When did we ever run the Amoeba Offense?

[lamafist]

If the extent of your ability to differentiate between plays doesn't extend any deeper than the personnel package, as you seem to demonstrate in your complaints, than you don't have a deep enough understanding to evaluate an NFL offense.

 

[IcyPatriot]

All this time I was thinking it was the 'Nemesis' offense ... how could I have missed this? :confused2:

 

[BradyFTW!]

How does that relate to McDaniels claiming to not running a predictable, set offense, when it is blatantly obvious that he does? Why is he trying to pretend he runs some sort of amoeba, chameleon offense week to week when he doesn't?

Also, look at the proteges of coaches who have gone off from famous systems. Dungy came up with the Tampa 2, his proteges like Herm Edwards have tanked. Bill Walsh's assistants have had some success, because his system was so revolutionary. But Belichick has no set system, his system is game planning and adapting week to week, which is something McDaniels is NOT good at. So... things aren't looking too good for McKid since he won't have Tom Cool and an all star offense at every position to bail him out.

Weird, I was under the impression that Mike Martz had brought 2 offenses to the Super Bowl, and won one of them.

 

[DarrylS]

I have never heard the term Amoeba Offense before, but I saw it implemented virtually every week of the season at least since 2001.

Well said, in reality there are lots of things we see, but do not know what they are called..

 

[DarrylS]

All this time I was thinking it was the 'Nemesis' offense ... how could I have missed this? :confused2:

Or the "never satisfy Nemesis" offense..

 

[Rob0729]

I guess maverick will never get tired of this endless merry go round. I will just say this, like or hate McDaniels it is near impossible to argue that he didn't tailor the offense to his personnel and his opponents. You can look at fairly high profile Patriots games during his run at OC to prove that.

 

[maverick4]

There is no coincidence that pre-McDaniels we used to regularly have the most different numbers of players with a catch or a TD in a season. With McDaniels you know that there are a few main targets who will always get their stats every single game.

I never said McDaniels was a bad OC, he was a very good one, just like Martz was. But both run very set offensive schemes that benefited from HOF talent where it didn't matter that the defense knew what was coming.

McDaniels isn't fooling everyone by going around lying about his 'amoeba', 'chameleon' offense.

 

[Deus Irae]

There is no coincidence that pre-McDaniels we used to regularly have the most different numbers of players with a catch or a TD in a season. With McDaniels you know that there are a few main targets who will always get their stats every single game.

I never said McDaniels was a bad OC, he was a very good one, just like Martz was. But both run very set offensive schemes that benefited from HOF talent where it didn't matter that the defense knew what was coming.

McDaniels isn't fooling everyone by going around lying about his 'amoeba', 'chameleon' offense.

In 2007, the team had 4 receivers with more than 40 catches, 6 receivers with 20 catches or more, 6 receivers with more than 10 catches and a total of 14 different players with receptions.

In 2006, the team had 4 receivers with more than 40 catches, 7 receivers with 20 catches or more, 11 receivers with more than 10 catches and a total of 15 different players with receptions.

In 2004, the team had 2 receivers with more than 40 catches, 6 receivers with 20 catches or more, 9 receivers with more than 10 catches and a total of 15 different players with receptions.

 

[PittPatriot]

I guess I never intended this to become a "did JMcD coordinate an offense that could morph into whatever could capitalize on the opportunities the Defense presents."
I was just wondering did McD just come around to naming the offense "Amoeba" in the recent days or was it always called that but I never caught on.

 

[BradyFTW!]

If Weis had had Moss and Welker at his disposal, and hadn't used them a lot, he would have been an idiot. It's not a bad thing that the scheme maximizes their talents, and that point doesn't make it 'predictable', either. Predictable would be always running the same plays in the same situations, which simply is not how the offense worked. Literally everyone except you seems to get that.

 

[Deus Irae]

I guess I never intended this to become a "did JMcD coordinate an offense that could morph into whatever could capitalize on the opportunities the Defense presents."
I was just wondering did McD just come around to naming the offense "Amoeba" in the recent days or was it always called that but I never caught on.

Pretty much any reference to McDaniels results in Maverick arriving on the scene and railing against McDaniels. It probably hearkens back to a high school cafeteria and some lunch money being taken.

 

[maverick4]

I guess I never intended this to become a "did JMcD coordinate an offense that could morph into whatever could capitalize on the opportunities the Defense presents."
I was just wondering did McD just come around to naming the offense "Amoeba" in the recent days or was it always called that but I never caught on.

McDaniels NEVER called his offense an 'amoeba', 'chameleon-like', or adaptable every week until that recent article. This is a new load of bull that McDaniels is creating, like many other coaches do when they take a new job and want to get the fans excited.

The guy never deviated from the same system he always used, a 3WR shotgun formation with maybe 5 variations.

Brady's increase in post season interceptions under McDaniels is indicative of the fact that in certain situations, McDaniels is predictable beyond belief, and the opposing defense knows who is getting the ball.

Both McDaniels and Weiss had to win post season games after the D failed them, and even though Weiss worked with mostly complete garbage and castoffs compared to the personnel McDaniels has had every year, his offense always came through in the big drives, whereas McDaniels calls game ending int's or 4 and outs. That is on play calling, not on players not executing.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Brady's increase in post season interceptions under McDaniels is indicative of the fact that in certain situations, McDaniels is predictable beyond belief, and the opposing defense knows who is getting the ball.

And it has nothing to do with Tommy trying to go for the big score instead of playing a more controlled game? Like trying to force the ball to Ben Watson against Indy while Heath Evans was wide open along the sideline?

Josh is gone, take a vacation and get your energy ready for ripping O'Brien.

 

[Rob0729]

I guess I never intended this to become a "did JMcD coordinate an offense that could morph into whatever could capitalize on the opportunities the Defense presents."
I was just wondering did McD just come around to naming the offense "Amoeba" in the recent days or was it always called that but I never caught on.

Apparently, as far as I can tell, McDaniels has never, ever called it an Amoeba offense. According to the Denver Post, the Boston media did, not McDaniels. From the article referenced:

The Boston media dubbed it the "Amoeba Offense" for its ability to adapt to its own personnel, or adjust to a defense.

West Coast offense taking a hike - The Denver Post

 

[maverick4]

The Boston media has never dubbed McDaniels' offense an amoeba or chameleon offense. Provide a link if this is true.

McDaniels has always run, just like Martz, the opposite of an amoeba offense. Both OC's are good and were blessed with ridiculous HOF talent on most positions, and ran the same punishing play calls which most teams could not stop, unless it was the playoffs.

 

[Rob0729]

There is no coincidence that pre-McDaniels we used to regularly have the most different numbers of players with a catch or a TD in a season. With McDaniels you know that there are a few main targets who will always get their stats every single game.

LOL! Do you make these things up?

2008: 5 players with TD catches, 11 players with catches
2007: 8 players with TD catches, 14 players with catches (granted one was Mankins with a deflected pass)
2006: 10 players with TD catches, 14 players with catches
2005: 11 players with TD catches, 17 players with catches
2004: 10 players with TD catches, 15 players with catches
2003: 8 players with TD catches, 16 players with catches
2002: 11 players with TD catches, 13 players with catches
2001: 9 players with TD catches, 16 players with catches

There is virtually no drop off with McDaniels at the helm other than this year and I put that on Cassel because he cannot check down his progressions as well as Brady can.

Is it any coincidence that when you make up these stats, you are usually proven wrong? Brady spread out the ball just as much under McDaniels as he did under Weis.

Well, now that I have disproven this incorrect stat thrown out there, off to my Super Bowl party. Have a good Super Bowl everyone.

 

[Rob0729]

The Boston media has never dubbed McDaniels' offense an amoeba or chameleon offense. Provide a link if this is true.

McDaniels has always run, just like Martz, the opposite of an amoeba offense. Both OC's are good and were blessed with ridiculous HOF talent on most positions, and ran the same punishing play calls which most teams could not stop, unless it was the playoffs.

LOL! Go back and watch film of the Jacksonville playoff game last year or the Chargers' game. Or the Vikings regular season game the year before. Those were what I guess is classified as an Amoeba offense whether you want to accept it or not. McDaniels' main strength was identifying the opposing team's weakness and exploiting it. That was part of the reason why he wasn't as predictable as you want. He wasn't perfect, but the offense has been pretty darn good under his regime.

As for the Boston media, I never said they did. I said the Denver Post said they did.

Now I am out.

 

[maverick4]

2008: 5 players with TD catches, 11 players with catches
2007: 8 players with TD catches, 14 players with catches (granted one was Mankins with a deflected pass)
2006: 10 players with TD catches, 14 players with catches
2005: 11 players with TD catches, 17 players with catches
2004: 10 players with TD catches, 15 players with catches
2003: 8 players with TD catches, 16 players with catches

Hmm, 2008 only 5 players caught TD's, and in 2007 only 7 players (Mankins doesn't count).

That is a HUGE drop off from 11 players and 10 players with TD catches from 04-05.

Also, the players with catches is also a significant difference. Thanks for posting those stats, which only go to support the fact that McDaniels calls an EXTREMELY predictable offense, one that relied on HOF talent to succeed just like Mike Martz relied on... except Martz never tried to claim that he ran an 'amoeba' offense, like McKID did

 

[Rob0729]

Hmm, 2008 only 5 players caught TD's, and in 2007 only 7 players (Mankins doesn't count).

That is a HUGE drop off from 11 players and 10 players with TD catches from 04-05.

Also, the players with catches is also a significant difference. Thanks for posting those stats, which only go to support the fact that McDaniels calls an EXTREMELY predictable offense, one that relied on HOF talent to succeed just like Mike Martz relied on... except Martz never tried to claim that he ran an 'amoeba' offense, like McKID did

LOL! Yeah because the loss of Brady had nothing to do with it. He must be just a JAG QB. Trade him! LOL!

My numbers prove that Brady, not Weis or McDaniels is probably the reason so many receiver caught balls and TDs.



BTW, was seven players last year getting TDs a huge drop off from 8 players in 2003? I mean one player difference is huge. Also, McDaniels was calling the plays in 2005 for the most part.

Ok, now I really have to go or I will get in trouble.

You are welcome for posting those stats. Any time I can expose your blind hatred for McDaniels blinding your sense of logic and reality is more of a pleasure than a choir.

 

[Deus Irae]

Hmm, 2008 only 5 players caught TD's, and in 2007 only 7 players (Mankins doesn't count).

That is a HUGE drop off from 11 players and 10 players with TD catches from 04-05.

Also, the players with catches is also a significant difference. Thanks for posting those stats, which only go to support the fact that McDaniels calls an EXTREMELY predictable offense, one that relied on HOF talent to succeed just like Mike Martz relied on... except Martz never tried to claim that he ran an 'amoeba' offense, like McKID did

When did 14 become a huge dropoff from 15? Also, Rob's 2006 data is wrong, as there were 15 players with catches and 11 of them with touchdowns, as I noted in my post that you chose to ignore. The reality is that your argument is idiotic, just as it usually is on this subject. Of course, the fact that you ignore the Randy Moss factor just makes it more obvious that you're arguments on this subject are a joke.