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2017 Training Camp - Day 5 (8/1/17)

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I was at practice today. Here are a few thoughts on some things that haven't been covered already.

1. I didn't show up until 9:20 and figured I could get up to the ramps and see practice from up high. I was pleasantly surprised that the crowd was down to "just" 6 or 7,oo0 so I was able to grab my usual spot in the back row.

2. It was a great practice for me because I happened to stand next to HS coach, so we talked football stuff the entire practice.

3. This was my first practice in 2 years, so I found myself watching everything and seeing very little. Like everything the lack of practice makes you have to come back. I hope I do better as things go forward.

4. First thing that caught my eye was when the Pats were doing a drill at 3 quarter speed, where the QB is forced out of the pocket and the receivers need to reroute to adjust. I happened to see #45 playing LB, and while everyone one around him was going 3/4 speed, he was running like he was shot out a cannon. A quick check of the roster told me it was David Harris. Throughout practice he played like he was #90 on the depth chart and he desperately needed to impress someone. I loved it.

5. They might have been in full pads, but there was very little real hitting until the very end of the practice when they did a tackling drill. It was only about 5 minutes but the comp was fierce and me and the coach were both commenting on things like head on the wrong side, not squaring to the ball carrier, too low, too high, etc.

One of my pet peeves of the NFL is that most teams really suck at tackling. When I watch their technique on TV, I scream at the screen sometime when they do things routinely that I would take a kid off the field for doing the same thing in HS.

The Pats are routinely one of the best tackling teams in the league, so they only mildly suck at tackling.

6. Geeno Grissom is getting a lot of run at DE/OLB - I can't comment on the entire practice, but he set the edge very well on 3 runs I can remember. I have no clue if he can rush the passer. But he looked good against the run.

7. I can't believe how skinny Rivers is. He looks more like one of those tall WR's than a DE. He still has good quickness off the ball and plays with good pad level against the run. But on the few time I happened to notice him on a pass rush, he was getting swallowed up by the blocker one on one.

8. Was it hot? Damned right it was hot. How hot? Well I was feeling a bit lightheaded and knew I needed some hydration. Someone happened to have left a half filled bottle on the seat next to mine, so I appropriated it. It was warm, and tasted like piss, but it probably saved me from heatstroke, so thanks to the anonymous fan who left his water. ' (and yeah I know I could have just bought I bottle, but there is someing about playing $5 or whatever for a bottle of water. I guess its a generational thing.)

9. What was interesting about "the fight" was that they sent Julian off first and he was almost out of sight before Gilmore started off the field. My fellow coach suggested was a better punishment would have been to make them take a lap or two holding hands. What a great idea.

Good news. fnord let us know they made up in the shower.

As long as Rivahs does not have Crable Legs Syndrome, I'm good.
 
Things that are sticking out to me as important news.

#1 Deatrich Wise - Since Nink has retired the microscope has been much more on the rookie DEs. Rivers has a ton of talent but Wise right now appears to be ahead of him from what I have read. Seems to be pretty fast for a 270 lb guy.

#2 Ted Karras - A player I have been keeping an eye on a lot for any news as he is the main back up to 3 spots. He looks ready to play well in all 3. He had a strong year last year when forced to play some very early on. Will be a key backup here for years.

#3 David Harris - This was a huge pick up as it was a big weakness last year. Many of the Falcons bigger plays given up in the super bowl had to directly do with LBs other than Hightower leaving wide open gaps in run lanes or dumb mental errors not picking up RBs in the flat. The hope was Harris had at least 1 or 2 more years left. It was not a sure thing. It looks like he does.

#4 Kenny Moore - Right now at this single point of time the CB to watch at camp is Kenny more. Not cause he is the best. Butler, Gilmore, Rowe are all better. It has to due with his upside which is the highest of JJ, CJ or any other CB right. He is a guy who has a legit chance to force the Patriots hands. You never cut a CB if you think he has a chance to be a starter. The position matters too much. He is the guy who needs the most eyes on him right now even though other story lines exist in this group.

#5 Antonio Garcia - Solder is in the last year of his deal and he might not be back this year. The Pats traded up to get Garcia particularly. He was the best OT left by a good margin and in a draft with some good players in rounds 3 and 4 they sacrificed a pick that had good value to secure him. I have heard good news so far. He is a sneaky important player on this team. If Solder goes next year he will possibly be assigned protecting a 41 year old QB's blindside.

#6 Snap splitting with Brady and JG - It is clear to me and other Brady is on a snap count. Personally though I don't think it will just be in training camp. I think Brady will throw less this year than he has in a 16 game season in a while. This team has leaned so much on his arm and I understand why. But if you want to protect your playoff chances this means limit Brady's passes which has the adding effect of protecting Gronk as well. I think we are in for a 2004 type season for Brady where he passed only 474 times in 16 games (30 a game). In todays NFL that be incredibly low. However I think below 500 passes is possible this year and would be for the best.. This brings me to #7


#7 Mike Gillislee - The other RBs are important. Lewis looks nearly back to his 2015 self according to reports. Burkhead as well seems very interesting and of course pass catching 3rd down specialist White will do his thing at a high level. However I think people are still underestimating how important Gillislee is. I might be too. The Pats have not invested this much in RBs in a while. That signals to me they intend to run. I and predicting the pats lead the league in attempts this year. They have a stable that can handle it and Gillislee will see more snaps than we think. Particularly in the 2nd half when up.

I was thinking of doing 10 but this will do.
 
I was at practice today. Here are a few thoughts on some things that haven't been covered already.

1. I didn't show up until 9:20 and figured I could get up to the ramps and see practice from up high. I was pleasantly surprised that the crowd was down to "just" 6 or 7,oo0 so I was able to grab my usual spot in the back row.

2. It was a great practice for me because I happened to stand next to HS coach, so we talked football stuff the entire practice.

3. This was my first practice in 2 years, so I found myself watching everything and seeing very little. Like everything the lack of practice makes you have to come back. I hope I do better as things go forward.

4. First thing that caught my eye was when the Pats were doing a drill at 3 quarter speed, where the QB is forced out of the pocket and the receivers need to reroute to adjust. I happened to see #45 playing LB, and while everyone one around him was going 3/4 speed, he was running like he was shot out a cannon. A quick check of the roster told me it was David Harris. Throughout practice he played like he was #90 on the depth chart and he desperately needed to impress someone. I loved it.

5. They might have been in full pads, but there was very little real hitting until the very end of the practice when they did a tackling drill. It was only about 5 minutes but the comp was fierce and me and the coach were both commenting on things like head on the wrong side, not squaring to the ball carrier, too low, too high, etc.

One of my pet peeves of the NFL is that most teams really suck at tackling. When I watch their technique on TV, I scream at the screen sometime when they do things routinely that I would take a kid off the field for doing the same thing in HS.

The Pats are routinely one of the best tackling teams in the league, so they only mildly suck at tackling.

6. Geeno Grissom is getting a lot of run at DE/OLB - I can't comment on the entire practice, but he set the edge very well on 3 runs I can remember. I have no clue if he can rush the passer. But he looked good against the run.

7. I can't believe how skinny Rivers is. He looks more like one of those tall WR's than a DE. He still has good quickness off the ball and plays with good pad level against the run. But on the few time I happened to notice him on a pass rush, he was getting swallowed up by the blocker one on one.

8. Was it hot? Damned right it was hot. How hot? Well I was feeling a bit lightheaded and knew I needed some hydration. Someone happened to have left a half filled bottle on the seat next to mine, so I appropriated it. It was warm, and tasted like piss, but it probably saved me from heatstroke, so thanks to the anonymous fan who left his water. ' (and yeah I know I could have just bought I bottle, but there is someing about playing $5 or whatever for a bottle of water. I guess its a generational thing.)

9. What was interesting about "the fight" was that they sent Julian off first and he was almost out of sight before Gilmore started off the field. My fellow coach suggested was a better punishment would have been to make them take a lap or two holding hands. What a great idea.
Did you start rolling after you drank the water?
 
Still dont understand how anyone can say he is on the Bubble.
Boggles the mind.
I know someone said it, but WTH would say that?!?!? WTH would Hogan be on the bubble?!??
WHY?!?!?
 
I agree that Talib comparisons are very premature. However, there's no reason to believe we've seen Rowe's ceiling. CBs seem to (in my anecdotal experience) peak in their late 20s. Talib arguably didn't peak until Denver, after all.
Mostly agree. However, I wouldn't necessarily say Talib didn't peak until Denver. I think more accurately, he was always a top 10-15 corner but that damn Denver pass rush helped elevate his game (along with playing alongside DRC & Chris Harris Jr). Complementary football.
 
Interesting, not hearing much about Rivers, but hearing a lot about Wise. Kinda reminds me of Grissom/Flowers, Grissom was the higher rated player yet Flowers has been the better player so far.

On Rivers small School = Steep Learning curve.
Deatrich Wise Big School Prospect.
 
He did hit Sandman on his first toss though.
 
#4 Kenny Moore - Right now at this single point of time the CB to watch at camp is Kenny more. Not cause he is the best. Butler, Gilmore, Rowe are all better. It has to due with his upside which is the highest of JJ, CJ or any other CB right. He is a guy who has a legit chance to force the Patriots hands. You never cut a CB if you think he has a chance to be a starter. The position matters too much. He is the guy who needs the most eyes on him right now even though other story lines exist in this group.

From the Globe:
Moore, the undrafted rookie corner from Valdosta State, continues to impress. He’s rarely out of place and got some run with the 1s after Gilmore was ejected for fighting with Julian Edelman.​

Who needs to draft top corners near the top of the first round when you can apparently find them lying around undrafted?
 
Observational leftovers #5


O

-- Matthew Slater enjoyed one of his best days as a receiver during his career. He caught several passes from Brady and hauled in a deep ball from Garoppolo after Coleman appeared to break up the play.

-- Dion Lewis looked fast on a screen pass that potentially could have gone for a touchdown in 11-on-11s.

-- Massive tight end Dwayne Allen got the best of Trey Flowers in a 1-on-1 blocking drill.

-- Nate Solder worked again as an extra tight end and got the better of Langi on one such rep. The rookie linebacker got pancaked on the play after mike Gillislee was able to pick up a significant chunk of yardage running in the hole Solder helped create.

-- LaAdrian Waddle and Cam Fleming have worked as the tackles with the second offensive line throughout training camp but on Tuesday they switched side. Waddle was on the left side while Fleming went to the right after the opposite was true prior to day in camp.

-- Running back D.J. Foster and wide receivers K.J. Maye and Tony Washington were imitating mobile quarterbacks against the Patriots’ edge rushers.


D

-Rookie defensive tackle Adam Butler is making some plays in limited opportunities. During a one-on-one pass rush drill he got the better of guard Jamil Douglas, and earlier in camp he was active around the line with some batted passes while helping to collapse the pocket. Butler is a 6-5, 300-pound defensive tackle out of Vanderbilt worth keeping an eye on.

-- Rookie Deatrich Wise got some action as a sub rusher during the early third-down segment. He tried his luck rushing against Solder, but the left tackle completely stoned him at the line. Wise did come up with a would-be sack of Brady on another rep and he seems to be making a push.

-- Speaking of Wise, he seems to be getting the majority of his reps as a true defensive end while fellow rookie Derek Rivers sees some action as an outside linebacker.

-- Wise looks like he’ll be able to play a couple different roles up front and is the rookie who has gotten the most attention. Langi’s getting thrown in there a lot at outside linebacker, but he’s had his struggles standing out. Still if his snaps are increasing they must like what they see.

-- Langi saw his most significant action of camp when he was part of a defense that included Roberts and Shea McClellin at linebacker in a 4-3 set. Langi was on the left side with McClellin on the right and Roberts inside. Kyle Van Noy worked with another group that included David Harris inside and Derek Rivers on the right side.

-- There was a lot of third-down situational work on Tuesday. Van Noy, who has been quite active throughout camp, showed strong coverage against Rob Gronkowski during one rep but was still unable to prevent the catch. Van Noy’s mobility has been on display on a few occasions in coverage this summer, but more often than not the connections have been made anyway.

-- Kyle Van Noy continues to get work in individual drills with the defensive ends. Van Noy went up against tight ends in 1-on-1 drills. Shea McClellin, a player who has a similar role, was with the linebackers for 7-on-7s during this period.

-- With Hightower out, David Harris and Jonathan Freeny have seen considerable practice reps at inside linebacker.


ST

-- The special teams work feature kick returns and Cyrus Jones, Dion Lewis, Will Likely and D.J. Foster all took reps. Van Noy was able to recover an onside kick attempt by Gostkowski.

-- Jonathan Jones returned kickoffs, the first time this has happened in a public practice.

-- Cooks, Foster, Amendola, Hogan, Likely and Cy Jones all fielded several punts at the end of practice.
__


-- Wise, Thuney and defensive lineman Woodrow Hamilton performed well in pass-rush drills. Offensive tackle Antonio Garcia also continues to impress.

-- James O’Shaughnessy, who has been active as a receiver during the early part of camp, left the field with Whalen and did not return. O’Shaughnessy was walking under his own power and did not show any signs of injury, but he nonetheless missed the remainder of practice.

-- When linebacker Trevor Bates was late coming onto the field the entire defense – coaches included Matt Patricia – took a lap on what was to be the final play of an 11-on-11 team period.

-- There was some CFL personnel on hand scouting practice. Members of the Winnipeg Blue Bombers and Toronto Argonauts were on hand watching the action.
 
On Rivers small School = Steep Learning curve.
Deatrich Wise Big School Prospect.

Rivers will be fine. Last guy I'm worried about.

Also hes not playing for some ****bum team that's gunna have him focus on one or two things.

The Patriots and Bill are just in a different league and we all know Bill has his ways.

He wouldn't have been inquiring about him over a year ago if he didn't like him.
 
That does seem fair even though we are poorer for it.

And intent is part of how "fair use" is determined. To help broadcast and advertise, as a teaser, is allowed. You aren't allowed to post the entirety of an article in pieces.
 
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