warren on the bubble

[Box_O_Rocks]

Well, before we finish idly writing off Ty amidst off-season speculation, we might wish to recall he finished 2009 with a torn groin which severely limited him. I could see where any hip problem might take second place to the groin, which he did have off-season surgery on, and it might have been in his best interest to not have surgery on the hip until the groin was fully healed up.

Ty played a good part of the season when he tore his groin, he couldn't rush the passer but still stuffed the run. I'll be surprised if NE moves on from him, a healthy Ty Warren brings too much to the table.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Sure, why wouldn't he be on the bubble? He's a large, highly-paid over-30 player with a bad hip. He's going to have to demonstrate that he can play at a high level post-surgery, as anyone would have to in that state. I hope for his sake and the team's that he is able to do that, but if he can't, I'd imagine that he would be cut.

 

[crowell33]

Well, before we finish idly writing off Ty amidst off-season speculation, we might wish to recall he finished 2009 with a torn groin which severely limited him. I could see where any hip problem might take second place to the groin, which he did have off-season surgery on, and it might have been in his best interest to not have surgery on the hip until the groin was fully healed up.

Ty played a good part of the season when he tore his groin, he couldn't rush the passer but still stuffed the run. I'll be surprised if NE moves on from him, a healthy Ty Warren brings too much to the table.

Agred a healthy Warren would bring much to the table. A once again unhealthy Warren probably brings the door.

 

[Ring 6]

Well, before we finish idly writing off Ty amidst off-season speculation, we might wish to recall he finished 2009 with a torn groin which severely limited him. I could see where any hip problem might take second place to the groin, which he did have off-season surgery on, and it might have been in his best interest to not have surgery on the hip until the groin was fully healed up.

Ty played a good part of the season when he tore his groin, he couldn't rush the passer but still stuffed the run. I'll be surprised if NE moves on from him, a healthy Ty Warren brings too much to the table.

He is by far the best DE on the team.
It appears now that those writing him off are qualifying it by saying if he is too injured to play then he would be gone, so lets add him to the group that included every player on the team.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

He is by far the best DE on the team.
It appears now that those writing him off are qualifying it by saying if he is too injured to play then he would be gone, so lets add him to the group that included every player on the team.

Too many qualifiers to make their case? Perish the thought. Being a simple rocks kind of guy, I look at more or less standard rehab windows and assume a player with Ty's known work ethic, who had his surgery early and was in the facility by week six rehabbing, is most likely going to be back to a high level and ready to rock when the season begins - then his well developed skill takes over and teams looking to run at him find themselves re-examining their running plans. And if he's got any of his explosiveness back, he's going to pressure the pocket just fine. What me worry (or is that improper patsfans etiquette)?

 

[crowell33]

He is by far the best DE on the team.
It appears now that those writing him off are qualifying it by saying if he is too injured to play then he would be gone, so lets add him to the group that included every player on the team.

Warren has a total of three (3) sacks over the last three seasons combined, 2008, 2009 & 2010. I would agree with you that any other highly paid player, who is over thirty, who has had three consecutive years of underproduction, has trouble staying on the field (22 missed games in the last 3 years ) & doesn't attend offseason team activities is in danger of his roster spot.

Not only does that not apply to Everyone on the team, I thing using the above history & qualifications, it applies ONLY to Warren.

 

[reflexblue]

We're all on the bubble. :singing:

 

[part-timer]

One question, whats to be gained by tradeing or cutting ty warren? If traded or cut his cap hit is going to be $5,270,844 and the saveings is going to be only $203,105. For only $203,105 it seems like a no brainer that he will stick if only for a situational rusher, or give him more time to rebound from the injuries. And even a partial Ty Warren may be a better option than many of the current options on the roster. Who will replace him for the value of $203,105 ? Just asking because this discussion seems to be financialy a no brainer.

 

[Ring 6]

Warren has a total of three (3) sacks over the last three seasons combined, 2008, 2009 & 2010. I would agree with you that any other highly paid player, who is over thirty, who has had three consecutive years of underproduction, has trouble staying on the field (22 missed games in the last 3 years ) & doesn't attend offseason team activities is in danger of his roster spot.

Not only does that not apply to Everyone on the team, I thing using the above history & qualifications, it applies ONLY to Warren.

How many sacks did you expect him to get in 2010 when he missed the whole season?
His effectiveness is also not measured in sacks. When he was playing hurt in 2009, we did not play much in passing situations, and his primary job is to play the run.
He has not had 3 years of underproduction, he has had one year on the IR, one dealing with an injury but playing well, and another where he had a very good 2008.
He doesnt 'have trouble staying on the field' he has had a serious injury that required surgery.
Were you saying Brady had trouble staying on the field in 2009 when he had missed 15 of the last 16 games?

There is simply no question that Warren is the best DE on this team. You seem to want to trash him for some reason, and exxagerate every thing you are saying. I don't get that. He has been an excellent player for this team who happened to sustain an injury that cost him last season. You seem very angry at him for that, as if it was on purpose or something.

 

[Ring 6]

One question, whats to be gained by tradeing or cutting ty warren? If traded or cut his cap hit is going to be $5,270,844 and the saveings is going to be only $203,105. For only $203,105 it seems like a no brainer that he will stick if only for a situational rusher, or give him more time to rebound from the injuries. And even a partial Ty Warren may be a better option than many of the current options on the roster. Who will replace him for the value of $203,105 ? Just asking because this discussion seems to be financialy a no brainer.

Situational rusher?
Warren is the best run stopping DE on the roster, by far.
Who are you starting at DE in the base, so you can turn a run stopper into a situational pass rusher?

 

[part-timer]

Those looking at any saveings in cutting an older injured high priced player should be lookng elseware. Try looking at back up Nick Kaczur, if cut or traded the saveings is $3,095,000, or under achieveing TBC who's saveings is at $1,895,000, both whom should become unnessisary after this draft. Then their is the possibility of James Sanders being pushed down the depth chart, and already being an overpriced back up with a saveings of $2,495,000 if cut or traded. That total saveings of $7,485,000 would be a significant saveings when you realize the current @ cap spending is $112 mill and the latest proposed cap offer was $114 Mill. Warren's cap saveings is absolutely no help to this team, his potential upside even if it is just for veteran presence greatly out wieghs any downside.

 

[part-timer]

Situational rusher?
Warren is the best run stopping DE on the roster, by far.
Who are you starting at DE in the base, so you can turn a run stopper into a situational pass rusher?

DID YOU READ THE WHOLE POST? Or are you just looking for an argument? I esentialy said it is obtuse to consider cutting or tradeing Ty at even minimul contribution and you still try to find confrontation in that.

 

[Ring 6]

DID YOU READ THE WHOLE POST? Or are you just looking for an argument? I esentialy said it is obtuse to consider cutting or tradeing Ty at even minimul contribution and you still try to find confrontation in that.

I did, which is why I asked why you would expect to use a runstopping DE as a situational pass rusher.

 

[part-timer]

I did, which is why I asked why you would expect to use a runstopping DE as a situational pass rusher.

If you read the post answer the question I posted and stop trying to deflect from the nature of the post. And do not try to read anything into what I said, my point was clear.

 

[Ring 6]

If you read the post answer the question I posted and stop trying to deflect from the nature of the post. And do not try to read anything into what I said, my point was clear.

There is no reason to cut him, that is obvious.
The fact that you got that right doesnt change the fact that you are expecting him to be a pass rusher when he is the best run defending DE we have by far.
It sounds like you want an overall + or - for your post and no discussion on what is in it??????????

 

[part-timer]

There is no reason to cut him, that is obvious.

Thank you for agreeing with me that their is no reason to replace replace Ty. But I will not be baited into an obtuse confrontation with you as others have.

I am not seeking any form of aproval from you on the posts, you appear a little to full of yourself. Keep yor + and - to yourself.


Dealing with some posters is like throwing stones into a bottomless pit. No matter how many you throw their is nothing of substance to hit.
Point Taken?

 

[Ring 6]

There is no reason to cut him, that is obvious.

Thank you for agreeing with me that their is no reason to replace replace Ty. But I will not be baited into an obtuse confrontation with you as others have.


Dealing with some posters is like throwing stones into a bottomless pit. No matter how many you throw their is nothing of substance to hit.
Point Taken?

Whatever any of that means, my point stands, that Warren is not a sub package situational pass rusher, but a run stopper first and foremost. I still dont know if you even disagree?

 

[RayClay]

I believe it was said to be a 6 month rehab at the time which begged the question why had he not dealt with it in the offseason of last year or even the year before (since it had reportedly been bothering him for a couple of years).

My understanding was he aggravated an old injury in training camp, which would make the specualtion about putting off surgery incorrect. He was scheduled to rest it, not have surgery.

It's in the archives of this place somewhere.

Here

Warren re-injured the hip in the third practice of the training camp. He expects a pretty decently long rehab.

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/s...why-now-from-patriots-de-ty-warren-and-links/

He'd been playing on this since 2005. They don't suggest surgery for this, but rest. After reinjuring it, he just couldn'r go, it had ZERO to do with school.

Rappy apparently doesn't mind making up stories that conflict with his own later reporting, he did the same with implying Brace was obviously out of shape..

 

[DaBruinz]

One question, whats to be gained by tradeing or cutting ty warren? If traded or cut his cap hit is going to be $5,270,844 and the saveings is going to be only $203,105. For only $203,105 it seems like a no brainer that he will stick if only for a situational rusher, or give him more time to rebound from the injuries. And even a partial Ty Warren may be a better option than many of the current options on the roster. Who will replace him for the value of $203,105 ? Just asking because this discussion seems to be financialy a no brainer.

Part-Timer - You are correct in your assertion that cutting Warren would have little benefit in regards to the salary cap.

That being said, the other part of your reasoning makes no sense. As Andy Johnson pointed out, Warren is NOT a situational pass rusher. He is your 1st/2nd down DE whose primary job has been to take on the double-team on the left side against the running game.

Not sure why you were getting upset when Andy was just trying to get you to clarify.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Bubble veteran players are overpaid / under productive ...

That is definitely not Warren ... no use adding to many of the fine answers already posted.