Why Our Defense Needs More Help Than Many Think

[BionicPatriot]

Bottomline is we need to be more athletic. You can talk about PPG all you want, I don't care. Our schedule was freaking pathetic. Our defense was old, and in games where they had to make plays they did not because they're to old, their lack of athleticism was exposed. If people really think to old men in Harrison and Seau would've been another championship, your nuts.

The ONLY thing losing those two did was weaken the run defense, which we were still good at. If you think we missed Harrison's coverage, you obviously are not paying attention to Sanders. That guy played fine. The Colts beat us because we're no longer athletic, our defense is old and gets worn down.

We're doing what we need to do, and that's adding play makers at the LB position. We have two playmakers, Colvin and Thomas. Bruschi and Vrabel are barely standing at this point. We need to continue to get younger. Altogether this is a damn fine defense, just not as athletic as it used to be. Untill we get LBs to play like Bruschi, Vrabel and McGinest used to play, we'll continue losing in the playoffs.

I think we have the defense to get it done, because signing Thomas eliminates the weakness over the middle with pass coverage because he's so versatile. IF, and IF, we can add a younger play maker to the LB rotation, I personally think this Patriot team can go punch for punch with the 04 squad.

 

[italia44]

Bottomline is we need to be more athletic. You can talk about PPG all you want, I don't care. Our schedule was freaking pathetic. Our defense was old, and in games where they had to make plays they did not because they're to old, their lack of athleticism was exposed. If people really think to old men in Harrison and Seau would've been another championship, your nuts.

The ONLY thing losing those two did was weaken the run defense, which we were still good at. If you think we missed Harrison's coverage, you obviously are not paying attention to Sanders. That guy played fine. The Colts beat us because we're no longer athletic, our defense is old and gets worn down.

We're doing what we need to do, and that's adding play makers at the LB position. We have two playmakers, Colvin and Thomas. Bruschi and Vrabel are barely standing at this point. We need to continue to get younger. Altogether this is a damn fine defense, just not as athletic as it used to be. Untill we get LBs to play like Bruschi, Vrabel and McGinest used to play, we'll continue losing in the playoffs.

I think we have the defense to get it done, because signing Thomas eliminates the weakness over the middle with pass coverage because he's so versatile. IF, and IF, we can add a younger play maker to the LB rotation, I personally think this Patriot team can go punch for punch with the 04 squad.

Somebody want to handle this post?

I'm exhausted......

 

[DaBruinz]

To use this as an excuse, and ignore the OBVIOUS defensive issues last year is absurd.

Really? Because all those issues are what led to the defensive issues last year. ANd its not an excuse. It called FACT. I know people like you want to act like FACT doesn't mean anything, but it does.

Fact: Seau was the glue to the run defense last year. All one has to do is look at the games before and after to know that. And it was his BROKEN ARM that took him out of the equation.

FACT: The team played a hellacious game against the Chargers and many of the players on defense were sick with the flu. The strain this year is pretty severe. It dehydrates you and, if it settles in your chest, can lead to pneumonia more often than in previous years. The result is that player get tired more easily.

FACT: Beating the Colts wouldn't have gauranteed the Pats having HFA. It would have helped, but not guarateed it. But, why did the Pats lose to the Colts during the regular season. Besides some poor execution? Not having Seau and Harrison available.

Yes, the Patriots need to stay healthy. Having some fresh players who can help with that would be nice. Hawkins isn't one of those players, IMHO.

 

[DaBruinz]

Bottomline is we need to be more athletic. You can talk about PPG all you want, I don't care. Our schedule was freaking pathetic. Our defense was old, and in games where they had to make plays they did not because they're to old, their lack of athleticism was exposed. If people really think to old men in Harrison and Seau would've been another championship, your nuts.

Bottom line is you are making a half-arsed generalization. Bottom line is that Seau solidified the run defense and it ws the Colts RUNNING on the Pats in both the regular season and in the post-season that killed them just as much as the passes to the TE.

Had Seau been available against the run, then that puts Manning in much longer situations and the TE and RB won't get open as much because they have to run different routes. And it allows the Pats to put different coverages on the field.

The ONLY thing losing those two did was weaken the run defense, which we were still good at. If you think we missed Harrison's coverage, you obviously are not paying attention to Sanders. That guy played fine. The Colts beat us because we're no longer athletic, our defense is old and gets worn down.

I suggest you go back and watch the games. Both the regular season AND the post-season. Rhodes and Addai ran all over the Patriots. This allowed the Colts to go into short yardage packages and make it easier for their TEs to get open.

We're doing what we need to do, and that's adding play makers at the LB position. We have two playmakers, Colvin and Thomas. Bruschi and Vrabel are barely standing at this point. We need to continue to get younger. Altogether this is a damn fine defense, just not as athletic as it used to be. Untill we get LBs to play like Bruschi, Vrabel and McGinest used to play, we'll continue losing in the playoffs.

Not true. The Pats have players that will play like Bruschi and Vrabel used to. Thomas is every bit as good as Bruschi was. Vrabel really hasn't lost a step. His best position has always been OLB.

I think we have the defense to get it done, because signing Thomas eliminates the weakness over the middle with pass coverage because he's so versatile. IF, and IF, we can add a younger play maker to the LB rotation, I personally think this Patriot team can go punch for punch with the 04 squad.

The Pats need to add someone who is stout against the run. Who can line-up next to Bruschi for the 1st 2 downs. Seau proved he can do this. Hartwell might be able to do it.

Fact is that the Patriots need to stay HEALTHY, particularly in the secondary. That is why many of us are touring safeties and CBs. Because we recognize that. LB is an issue, but so is the depth at the CB and safety position.

OH, and while Sanders is ok behind Rodney and has played well, he's still got a long way to go. Hawkins and Scott, while they got the job done, can be improved upon.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Your right. Stats are misleading. For example, just because a team may have the #1 ranked pass defense doesn't mean they have the best pass defense in the league. Their run defense could be poor, therefore, teams don't have to throw the ball. The offenses the Pats played weren't power houses except for Cincy and Indy. Other than that, when you look at the schedule, mostly every team had a weak offense. With this in mind, the Pats still had a solid defense with what players they had and held most of their oppenents in check. I'm sure the coaching staff realizes this or else they wouldn't have signed the best free agent LB on the market. I firmly believe this will be the draft the Pats go defense heavily. I wouldn't be surprised if they move up to get an elite player to start right away. The Pats have 10 picks in this year's draft. They can't trade their compensetory selections so I don't think they will trade one of their 1st round picks for more picks in this year's draft. However, trading one of their 1st round picks for a #1 next year would be a good move as well. In sum, the Pats need to get more athletic on defense. Players are getting older and it showed in the AFCCG. The Pats did plenty to help correct their weakness at WR. Come draft time, the Pats will spend lots of draft picks on defense.

D-Line: One of the best in the league
LB's- Thomas was a great addition, yet needs more youth and speed
Secondary- Hopefully Samuel returns, the Pats need to draft a playmaking safety (Landry, Nelson) and a CB to compete with Hobbs.

After this draft, I guarentee most "experts" and "analysts" will be hopping onto the Pats bandwagon crowning them champs for the upcoming season. With the way the offseason has gone so far, don't count out the Pats being aggressive and trading up into the top 10. After the draft, most fans will be satisfied with where this team is heading for the '07 season.

 

[RayClay]

LB's accounted for 21 sacks in 2006. I'm not sure where that falls compared to past years.

Since we all watched most of the games, I don't think we need to rely on statistics.

Do you think we got the same pressure from our LBs early in the game that we did with McGinest, a younger Bruschi and a less worn out Vrabel?

Of course Colvin's contribution has increased since his injury.

 

[RayClay]

Your right. Stats are misleading. For example, just because a team may have the #1 ranked pass defense doesn't mean they have the best pass defense in the league. Their run defense could be poor, therefore, teams don't have to throw the ball. The offenses the Pats played weren't power houses except for Cincy and Indy. Other than that, when you look at the schedule, mostly every team had a weak offense. With this in mind, the Pats still had a solid defense with what players they had and held most of their oppenents in check. I'm sure the coaching staff realizes this or else they wouldn't have signed the best free agent LB on the market. I firmly believe this will be the draft the Pats go defense heavily. I wouldn't be surprised if they move up to get an elite player to start right away. The Pats have 10 picks in this year's draft. They can't trade their compensetory selections so I don't think they will trade one of their 1st round picks for more picks in this year's draft. However, trading one of their 1st round picks for a #1 next year would be a good move as well. In sum, the Pats need to get more athletic on defense. Players are getting older and it showed in the AFCCG. The Pats did plenty to help correct their weakness at WR. Come draft time, the Pats will spend lots of draft picks on defense.

D-Line: One of the best in the league
LB's- Thomas was a great addition, yet needs more youth and speed
Secondary- Hopefully Samuel returns, the Pats need to draft a playmaking safety (Landry, Nelson) and a CB to compete with Hobbs.

After this draft, I guarentee most "experts" and "analysts" will be hopping onto the Pats bandwagon crowning them champs for the upcoming season. With the way the offseason has gone so far, don't count out the Pats being aggressive and trading up into the top 10. After the draft, most fans will be satisfied with where this team is heading for the '07 season.

Very good point. Also good coaching and smart veterans can hide weaknesses.

The Colts managed to patch and hide weaknesses in time for the playoffs.

Unfortunately, we did it during the season, but one injury and the exposing of
TBC made it unravel.

Both teams need more talent on D. Fortunately, we addressed it in F.A. and will hopefully in that other thing.

 

[JDP111]

I will start by referencing stats:
- 14.6 PPG - lowest total in team history
- 10 passing TDs allowed (most of which was with our 3rd and 4th Safeties)
- 94.2 YPG

Before the injuries to Seau and Harrison the numbers were even better. You could make a valid point that there should have been more depth at ILB but give some credit to how the defense played in 06.

The Indy game was a once in a lifetime event, an overhaul isn't needed. We crushed Indy with LBs like Ted Johnson and Roman Phifer. Our CBs allowed 9 catched for 129 yards to one of the best WR tandems in history. Our 5th string CB and 6th string LB were exposed by a HOF QB, not really a surprise.

Can and should the defense (and offense) be expected to improve and get younger? Yes of course, I expect one day 1 and one day 2 LB to be added in the draft as well as a Safety and CB.

I would end by saying that if we have an above average offense, an above average defense and above average special teams plus a superior coach and QB; this is instantly enough to put the Pats in the top 2-3 teams in the league. Once the playoffs start it is not about beuing the best team it is about playing the best. I am not usually a Kool-aid drinker but as of April 1 I am very upbeat about the team.

Ding, Ding, Ding. For the Win!!!

 

[Michigan Dave]

a) We played a weaker bunch of offenses than usual --- especially in the NFC. We also had a good enough running attack to keep the clock moving a lot (compared, say, to the year before) keeping our defense off the field sometimes.

True. But we performed overall very well against the weaker competition, and by no means is having a running game that can chew up clock a reason to take away from a defense's performance.

b) We have reached a point like the Oilers reached against the Steelers when they gave up on Pastorini for a shot with Stabler. That is, we should focus on specific opponents we know we have to get past: the Colts come to mind. Even though our defense was very good in 2006, the Colts had what it took to overcome it on a regular basis. Rather than saying "our D was already great," or "our secondary is pretty good," we should say "We need a couple major changes to maximize the chances of ending our losing streak to the Colts."

I don't buy that at all. There is absolutely no reason to tailor your team to beating 1 specific team. It took a freak sequence of events for Indianapolis to beat us last year on their home turf. That doesn't mean there was a lot to be learned from that game- there absolutely was- but rather I'd prefer we fix the large issues (which are being addressed) and revamp the system to improve the unit because we are competing for a World Championship. I could care less what Indianapolis does/is doing. If we take care of our business, it's on them to beat us.

c) Our defensive line is great, but a great defensive line still can't be expected to pressure the quarterback on every play, more like a third of the plays. We need great coverage LBs, and great DBs (Ty Law was our best ever anti-Manning) or we'll have a lot more Colts moments where the pass rush doesn't reach Payton, who throws for 30+ points against our Back Eight.

Our front 7 is the best in the league. Our defensive backfield needs help, sure, but short from all-pros at every position, we're not in horrible shape. Asante is proving himself as one of the best in the league. Ellis Hobbs is coming on, and when Rodney and Geno are healthy, we have plenty of depth, because Sanders and Hawkins are capable. I think we'll address concerns in the draft, but I'm pretty pleased with our position right now. I sure as heck wouldn't trade rosters with Indianapolis.

 

[SeanBruschi54]

FACT: The team played a hellacious game against the Chargers and many of the players on defense were sick with the flu. The strain this year is pretty severe. It dehydrates you and, if it settles in your chest, can lead to pneumonia more often than in previous years. The result is that player get tired more easily.

That's a bull**** excuse and everyone knows it. We lost because we couldn't defend against the Colts TE/Slot receivers and cover everyone at once. No Flu, more exhaustion and injuries than anything else.

 

[Michigan Dave]

That's a bull**** excuse and everyone knows it. We lost because we couldn't defend against the Colts TE/Slot receivers and cover everyone at once. No Flu, more exhaustion and injuries than anything else.

I'm more apt to say we lost because we couldn't pick up a first down in the second half of the game. Heck, if we convert on 3rd down with 2 minutes left, people are talking about how we still have Peyton's number, and laughing at us frustrating Indy into a 3 and out on their critical last possession. The bottom line is that the loss was on the entire team. Both offense and defense failed in the second half. You're right- Indy exploited our difficulty to cover in the short zone and in front of the deep 2. So what did we do? Went out and got better.

 

[SeanBruschi54]

I'm more apt to say we lost because we couldn't pick up a first down in the second half of the game. Heck, if we convert on 3rd down with 2 minutes left, people are talking about how we still have Peyton's number, and laughing at us frustrating Indy into a 3 and out on their critical last possession. The bottom line is that the loss was on the entire team. Both offense and defense failed in the second half. You're right- Indy exploited our difficulty to cover in the short zone and in front of the deep 2. So what did we do? Went out and got better.

My point exactly. I agree with the offensive standpoint as well but was looking at it from a defensive standpoint.

The Flu excuse is petty and weak to me because of how exhausted and hurt our players were throughout the game. At one point we lost Colvin (muscle pull), Semour ( mutiple pulls or strains) Wilfork, Hobbs, Hawkins and Sanders for things like strains and exhaustion.

They got hurt and tired too quick too keep up.

 

[dhamz]

The Indy game was a once in a lifetime event, an overhaul isn't needed.

It was a once in a lfetime event that has somehow happenned each of the last 3 times we've played them, twice this past year.

There is plenty of room to use the draft and the remainder of FA to upgrade this team at LB and DB, especially up the middle at ILB and S.

Losing games because Rodney Harrison and Junior Seau are hurt is not bad luck. They have to be considered major injrury risks going into each season at this stage of their career. Maybe they stay healthy but counting on that is bad planning. Tedy Bruschi is also showing clear signs of slipping. Not having quality depth behind those 3 (and the TBCs of the world are not quality depth) would be a mistake.

 

[zippo59]

Since we all watched most of the games, I don't think we need to rely on statistics.

Do you think we got the same pressure from our LBs early in the game that we did with McGinest, a younger Bruschi and a less worn out Vrabel?

Of course Colvin's contribution has increased since his injury.

I wouldn't rely on perception because perception is not always true.

 

[zippo59]

I think the lack of athleticism at LB is WAY overstated. Do we need some younger players at LB? Absolutely. Is Bruschi still the same player he used to be. No, but he can still be a good contributor. People act like we have a bunch of bums, and that just isn't true. When have we ever had physical freaks at LB? The 3-4 defense values strength over speed when it comes to linebacker, especially ILB. Bruschi is on the decline, but I would consider Vrabel, Colvin, and Thomas all quite athletic.

 

[DaBruinz]

That's a bull**** excuse and everyone knows it. We lost because we couldn't defend against the Colts TE/Slot receivers and cover everyone at once. No Flu, more exhaustion and injuries than anything else.

Its not a BS excuse. Only people who have never played a sport in their life would call it that. And no, I don't believe you've played any sport except maybe peewee thumb wrestling 15 years ago.

There were a variety of factors that led to the Pats losing, not just one. So, how about you get a clue for a change and realize that there was no one specific reason the Pats lost. The reality is that there were a variety of factors, from the injuries to the flu to the exhaustion to the lack of depth at LB to the lack of depth in the defensive secondary to the lack of depth at RB.

 

[DaBruinz]

My point exactly. I agree with the offensive standpoint as well but was looking at it from a defensive standpoint.

The Flu excuse is petty and weak to me because of how exhausted and hurt our players were throughout the game. At one point we lost Colvin (muscle pull), Semour ( mutiple pulls or strains) Wilfork, Hobbs, Hawkins and Sanders for things like strains and exhaustion.

They got hurt and tired too quick too keep up.

*ROFLMAO* Why were they out from exhaustion? Have you ever had the flu? The flu taxes your body and makes it so that you get tired a LOT more quickly, regardless of how good of shape your body is in.

Now, maybe, instead of discounting what someone says only to turn around and provide the proof that supports what they say, you will stop and think about it.

Oh, btw, the flu strain this year is one of the worst they've seen, lasting up to 15 days. So, when you combine that with the hellacious game against San Diego that physically and mentally exhausted the Pats, its easy to see how they were able to get hurt more easily and weren't able to recover as easily. And it factors in with everything else.

 

[BelichickFan]

That's a bull**** excuse and everyone knows it. We lost because we couldn't defend against the Colts TE/Slot receivers and cover everyone at once. No Flu, more exhaustion and injuries than anything else.

The Colts were going to the TE just as much in the first half when they scored 6 points. It may be an excuse but it's valid. Flu. 4th road game in 5 weeks. Long trip to SD. One day less than Indy who had a shorter trip to Baltimore then didn't have to travel. It all adds up.

 

[PushnPencils]

*ROFLMAO* Why were they out from exhaustion? Have you ever had the flu? The flu taxes your body and makes it so that you get tired a LOT more quickly, regardless of how good of shape your body is in.

Now, maybe, instead of discounting what someone says only to turn around and provide the proof that supports what they say, you will stop and think about it.

Oh, btw, the flu strain this year is one of the worst they've seen, lasting up to 15 days. So, when you combine that with the hellacious game against San Diego that physically and mentally exhausted the Pats, its easy to see how they were able to get hurt more easily and weren't able to recover as easily. And it factors in with everything else.

Far be it from me to be a Colt's ballwasher, but one huge factor and kudos to him, was that Manning had an absolutely stellar second half of football.

He was making throws on the move and with great accuracy that I honestly didn't think he was capable of.

I think there were many times where when the pass coverage was very good and Manning was scrambling and buying time finding open receivers. Not folding up like a wet napkin as in the past.

So compound that with illness, fatigue, age.....I'm sure the Pat's for the first time in a long time, got demoralized.

Watching Manning hold Lomardi's trophy was a vomit inducing moment, but he deserved props for his performance during the AFC Champ. game.

 

[zippo59]

The Colts were going to the TE just as much in the first half when they scored 6 points. It may be an excuse but it's valid. Flu. 4th road game in 5 weeks. Long trip to SD. One day less than Indy who had a shorter trip to Baltimore then didn't have to travel. It all adds up.

Even Belichick admitted that the trip to San Diego took a big toll on the team, and that was before the Colts game. I'm not trying to use it as an excuse, we certainly have needs at defense that need to be adressed, but you can't say it was a complete non factor.