Logjam at defensive tackle and free agency, and the draft have not even begun…

[TonyTucker]

Wilfork, Kelly, Jones. Siliga maybe. Everyone else gone. No more logjam.

 

[Brady6]

I don't see the logjam.

We have a top five (your first five), of which three are coming off injuries. This five includes a player who has never played even one down in the NFL.

The other four includes three Practice Squad quality players and a has been.

If ALL three of the injured don't come back healthy, we will NEED an addition (who could be a PS type player). We still might draft a player late, with the expectation that might make the 53 if there is an injury.

I suspect that Belichick sees a need rather than a logjam at DT.

Well then, the question would be which players should will be released?

 

[RayClay]

There's two NFL starters out of that group and they're both injured and older. We need two NFL starters in the next 3-4 years and we'll be lucky to get one. Hopefully we can draft Hageman and have one or both real NFL starters to tutor him, because he's raw. If not, I think they're going to have to find two impact DTs to replace Last year's starters and with their draft spot it won't be easy.

I don't know why the names of scrubs on the practice squad who couldn't even get a sniff when we had no starters and no backups are even mentioned.

 

[woolster22]

There's two NFL starters out of that group and they're both injured and older. We need two NFL starters in the next 3-4 years and we'll be lucky to get one. Hopefully we can draft Hageman and have one or both real NFL starters to tutor him, because he's raw. If not, I think they're going to have to find two impact DTs to replace Last year's starters and with their draft spot it won't be easy.

I don't know why the names of scrubs on the practice squad who couldn't even get a sniff when we had no starters and no backups are even mentioned.

You thought Siliga played that bad? I thought he was respectable. Certainly not elite, but I wouldn't say terrible. Lower level starter but a damn fine back up/rotational guy last year.

 

[Brady6]

I don't know why the names of scrubs on the practice squad who couldn't even get a sniff when we had no starters and no backups are even mentioned.

I listed nine players and one of them was a practice squad player. That was Marcus Fortson, who has spent time on the active roster in each of the last two seasons.

It is fine if you want to draft and sign defensive tackles, I am not against it, but you did not answer the question in my OP. Who stays and who goes? We are not going to carry more than 5-6 of them.

Wilfork
Kelly
Siliga
Jones
Armstead

That is 5 right there, I am not sure which ones I would part with, you?

 

[Brady6]

You thought Siliga played that bad? I thought he was respectable. Certainly not elite, but I wouldn't say terrible. Lower level starter but a damn fine back up/rotational guy last year.

I hope he was not referring to Siliga, anybody who thought Siliga played poorly last season, either did not watch the games or does not pay attention to defensive line play. The run defense improved drastically when he was inserted into the lineup and in 5 games he had 23 tackles, 3 sacks, 1 run stuff, 1 forced fumble, and 8 QB pressures.

Siliga has tremendous upside as a player, he is just 23 years old, and he outperformed his former college teammate Star Lotulelei in every combine measurement except the bench press. Siliga left college early and that was not a good decision, had he returned and played well many scouts felt he could have been selected in the first 3-4 rounds of the next draft.

 

[BobDigital]

I gotta say I don't see all the hype with Red Bryant. Sure he is a very good run stuffer but his below average pass rushing worries me. I do not like spending premium money on someone who will is a run stuffer that can not pass rush.

I would rather spend that money on a DT that can also pass rush cause you can find a good run stuffing (though not elite) for not far off the vet minimum.

 

[manxman2601]

I hope he was not referring to Siliga, anybody who thought Siliga played poorly last season, either did not watch the games or does not pay attention to defensive line play. The run defense improved drastically when he was inserted into the lineup and in 5 games he had 23 tackles, 3 sacks, 1 run stuff, 1 forced fumble, and 8 QB pressures.

Siliga has tremendous upside as a player, he is just 23 years old, and he outperformed his former college teammate Star Lotulelei in every combine measurement except the bench press. Siliga left college early and that was not a good decision, had he returned and played well many scouts felt he could have been selected in the first 3-4 rounds of the next draft.

And this is why you can't scout entirely based upon combine performance. Star Lotulelei is significantly better than Siliga.

The combine is important but it's a complement to scouting, not a way to scout someone.

 

[Brady6]

And this is why you can't scout entirely based upon combine performance. Star Lotulelei is significantly better than Siliga.

The combine is important but it's a complement to scouting, not a way to scout someone.

I am not debating that fact Manx, my point is that Siliga has upside. Star was smart he returned for his senior season and refined his game, added upper body strength, and made a name for himself. Siliga left early and was not prepared for the NFL and lacked the upper body strength.

 

[manxman2601]

I am not debating that fact Manx, my point is that Siliga has upside. Star was smart he returned for his senior season and refined his game, added upper body strength, and made a name for himself. Siliga left early and was not prepared for the NFL and lacked the upper body strength.

I'm fine with Siliga as a spot starter/backup with hopes for development but five games isn't a great indication for how good he'll be. He certainly played well in them and might have earned himself a spot on next years roster.

 

[50-yard-line]

I gotta say I don't see all the hype with Red Bryant. Sure he is a very good run stuffer but his below average pass rushing worries me. I do not like spending premium money on someone who will is a run stuffer that can not pass rush.

I would rather spend that money on a DT that can also pass rush cause you can find a good run stuffing (though not elite) for not far off the vet minimum.

Versatility. He could spell Nink and Jones on the ends, or kick inside in certain packages. Griffen is similar, as is Lamar Houston.

I want one of those three. My preference would be Houston, but Bryant will be the cheapest, I think.

 

[RayClay]

You thought Siliga played that bad? I thought he was respectable. Certainly not elite, but I wouldn't say terrible. Lower level starter but a damn fine back up/rotational guy last year.

Please reread. I didn't mention Siliga, or even allude to him. The scrubs are Grissom and Fortson. There really aren't any impact DTs in their prime or on that track, so the premise of a logjam doesn't hold.

Did we find some quality role players in Siliga and Chris Jones? Could be. Still doesn't affect trying to find the impact players we're going to need.

 

[Brady6]

I'm fine with Siliga as a spot starter/backup with hopes for development but five games isn't a great indication for how good he'll be. He certainly played well in them and might have earned himself a spot on next years roster.

I think he is a gem personally, but I could be way off. I watched some of his college tape and he is an impressive athlete, he added some size since entering the NFL which I think is what he needed to do.

 

[RayClay]

I think he is a gem personally, but I could be way off. I watched some of his college tape and he is an impressive athlete, he added some size since entering the NFL which I think is what he needed to do.

Maybe you know better than the front office staffs of three of the best organizations.

Check that, every organization in football. After all, he wasn't drafted.

 

[primetime]

Siliga is a lot like Kyle Love - a decent if unspectacular rotational player. Every defense has to have guys, you just hope your defensive line isn't anchored by guys. The Patriots' was last year.

 

[Brady6]

Maybe you know better than the front office staffs of three of the best organizations.

Check that, every organization in football. After all, he wasn't drafted.

Neither was John Randall.

Tom Brady went in the sixth round.


T. Kelly, Welker, Amendola, Blount, and others were undrafted as well… That is meaningless.

 

[RayClay]

Neither was John Randall.

Tom Brady went in the sixth round.


T. Kelly, Welker, Amendola, Blount, and others were undrafted as well… That is meaningless.

Should they put Brady in as defensive tackle?

Tommy Kelly is 6'6". Do you think if Siliga tries real hard he can grow to 6'6"?

There's a reason people remember the exceptions more than the rule.

 

[primetime]

Neither was John Randall.

Tom Brady went in the sixth round.


T. Kelly, Welker, Amendola, Blount, and others were undrafted as well… That is meaningless.

No it's not. That there have been a handful of exceptional undrafted players belies the fact that the vast majority of undrafted players are inferior players.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

B6 my man this "logjam" reminds me of the threads about our largesse of TEs last pre-season.
How'd that work out?
At DT we have 2 old vets with serious health questions, one with an intolerably high cap hit. And a couple kids from nowhere who looked quite decent as stop-gap backups but were not playoff winning caliber talent capable of pressuring an immobile QB up the middle. The rest of the squad not IRed for vaginal infection couldn't beat out the 2nd stringer kids for substantive PT.
DT is a BIG question mark.

 

[RayClay]

No it's not. That there have been a handful of exceptional undrafted players belies the fact that the vast majority of undrafted players are inferior players.

And moreso when they need to be athletic and well over 300 pounds at a minimum.

It takes nothing away from Welkers career to note that there are many players that size and quick enough to at least be very good slot receivers. At that position, many are undrafted.