Gronk = + - Ben Coates?

[PatsFan2]

Heh. That's probably true. I thought he was unbelievable. I remember a game against Miami where he literally dragged guys down the field with him.

But Gronk is bigger, faster, has better hands, and makes athletic receptions that Coates could not make. The 2nd TD that Gronk made last night was the kind of play that I don't recall Coates ever making, as great as he was.

NFL Videos: QB Brady to TE Gronkowski, 5-yd, pass, TD

Honestly, right now, I cannot think of a better TE in the NFL than Gronkowski, and the guy is just in his 2nd year. He has a legit chance to surpass anything Coates did for them.

Jimmy Graham in New Orleans says hi...he's having a monster year too.

 

[TheSolderKing]

Jimmy Graham in New Orleans says hi...he's having a monster year too.

yeah he is. He is much quicker/faster than our boy Gronk to

 

[ivanvamp]

Jimmy Graham in New Orleans says hi...he's having a monster year too.

Yes he is.

Graham: 62 rec, 873 yds, 6 td
Gronk: 52 rec, 709 yds, 8 td

Pretty close. I don't know how good of a blocker Graham is, but he'd have to be damned good to be better than Gronk, who is a *great* blocker.

 

[rojo8401]

He's pretty close already.

I think he might even challenge Russ Francis at some point for best Pats TE evah.

 

[InRodWeRust]

Still a bit too early. Coates was a clutch 3rd down machine much like Welker and Faulk and he was a human vacuum that caught anything that was remotely thrown near him. Gronk still needs a bit more time to build that type of reputation and he needs at least one 1000 yard season under his belt. I certainly see Gronks potential to exceed Coates but right now we need a little more time to see the results.

 

[Deus Irae]

Yes, it's too early, IMO. At this point in his career, Gronk is still in the "He reminds me of..." stage.

 

[goheels22002]

Comparing Coates to Gronk is an insult to Gronk.

No, it is not. At Gronk's 2011 rate of receptions, Coates will have caught more passes in 1994 than Gronkowski will catch this year.

If Gronkowski can be as consistent and productive as Ben Coates was over his 9 years with the Patriots, it will be great. Coates played his 10th and final year with the Ravens.

Ben Coates was the go-to receiver for Drew Bledsoe and played a key role in getting to the 1996 Super Bowl, something Gronkowski has yet to accomplish. In 1994, Coates caught 96 passes, an NFL record at the time for tight ends and gained 1,174 yards receiving. (Gronkowski had 42 last season and is on pace for 92 receptions this year.)

Ben Coates went to 5 Pro Bowls. Ben Coates ranks #7 all-time in career receptions by a tight end with 499 receptions over 10 years.

In the Super Bowl year 1996 Coates had 62 catches for 682 yards and 9 TDs. He won the seasonn-ending NY Giants game on the last play on an amazing TD much like Gronkowski does. Coates had 6 catches for 66 yards in the Green Bay - New England Super Bowl.

Coates was great and shows up every top 20 list of all-time tight ends and was 2nd team on the all-1990s team behind Shannon Sharpe.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Comparing Coates to Gronk is an insult to Gronk.

Being compared to the best TE I've ever seen wear a Patriots uniform is an insult?
Not to knock Gronk, but let's see him do it for a awhile before we start comparing him to Mark Bavaro.

From the small sample we've seen it's easy to think Gronk may be one of the best ever though.

 

[goheels22002]

Ben Coates' best years:

1994 - 96 rec, 1174 yds, 12.2 ypc, 7 td
1995 - 94 rec, 915 yds, 10.9 ypc, 6 td
1997 - 66 rec, 737 yds, 11.2 ypc, 8 td

Gronkowski's first two years:
2010 - 42 rec, 546 yds, 13.0 ypc, 10 td
2011 - 53 rec, 709 yds, 13.6 ypc, 8 td

Gronk is on pace for this line: 94 rec, 1260 yds, 13.6 ypc, 14 td

That would blow away Coates' best season.

I loved Ben Coates and he was an animal, but Gronkowski basically does *everything* better than Coates did. He's faster, he's bigger (6'6", 265 vs. 6'5", 245), he has unbelievable hands, and he's a great blocker.

94 - 1260 and 14 TDs does not "blow away" 96 receptions, 1174 and 7TDs.

 

[GostkowSKI]

I think Gronk is more physically gifted than Coates. This became apparent to me watching the YouTube video someone posted last week of 1994 Pats/Vikings. Gronk obviously has a size advantage, and seems to be quicker that Coates was getting in and out of his cuts.

Having said all that, Randy Moss was also more physically gifted than Jerry Rice. Doesn't necessarily mean he was better.

Gronk has a chance to be a very productive tight end, but I'm not ready to call him better than Ben Coates.

 

[DarrylS]

This will be viewed as blasphemy, but Brady is lightyears better than Bledsoe..

So to compare Gronkowski to Coates is difficult..

But the eyeball test tells me that Gronkowski is a different player, and is better than Coates..

The only comparison so far that is valid is that Coates used to like to hang around at the "Foxy Lady" and Gronk likes to hang around with porn stars..

 

[RDS11]

...Brady spreads the ball around more than Bledsoe did (he often locked onto Coates), and he's more accurate. QUOTE]

Bledsoe had many flaws, but he did distribute the ball between a lot of players. I don't know if it remains an NFL record, but in 1994 the Pats had 5 players with 50+ receptions. Despite completing around 300 passes per year between 1994 and 2000, Bledsoe never had a receiver with 100+ receptions in a year.

Coates is a 5 time Pro Bowler and 2 times first-team all-pro. Gronkowski has played in only 25 games so far...might be a bit early to say that Gronkowski is better. The 1993-94 Ben Coates was a solid blocker (at least better than Marv Cook, which maybe isn't proving much), maybe not up to Gronkowski standards, but still better than the other all-pro TE from his era, such as Sharpe, Novacek and Brent Jones. Coates, like Bavaro, didn't produce at a very high level for long, maybe because of the wear and tear of being a true TE, not a WR/H-back playing TE like Sharpe was (and Hernandez is). So let's wait a few years before crowning Gronkowski the greatest ever, to see if he can maintain his current production for 7+ years.

That being said, to me Gronkowski seems to have an higher potential ceiling than Coates'.

 

[DarrylS]

...Brady spreads the ball around more than Bledsoe did (he often locked onto Coates), and he's more accurate. QUOTE]

Bledsoe had many flaws, but he did distribute the ball between a lot of players. I don't know if it remains an NFL record, but in 1994 the Pats had 5 players with 50+ receptions. Despite completing around 300 passes per year between 1994 and 2000, Bledsoe never had a receiver with 100+ receptions in a year.

Coates is a 5 time Pro Bowler and 2 times first-team all-pro. Gronkowski has played in only 25 games so far...might be a bit early to say that Gronkowski is better. The 1993-94 Ben Coates was a solid blocker (at least better than Marv Cook, which maybe isn't proving much), maybe not up to Gronkowski standards, but still better than the other all-pro TE from his era, such as Sharpe, Novacek and Brent Jones. Coates, like Bavaro, didn't produce at a very high level for long, maybe because of the wear and tear of being a true TE, not a WR/H-back playing TE like Sharpe was (and Hernandez is). So let's wait a few years before crowning Gronkowski the greatest ever, to see if he can maintain his current production for 7+ years.

That being said, to me Gronkowski seems to have an higher potential ceiling than Coates'.

The Bledsoe stats are interesting, but he had 25 TD's and 27 Int's with a passer rating of 73.6...

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

They play in such different offenses, it's hard to compare. I loved Coates, but I'd have to say, based on the first ~25 games of Gronk's career, he has been totally uncoverable by anyone and shows flashes of brilliance enough so that people can start to wonder if one day, he'll be mentioned as one of the greatest TE's every to play the position. Coates, much as we loved him, will never be in that discussion.

So, while its certainly early, Gronk probably has a ceiling that will put him way beyond where Coates was, but it's way too early for a fair and accurate comparison.

 

[Deus Irae]

Coates was capable of beating what were literally double and triple teams, and it wasn't due to a height advantage where Bledsoe could just throw it up higher than the defenders could jump. Gronk has shown no ability to do that.

Gronk has his strengths, no doubt, but Coates could do things that few tight ends have ever been able to do. This notion that Gronk's ceiling is somehow in another league from Coates' is just a product of the "latest thing" effect.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Ben Coates was Great for Bledsoe and the Patriots but he always played second fiddle to Shannon Horsehead Sharpe in the AFC. And Ben's Career tailed off a little earlier than expected...he just ddin't get separation anymore. Gronk is an Absolute Beast! i cannot believe how Big and Agile he is...when CB's start covering your TE that says something. Gronk is Elite...one of BB's best Draft picks since Tom Brady. One more thing Gronk's stats should be boosted in Madden 12.

He didn't because they started enforcing pushing off, something Big Ben relied on. I loved Coates but Gronk is even better at TE. Now.

 

[BradyFTW!]

This will be viewed as blasphemy, but Brady is lightyears better than Bledsoe..

How is that blasphemy?

 

[Patriot Missile]

Gronkowski is so rare the only scenario I can think to compare him to is Shaquille Oneil. Almost an anomaly so to speak. So much bigger and stronger than the rest and there isn't a real conventional way of covering him without sacrificing leaving others open. It was almost like watching "hack a Shaq" last night. And just like Oneal he wasn't getting the calls because there is a hidden prejudice that because he happens to be so big and gifted that the refs almost feel sorry for the guys trying to cover him and give them some leeway with the physical play. Just how it appears to me.

 

[RDS11]

The Bledsoe stats are interesting, but he had 25 TD's and 27 Int's with a passer rating of 73.6...

Indeed, as I said Bledsoe had many flaws.

But it was a different game than it is today...having 15+ interceptions in a year wasn't uncommon back then (but 27 was), plus the Pats leading rusher in 1994 was Marion Butts, which had a 2.9 ypc average for the year. It put a lot of pressure on Bledsoe to carry the entire offensive load, and as such he threw close to 700 passes that year. And, beside Coates, the rest of the offense cast wasn't exactly pro-bowl material : Brisby, Timpson, Leroy Thompson, Crittenden, John Burke...there's only Kevin Turner that IMO was better than average.

And when Bledsoe needed a big play, he looked for Ben, even though he might be triple-covered. Gronkowski has the chance to play with a more accurate qb than Bledsoe was, but also 'sharing' coverage with other very good options such as Welker and Hernandez.

 

[IllegalContact]

I think coates was a slightly better receiver.......I can't think of anyone who has ever done a better job of using his body to shield the defender from making a play on the ball.....it was like watching a classic low post center....a skill that also made antonio gates very effective

gronkowski uses his body differently to get the ball in a way that the defender can't.....he uses all 6'6" to extend himself.....a method that introduces a few more dropped passes, but still very effective.

coates was never the blocker that gronkowski which bring an added dimension of complexity in defending him

coates was also part of the beginning of the movement (along with shannon sharpe) of 'tweener' TE's whose atheltic skills made it very hard for LB's to run with.