so Center might become their real priority. I had hoped that Will would take JacksonPowers -Johnson, or Will Grier with their 2nd round pick last draft, but he opted for Polk instead, and while I still think Polk will be a good player, I think the C would have been the better choice.

We should have a really good idea when this season ends of exactly what pieces they need to get, and what pieces they have, to get to the place where they are in the hunt for a playoff spot, which should be the case next season. My guess is that Mayo survives this season, but that he will be fired if they don’t make the playoffs in 25’. At which point they better have a really good idea of who they want to coach them for the long term, as franchise QB or not they won’t be winning championships without one.

Spot on!

 

[PancakeBlockPaul]

The Pats and their new QB look worlds better than Chicago with all of their weapons on offense. Right now AVP is doing a better job.

Almost scary to think about eh?

 

[patfanken]

I'm just astounded by the lack of perspective about how to build a coaching staff. Have All of you forgotten just how important continuity is for a staff or system. Why does it seem like everyone seems so "shocked" about the current state of affairs of this 3-7 team when we all pretty much agreed before the season started, that a 3-5 win season was likely. So suddenly all the posters here who seem to have nothing better to do than either complain about everything, or you're a lot smarter than guys who have been doing it for professionally for several years. Did anyone NOT expect this coaching staff to have growing pains? Clearly mistakes have been made both by the coaches AND the players. Some that even has coast us some games. It's not like you can't criticize some of the decisions that have been made. You can do that with EVERY staff let alone ours

But for me, I see a LOT of stuff that is more to the plus side. I see a QB who has been developed a LOT faster than I thought. One who has eliminated a LOT of the issues that we expected and saw in camp. And even more importantly I've seen a lockerroom that has fully bought into the current leadership led by Mayo. As consumers of this product the thing that we can DEMAND from this team is that they play hard each week and provide us with entertaining games that keep us involved for most of the 4 quarter we are watching. And for at least 8 of the 10 games we've played currently, we have gotten that result.

I look at this team and I see the by in. I look at this team and win or lose. you can see the gradual improvement. Christ we were literally a coin flip away from having a 3 game winning streak. I see an improvement on the OL over the last 4 games. That's a group that has FINALLY gotten some 'continuity" itself. That's not to say its a good OL, but it has improved enough to being close to mediocre at least and certainly better than the disaster the Bears put out there last Sunday. Though at least 3 of those sacks were caused by Williams holding the ball WAY too long.

Bottom line - the current leadership has given us a team that plays HARD, despite the weak roster (relatively) and unfortunate injuries that has hamstrung play on both sides of the ball. So rather than point out all the things that went wrong each game, why not take a moment to see the things that are going RIGHT.

 

[n1997y]

This is the best post in this thread.

The problem is that that kind of **** works pretty well and this thread is a great example.

You'd never know that the team came off a pretty dominant performance.

It’s disingenuous to try to discredit the story by changing the timeline,

When that article was published the team was coming off an overtime loss to a team worse then them according to their respective records. The Patsies had just let a team that was 1-6 take them to OT and then lost to them. Is that really your idea of “coming off a pretty dominant performance”?

The whole idea that unnamed sources are not good sources is wrong too. There are employers who have strong restrictions on staff speaking to media. So the choice isn’t between quoting an unnamed source or naming them. It’s between hearing from a knowledgeable source that can’t be named, or not hearing their perspective. I’d rather hear it than have it swept under the rug as some desire.

It does make it important to vet the author, to decide if their sources and selection of quotes from those sources, can be trusted. In this article there were many different unnamed sources all saying different things that were consistent. So like it or not it’s very likely an accurate depiction about how the rest of the league sees the Patriots at the point in time that it was written. Maybe they’d be seen as better after the Chicago game, or maybe only scoring one TD against an even worse team would still look the same.

 

[n1997y]

And if they do that then Kraft is a moron and this franchise isn’t going anywhere. Franchises that change GM’s like underwear are the garbage franchises.

Not arguing that second sentence.

But is it really “changing GM’s like underwear” to fire the current GM when his predecessor had the job for over two decades?

Most new hires have to survive a probationary period. That’s often one year. Wolf hasn’t had the job for a full year yet, has he? How is firing an underperformer during the probationary period a bad thing? Cut your losses!

 

[n1997y]

The Pats and their new QB look worlds better less bad than Chicago with all of their weapons on offense. Right now AVP is doing a better less crappy job.

FIFY