Reiss: Pats should Thank Niners for Passing on Mac

[Wozzy]

How would you know where I was. lol. You think in all that time you would have learned how passing was in the 90's and early 2000's.

The only thing different in passing from the 2000's to now are little yellow flags and a kinder gentler NFL.

Good is still good, poor is still poor, and accuracy from the pocket is still at a premium... at least if you want to win championships.

 

[rochrist]

When did Brady lead the league in sacks like Luck did in 2016… when did he ever come close? Never is the answer.

I have no idea where it stood in relation to the rest of the league, but he had 41 sacks his (the same as Luck in 2016) his first year as a starter. Lucks other bad year was also 41 sacks and Brady has a seasons for 40 and 38. For their careers, Brady has averaged 1.75 sacks a game, Luck 2. Nore, but not a gigantic difference. 32 a year vs 28.

 

[Wozzy]

So you compared long time starters to Brady in his first starting season with less weapons and playing in 14 games to Favre and Gannon? Ok let me break it down...Favre had 32 td's who else did? How many did last year? Ok, now you understand a bit better. Better yet though, lets take a look at favre and gannon first starting seasons...
Favre 18 td's 13 ints in 15 games
Gannon 16 td's 16 ints in 15 games

Well golly gee it seems like football was different in the passing game than in the last 10 years. Look I am sorry your boy luck could not cut it in the NFL, its a hard business, most guys do not last long, some do, and for some reason a lot of your posts bash one of those guys.

Ok you learned something today, say thank you and move on to the next bad take.

Yeah, Luck's "my boy." One could mention any QB in history besides #12 here and the Brady fanboys will attack.

In my opening post, had the temerity to suggest for both Lance and Mac "what they have going for them is both landed in great situations" and Ice's Brady-stan mind decides it's time to launch a ferocious emoji attack for the affront to Tom Brady. lol

Like the very thought there could be another "good" QB besides Tom Brady, or that maybe great coaching and organizations do exist and benefit every young QB in a positive way... that was too outlandish. That Tom came out college an instant rifleman and never had a developmental period... good grief.

But you guys really know football, or understood what you were watching in 2000, or even now. Laughable...

 

[NYCPATS4LIFE]

I was high on mac jones. Still feel he will the best QB in this draft after Lawrence. I don’t care about any other QB. Never wanted Fields.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

In 2016 Luck was one sack shy of leading the entire NFL, he missed the next season with his injury and limped through one season before retiring… his O-Line started to get good in his last season. You must be a fantasy football guy.

He got sacked 41 times in 2016. Here's where that sack total ranks all-time for sacks taken in a single season.

As usual, you mislead and lie to try to make a point. And as usual, you embarass yourself.

 

[Wozzy]

I have no idea where it stood in relation to the rest of the league, but he had 41 sacks his (the same as Luck in 2016) his first year as a starter. Lucks other bad year was also 41 sacks and Brady has a seasons for 40 and 38. For their careers, Brady has averaged 1.75 sacks a game, Luck 2. Nore, but not a gigantic difference. 32 a year vs 28.

41 sacks came as a first time starter in the NFL for both guys, as rookie QB's tend to do. As rookie starters it would be drilled in them that taking a sack is better than turning the ball over, the speed of the game is moving really fast, they're nervous and inexperienced.

Brady's highest sack totals in order of DATE and AMOUNT below:

2001 41
2013 40
2015 38
2017 35
2003 32
2011 32
2002 31

Besides his rookie year, the one constant above is bad to better O-Lines/weapons/team in a descending order.

Another factor are pass attempts. In all but 2001-2002 (developmental) years above, Tom Brady was in his mid-30's to 40's. He was already legend, could pass as much as he wanted and was one of the highest paid QB's in the NFL at that time. The talent around him wasn't as good, we didn't win as many championships, but they were very competitive.

Bad or average blocking/talent + more pass attempts = more sacks. True of Luck, true of Brady.

The major difference is at age 27 Luck was leading the league in sacks again, only this time because his blocking was an abomination. While Tom at that time was blossoming into a fully developed pro player and playing on the 2004 All-Star team.

Some see super powers, I see circumstance as well as skill.

 

[Zuma]

He got sacked 41 times in 2016. Here's where that sack total ranks all-time for sacks taken in a single season.

As usual, you mislead and lie to try to make a point. And as usual, you embarass yourself.

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41 ... that was his Lucky year...ok that was bad. No posting for the next 30 days.

 

[Love The Drake]

Yep, they are going to get rid of the greatest coach/GM in NFL history for the new kid on the block. Your “ hot takes “ are getting dumber by the minute.

Honestly Ivan if you read my post, maybe you didn’t understand it I said achieving the same level of excellence we are accustomed to which lets call that three superbowls in the next five years is incredibly difficult. There is a greater percentage that this entire regime is replaced in five years.
IF the regime is replaced in this ridiculous hypothetical and let me be on record I don’t think either will happen multiple Super Bowl victories in 5 years no a complete regime overhaul but if it did. A complete overhaul is more likely than the unprecedented success we’ve enjoyed.
Now if we would again in this wild HYPOTHETICAL hire a new head coach.
This is a offense driven league so you would look at offensive masterminds so I said eh why not someone like Joe Brady as head coach has a better chance of being our head coach in 5 years than Belichick hoisting three more Lombardis.
It’s a moot point because I don’t think either will occur.
Now one more Lombardi is possible in 5 years.
In BB WE TRUST.

 

[Joker]

Reading this thread is like eating shytburgers...in the end there is no winner...only losers

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Reading this thread is like eating shytburgers...in the end there is no winner...only losers

I have no idea what eating shytburgers is like. You obviously have different life experiences than me. Carry on Joker.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Yep, they are going to get rid of the greatest coach/GM in NFL history for the new kid on the block. Your “ hot takes “ are getting dumber by the minute.

I agree the clock is ticking with Bill, but insert offensive assistant here? How can someone be so clueless about the head coaching successor battle within the ranks? McDaniels, Little Steven, Patricia, just to name a few.

 

[Joker]

I have no idea what eating shytburgers is like. You obviously have different life experiences than me. Carry on Joker.

that is a supposition on my part...I would assume eating a shytburger would be a 100% non-option...thus one LOSES no matter the context...much like this thread

 

[Hyped]

Damn, Drew Bledsoe's name shows up a lot on the list above...his career high was 55 in 1999...and I remember him getting absolutely killed by the Bucs in week 1, 2000....taking 5 sacks that game I believe.... and 4 of his 49+ sack seasons came in 1999, 2002, 2003, and 2005....

 

[Joker]

Damn, Drew Bledsoe's name shows up a lot on the list above...his career high was 55 in 1999...and I remember him getting absolutely killed by the Bucs in week 1, 2000....taking 5 sacks that game I believe.... and 4 of his 49+ sack seasons came in 1999, 2002, 2003, and 2005....

don't feel bad for Drewpy...HE is the one that pestered Kraft into signing his 2 buddies, the TWIN ABOMINATIONS, Rucci and Lane to multi-million dollar guaranteed contracts...at the time two of the most generous contracts in the league....for a rag doll right tackle single armed by Reggie White like a little girl's Raggedy Ann in the Bowl and the WORST disgrace at left guard I've ever had the distaste to witness on a Patriots team...Rucci should have done time for the theft he perpetrated on Kraft and the Pats.

 

[Sicilian]

I don't want to get too much farther into the Luck conversation here (because it's taking some sour turns), but I will say BOTH of these things can true: A) Andrew Luck suffered from an organization that didn't properly support him, not having the personnel and coaching around him consistently to reach his full potential. And B) Andrew Luck wasn't going to be Tom Brady no matter what was going on around him.

 

[farn]

Career Sack %

Tom Brady - 4.7% (Protected by an iron wall)
Andrew Luck - 5.0% (Thrown to the wolves)

Luck took 174 career sacks and racked up 332 rushing attempts. It was obvious from year one he played recklessly. The Colts didn’t do a fantastic job with the o-line, but they didn’t fall into some outlier category when it comes to sacks and pressures.

Was this the line’s fault? The play where his shoulder got blown up, lacerated kidney, etc? Trying to cut past defenders like a running back?



This one? On the pass protection?

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Probably a late hit here….but who is responsible for putting himself in danger?

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This was a widely accepted understanding about Luck…evidenced by this article in 2016 (and others like it.) The damage was mostly done by that point, as he had sustained major injuries due to his stubbornness. After re-aggravating the injuries a few times, the narrative totally changed to ThE cOlTs DiDnT pToTeCt HiM! and the typical bozos who media driven narratives - like yourself - jumped on board. When Luck retired, the revisionist history took an emotional surge to new levels.

Andrew Luck "reluctantly accepting" need to slide to avoid hits

The Colts have made no secret of their desire to see quarterback Andrew Luck do more to protect himself during games, particularly when he's running out of the pocket on plays like the one that left Luck with a lacerated kidney last season.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

Luck : most overhyped, overrated player of my lifetime.

 

[oldrover]

41 ... that was his Lucky year...ok that was bad. No posting for the next 30 days.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I don't want to get too much farther into the Luck conversation here (because it's taking some sour turns), but I will say BOTH of these things can true: A) Andrew Luck suffered from an organization that didn't properly support him, not having the personnel and coaching around him consistently to reach his full potential. And B) Andrew Luck wasn't going to be Tom Brady no matter what was going on around him.

I haven't read the entire thread but I'm sure everyone is being objective and full of context ...

Landing spot matter's more for QB's than any other position and I don't think it's close. Luck landed in a dumpster fire. Most people think it was the injuries that did him. Or he just couldn't cut it as some casual poster referred to. It was the incompetence of the organization and constant rehab that did him in. It certainly wasn't a physical thing or how much pain you can take. This is a guy that played through more injuries than you can count including finishing a game with a lacerated kidney.

Indy and that staff did an awful job getting handle on things and always rushed him back. Not to mention the amount of pressure to not only play but play great considering who he was replacing and what the franchise went through to get him.

Luck was most mature person in the room dealing with a puppet coach, terrible GM & drug addicted owner in the middle of a 2 year bender.



He played with competent coaching and good blocking exactly one year. Constant pressure on & off the field with a turnstile OL. This is what Indy did to surround him him talent ... And he traded a 1st for Trent Richardson!!!


So he's playing for a franchise run by addict, HC who was always on the hot seat - no real power and a awful GM.

Just like Manning it was all on Luck except the team wasn't nearly as good. Every pass was meant to win the game, everything was on his shoulders. Which is a big reason why he played the way he did. Remember Luck didn't have any injury history coming out of college.

He certainly wasn't without his faults but was an excellent prospect coming out who carried a weak roster to playoffs multiple years while being sabotaged by the mental cases upstairs.

Still can't believe they gave a 1st for Trent Richardson. @captain stone it could have been a lot worse brother.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Still can't believe they gave a 1st for Trent Richardson. @captain stone - it could have been a lot worse brother.

I think that trade was part of their "win now" philosophy that you discussed - would not be surprised if the druggie owner wanted Richardson. Has to be on the Worse Trades of All Time list.

And yes that would have killed and buried the Captain, no doubt about it.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

The original discussion here fascinates me, not because Reiss is a brilliant football analyst (ha), but because he's usually quite diplomatic and even-keeled. He takes a slow, somewhat conservative approach to reporting, and rarely sensationalizes anything for clicks despite working for ESPN. I've always found him to be the most well-connected and plugged-in source on the Patriots, if a bit bland. Reading a statement like that from Reiss of all people should make us pause and wonder what he's hearing from the organization. Intriguing stuff -- let's hope it turns out to be true!