Who Is Our 3rd Starting Corner And Who Is the Backup Outside

[mgteich]

A PLEA TO ADD A STARTUBG CORNER (outside or nickel).
The more I re-read my comments below, this becomes more and more clear to me. A top 5 Defense shouldn't be counting on Austin, Wilson and Bolden, although Bolden as a STer and as a future prospect at CB is certainly fine.

If we are really discussing the Defense as a top 10 or top 5 Defense, I think that we need to face some considerations.

The group beyond the top 2 is just not very good. Maybe they will be good in the future. They certainly aren't better now than average or better than average for a playoff team.
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The "TOP" THREE
Sure, we have Gonzo and Jon Jones as starters, both coming back from injuries. It is likely that Jon Jones is our best option outside opposite Gonzo.

Marcus Jones is certainly in the mix. He had an OK first year. He was an all-pro special teamer. Maybe he's ready to be the starting nickel back, but I suspect that he needs a bit more experience. And, of course, he too is coming back from injury. But pencil him in as the starting nickel back, the weakest starter on the Defense. The alternative of one of the rest as a starter outside (I'd choose Wade) is probably an even a greater liability as a starter that Marcus Jones. Of course, this player would also be the weakest starter on the Defense.

THE BEST BACKUP
WADE looked good last year, especially compared to the others. But is he really starter quality on a top Defense? To me, Wade is an experienced veteran and an OK backup.

BOTTOM LINE SO FAR
Gonzo, Jones, Jones and Wade are an OK set of corners and COULD be good enough to be a top 10 Defense. Bring in a starter to play outside opposite Gonzo or even a starting nickel back and this is a much better group of corners and good enough to be part of a top 5 Defense.
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MAYBE SOMEONE HERE WILL STEP UP (2-3)
There will 1-2 more roster spots at CB and possibly one more at backup FS.

BOLDEN looked good before he was injured. He will very likely be given a season to develop, especially since he was a top kick returner in college. Keeping Bolden would mean that we probably don't need to keep Reagor just to be a kick returner.

AUSTIN and WILSON are question marks that were brought in late and showed a bit. Both could make the 53 if we don't add any free agents and if DIAL doesn't make the 53, likely making the Practice Squad.

I guess the best case would be to sign a free agent and have only one of AUSTIN, WILSON and DIAL make the 53.

 

[Wozzy]

Something like this, starters in bold:

SS – Kyle Dugger, Jabrill Peppers, Jaylinn Hawkins, Josh Bledsoe, Dell Pettus (PS),
FS – Shaun Wade,
BIG CB – Christian Gonzalez, Marco Wilson, Isaiah Bolden, Marcellas Dial, Azizi Hearn, Alex Austin (PS),
SLOT CB – Jonathan Jones, Marcus Jones, Kaleb Ford-Dement (PS),

I don't see the desperate need to add somebody else, assuming health and development by the youth this is a great group.

 

[mgteich]

Something like this, starters in bold:

SS – Kyle Dugger, Jabrill Peppers, Jaylinn Hawkins, Josh Bledsoe, Dell Pettus (PS),
FS – Shaun Wade,
BIG CB – Christian Gonzalez, Marco Wilson, Isaiah Bolden, Marcellas Dial, Azizi Hearn, Alex Austin (PS),
SLOT CB – Jonathan Jones, Marcus Jones, Kaleb Ford-Dement (PS),

I don't see the desperate need to add somebody else, assuming health and development by the youth this is a great group.

Yup, that's all true if you think that Wilson, Dial, and Bolden are top prospects and will be solid contributors at CB this year.

Hearns is a Practice Squad prospect, but that doesn't affect the analysis.

 

[Wozzy]

Yup, that's all true if you think that Wilson, Dial, and Bolden are top prospects and will be solid contributors at CB this year.

Hearns is a Practice Squad prospect, but that doesn't affect the analysis.

Assuming health Marco Wilson will be a solid starter opposite Gonzalez, competition will sort out the rest. The bottom line is there’s a lot of young talent to work with.

They’re a lot deeper than the time they needed Troy Brown to start at nickel CB and won a ring. The defensive front needs to do their job and the offense has to be competent.

 

[mgteich]

Assuming health Marco Wilson will be a solid starter opposite Gonzalez, competition will sort out the rest. The bottom line is there’s a lot of young talent to work with.

They’re a lot deeper than the time they needed Troy Brown to start at nickel CB and won a ring. The defensive front needs to do their job and the offense has to be competent.

Do you think that Wilson is an above average starting CB in the NFL.
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[Wozzy]

Do you think that Wilson is an above average starting CB in the NFL.
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I want to see him on a good defense for the first time of his pro career, but I think so.

Remember PFF told us Gilmore was a bad player because he played on a bad defense. It’s very hard for a CB to look on a bad team. He put some good football on tape in Arizona, then a new regime came in an didn’t value him like the previous one.

 

[mgteich]

Something like this, starters in bold:

SS – Kyle Dugger, Jabrill Peppers, Jaylinn Hawkins, Josh Bledsoe, Dell Pettus (PS),
FS – Shaun Wade,
BIG CB – Christian Gonzalez, Marco Wilson, Isaiah Bolden, Marcellas Dial, Azizi Hearn, Alex Austin (PS),
SLOT CB – Jonathan Jones, Marcus Jones, Kaleb Ford-Dement (PS),

I don't see the desperate need to add somebody else, assuming health and development by the youth this is a great group.

Actually, I have no issue with nine of your roster defensive backs. I just have no reason to put Dial or Hearn on the 53 where they will be inactive. They are fine on the Practice Squad.

And I also don't see a "desperate" need to add a starter quality defensive back. We should carry 10, so we are discussing who would be the 10th. Some choose Bledsoe or Austin or Dial. My choice is a free agent.

 

[Real fan 02]

A PLEA TO ADD A STARTUBG CORNER (outside or nickel).
The more I re-read my comments below, this becomes more and more clear to me. A top 5 Defense shouldn't be counting on Austin, Wilson and Bolden, although Bolden as a STer and as a future prospect at CB is certainly fine.

If we are really discussing the Defense as a top 10 or top 5 Defense, I think that we need to face some considerations.

The group beyond the top 2 is just not very good. Maybe they will be good in the future. They certainly aren't better now than average or better than average for a playoff team.
=========
The "TOP" THREE
Sure, we have Gonzo and Jon Jones as starters, both coming back from injuries. It is likely that Jon Jones is our best option outside opposite Gonzo.

Marcus Jones is certainly in the mix. He had an OK first year. He was an all-pro special teamer. Maybe he's ready to be the starting nickel back, but I suspect that he needs a bit more experience. And, of course, he too is coming back from injury. But pencil him in as the starting nickel back, the weakest starter on the Defense. The alternative of one of the rest as a starter outside (I'd choose Wade) is probably an even a greater liability as a starter that Marcus Jones. Of course, this player would also be the weakest starter on the Defense.

THE BEST BACKUP
WADE looked good last year, especially compared to the others. But is he really starter quality on a top Defense? To me, Wade is an experienced veteran and an OK backup.

BOTTOM LINE SO FAR
Gonzo, Jones, Jones and Wade are an OK set of corners and COULD be good enough to be a top 10 Defense. Bring in a starter to play outside opposite Gonzo or even a starting nickel back and this is a much better group of corners and good enough to be part of a top 5 Defense.
==========
MAYBE SOMEONE HERE WILL STEP UP (2-3)
There will 1-2 more roster spots at CB and possibly one more at backup FS.

BOLDEN looked good before he was injured. He will very likely be given a season to develop, especially since he was a top kick returner in college. Keeping Bolden would mean that we probably don't need to keep Reagor just to be a kick returner.

AUSTIN and WILSON are question marks that were brought in late and showed a bit. Both could make the 53 if we don't add any free agents and if DIAL doesn't make the 53, likely making the Practice Squad.

I guess the best case would be to sign a free agent and have only one of AUSTIN, WILSON and DIAL make the 53.

We are in better shape than people realize at CB.. the media will lead you to believe we are in dyer need...

CB1 - Gonzo on the outside
CB2- Austin on the outside

J.jones- CB3- slot
Backup positions M.jones, Wade, Dial, Bolden.

Austin as we enter camp is the starter opposite Gonzo on the outside. Mayo said the slot guys J. Jones and Marcus haven't been available as they are still recovering. So if they aren't available for the start of camp then other guys will get opportunity. Why we have not signed another veteran I believe is because mayo and wolf feel good enough about this group seen as they all played pretty well last season. I don't much about Wilson however I believe he's buried deep on the depth chart.

 

[Real fan 02]

Something like this, starters in bold:

SS – Kyle Dugger, Jabrill Peppers, Jaylinn Hawkins, Josh Bledsoe, Dell Pettus (PS),
FS – Shaun Wade,
BIG CB – Christian Gonzalez, Marco Wilson, Isaiah Bolden, Marcellas Dial, Azizi Hearn, Alex Austin (PS),
SLOT CB – Jonathan Jones, Marcus Jones, Kaleb Ford-Dement (PS),

I don't see the desperate need to add somebody else, assuming health and development by the youth this is a great group.

I didn't touch on the S. I just touched on the CBs. But good you put that up. I don't know much about Wilson but I'll say he's likely buried deep on the depth chart.

As camp starts.. your starting CBs are Gonzo, Austin, J. Jones. We will see how things progress going forward.

 

[mgteich]

Hmm

We have 4 starters. We have one starting position where we all seem to disagree. I don't think that any of the others are better than an average CB relatively easily upgraded by a free agent.
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SUMMARY
I choose WADE as the best starter opposite Gonzo (with the alternative being Jon Jones with Marcus starting at nickel)
Real fan 02 has AUSTIN as the starter (the other two of us have Austin not even making the 53)
Wozzy has Marco WILSON as the clear starter. The others of us aren't sure Wilson make the 53, although I think that he probably will.

BOTTOM LINE
We seem to have a hole at CB2 unless you all think that we are picking from solid starters rather than OK backups.

I don't think that we are "desperate" for a CB outside starter as the cap keeps on pointing out. However, I'm closer to that position than to believing that we have a solid starter. I do have a sneaky feeling that Jon Jones will start, with Wade and Marcus competing for reps in the slot.

 

[Real fan 02]

Hmm

We have 4 starters. We have one starting position where we all seem to disagree. I don't think that any of the others are better than an average CB relatively easily upgraded by a free agent.
=======
SUMMARY
I choose WADE as the best starter opposite Gonzo (with the alternative being Jon Jones with Marcus starting at nickel)
Real fan 02 has AUSTIN as the starter (the other two of us have Austin not even making the 53)
Wozzy has Marco WILSON as the clear starter. The others of us aren't sure Wilson make the 53, although I think that he probably will.

BOTTOM LINE
We seem to have a hole at CB2 unless you all think that we are picking from solid starters rather than OK backups.

I don't think that we are "desperate" for a CB outside starter as the cap keeps on pointing out. However, I'm closer to that position than to believing that we have a solid starter. I do have a sneaky feeling that Jon Jones will start, with Wade and Marcus competing for reps in the slot.

Good information.

As currently constructed from HC mayo, patriots team reporters Callahan, Perry, Curran and Weiss. Alex Austin was with the 1s all off season. Now I know alot of that is likely becuase J. Jones and Marcus weren't practicing. But Mayo and pelligrino have raved about how he's Continued his ascension from last season into the offseason. On Wade I think he's played pretty well.. he's had much more opportunities and it started to go well for him. However the coaches are probably looking at like Austin hasn't been with the team long and immediately made impactful plays In such a short time. So the team's likely giving him the nod to start camp.

 

[n1997y]

Gonzo came in as aa acclaimed rookie, started a couple of games before getting hurt, and is now considered CB1.

Bolden came in as an acclaimed rookie, got hurt in camp, and is being written off already.

Let’s wait and see how he and the latest crop of rookies perform in camp before consigning them to careers as JAGs. Bolden in particular was a promising talent. Give him a chance.

 

[Zuma]

Gonzo came in as aa acclaimed rookie, started a couple of games before getting hurt, and is now considered CB1.

Bolden came in as an acclaimed rookie, got hurt in camp, and is being written off already.

Let’s wait and see how he and the latest crop of rookies perform in camp before consigning them to careers as JAGs. Bolden in particular was a promising talent. Give him a chance.

Different levels of talent which was indicative of where drafted. Plus Bolden has never played in an NFL regular season game. However he does deserve a chance to show what he can do. I think he will be on the 53.

 

[Real fan 02]

Different levels of talent which was indicative of where drafted. Plus Bolden has never played in an NFL regular season game. However he does deserve a chance to show what he can do. I think he will be on the 53.

Agree. Gonzo was even better than advertised.. he learned the defense quickly, and by week 3 had QBs throwing away from him.. Bolden was late round pick, talented as well.. I like him he's promising.. camp is next week.. we will all know who's doing what by the 2nd week of camp when the pads go on.

 

[hornetfb85]

I want to see him on a good defense for the first time of his pro career, but I think so.

Remember PFF told us Gilmore was a bad player because he played on a bad defense. It’s very hard for a CB to look on a bad team. He put some good football on tape in Arizona, then a new regime came in an didn’t value him like the previous one.

Agree. I want to see him on a good defense where he is not the top guy. He seemed to play better when he had Murphy on the other side at CB. Then last year MW was thrown in as the top dog and struggled. We have Gonzo opposite of him that can lock down that side. We can give Wilson a little more help. Not saying he’s a sure thing, but Arizona sucks royally on defense. Tough to judge what he really was.

 

[Wozzy]

I didn't touch on the S. I just touched on the CBs. But good you put that up. I don't know much about Wilson but I'll say he's likely buried deep on the depth chart.

As camp starts.. your starting CBs are Gonzo, Austin, J. Jones. We will see how things progress going forward.

Why is Wilson buried on the depth chart?

He joined the team at the end of last year, this is a new season.

 

[Wozzy]

Agree. I want to see him on a good defense where he is not the top guy. He seemed to play better when he had Murphy on the other side at CB. Then last year MW was thrown in as the top dog and struggled. We have Gonzo opposite of him that can lock down that side. We can give Wilson a little more help. Not saying he’s a sure thing, but Arizona sucks royally on defense. Tough to judge what he really was.

Arizona also didn’t have pass rush or pressure, trying to defend the pass with no pressure upfront is near impossible.

 

[Real fan 02]

Why is Wilson buried on the depth chart?

He joined the team at the end of last year, this is a new season.

I haven't seen him play. But I'm open on the idea of him having a shot.. as I've said mayo and pelligrino already said Austin was the most impressive during the offseason and he has the starting spot opposite gonzo to start camp.. Wilson like the other guys will all have thier opportunities.. if J. Jones and Marcus aren't ready to start camp then that's mire opportunities for Wilson.

 

[PatsFan2]

I haven't seen him play. But I'm open on the idea of him having a shot.. as I've said mayo and pelligrino already said Austin was the most impressive during the offseason and he has the starting spot opposite gonzo to start camp.. Wilson like the other guys will all have thier opportunities.. if J. Jones and Marcus aren't ready to start camp then that's mire opportunities for Wilson.

Nice: call me crazy but I really liked Rookie Isaiah Bolden before he got injured. I think we are going to be very good @ CB minus injuries.

 

[PatsFan2]

I haven't seen him play. But I'm open on the idea of him having a shot.. as I've said mayo and pelligrino already said Austin was the most impressive during the offseason and he has the starting spot opposite gonzo to start camp.. Wilson like the other guys will all have thier opportunities.. if J. Jones and Marcus aren't ready to start camp then that's mire opportunities for Wilson.

Real, I know he's shorter but I think with his Elite Speed and playmaking ability I am not against Marcus Jones Starting alongside Gonzo. Marcus did a nice job Defending D Adams in that weird game we gifted the Raiders.