10 things I think most of us can agree on at the bye

[TheRainMaker]

Jules wasn't Julio Jones "elite" but was elite when it mattered.

Brach was cut from that same cloth.

So let me ask you this. If they were on bad teams with mediocre to bad QB's, would they be "elite when it mattered"?

 

[The Gr8est]

Rose 100% had room for Jack on the floating door. *****.

 

[The Gr8est]

 

[Steve102]

 

[RobertWeathers]

So let me ask you this. If they were on bad teams with mediocre to bad QB's, would they be "elite when it mattered"?

You can't think of the player/position like that. It's not a binary thing.

A QB can be elite but if the receiver can't get open and catch the ball he ain't getting it.

A receiver can be elite but if the QB sucks is he getting the ball.

If the line sucks then it's over. If the system is a lousy fit for the WR then he won't be successful.

Would Jerry Rice catch 120 balls for 1500yds from Mac Jones?

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Rose 100% had room for Jack on the floating door. *****.

Room, sure. But would it still have floated with both their weight?

 

[TheRainMaker]

You can't think of the player/position like that. It's not a binary thing.

A QB can be elite but if the receiver can't get open and catch the ball he ain't getting it.

A receiver can be elite but if the QB sucks is he getting the ball.

If the line sucks then it's over. If the system is a lousy fit for the WR then he won't be successful.

Would Jerry Rice catch 120 balls for 1500yds from Mac Jones?

Randy Moss still caught 1,000 yards from Kerry Collins who was a mediocre QB. He caught 1,000 from Matt Cassel who was also meh. I'm not going to go into other examples, but the best WR's in game still find ways to get the ball.

My point was that you can't fault the NFL's elite WR's because they played on mediocre or bad teams. They can only do so much. They did not have the luxury of playing with Tom Brady and the Pats teams they had in the early 2000's and 2010's. Branch and more so with Edelman got to be a part of teams that went to many AFCCG's and Super Bowls.

And to answer your question about Mac Jones. No, he's on another level of bad.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Randy Moss still caught 1,000 yards from Kerry Collins who was a mediocre QB.

Kerry Collins was a top 5 pick who made 2 ProBowls and threw for 40k yards and Air Coryell was a perfect offense for him and Moss. Point it he had talent throwing to him

He caught 1,000 from Matt Cassell who was also meh.

The 2008 NEP were a good team and Cassel was talented as he had good years in KC before he broke down.

I'm not going to go into other examples, but the best WR's in game still find ways to get the ball. But my point was that you can't fault the NFL's elite WR's because they played on mediocre or bad teams. They did not have the luxury of playing with Tom Brady and the Pats teams they had in the early 2000's and 2010's.

Yes as long as there is talent at the Qb position and the system is advantageous to their skillset.

And to answer your question about Mac Jones. No, he's on another level of bad.

Agree

 

[TheRainMaker]

Kerry Collins was a top 5 pick who made 2 ProBowls and threw for 40k yards and Air Coryell was a perfect offense for him and Moss. Point it he had talent throwing to him

Larry Fitzgerald caught 1,400 yards from Josh McCown and Shaun King in 2004. But this is getting away from what I was originally asking about for Branch and Edelman.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Larry Fitzgerald caught 1,400 yards from Josh McCown and Shaun King in 2004.

He didn't. It was 2005 he had 1400yds and Kurt Warner was there.

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But this is getting away from what I was originally asking about for Branch and Edelman.

It but you brought it up the whole elite WRs can kick ass with crappy QBs and crappy teams and i'm disagreeing with you so...

 

[TheRainMaker]

He didn't. It was 2005 he had 1400yds and Kurt Warner was there.

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It but you brought it up the whole elite WRs can kick ass with crappy QBs and crappy teams and i'm disagreeing with you so...

My bad. He had 1,100 yards with Derek Anderson.

Andre Johnson had 1,100 yards with David Carr in 2004. There you go. I'm not going into other examples.

 

[RobertWeathers]

My bad. He had 1,100 yards with Derek Anderson.

I should hope so. He had 173 targets.

Andre Johnson had 1,100 yards with David Carr in 2004. There you go. I'm not going into other examples.

2 corner cases.....

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Kerry Collins was a top 5 pick who made 2 ProBowls and threw for 40k yards

Yup I rate him over Bledsoe

Randy Moss still caught 1,000 yards from Kerry Collins who was a mediocre QB. He caught 1,000 from Matt Cassel who was also meh. I'm not going to go into other examples, but the best WR's in game still find ways to get the ball.

Besides Grogan these guys had crap throwing to them - and still made the big plays

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Room, sure. But would it still have floated with both their weight?

Jack wasn't gonna take that chance - he loved her

I would've looked for another plank

*Edit: TBH I would've jumped into the boat when Rose was in it & they were lowering it away. Risk being called selfish & cowardly, but I'm in that damn boat & we're making it - and Hockley can go to Hell. There are lots of obstacles and challenges in a relationship - for me it's 'we' not 'her'

At this time in that culture, I'd be considered a cad and accused of jeopardizing the lives of the others on the boat. But I'd be breathing.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

No one could've predicted Edelman's developing the way he did.

Belichick kept him and believed in him; he was Welker's heir apparent

 

[TheRainMaker]

I should hope so. He had 173 targets.

2 corner cases.....

Isaac Bruce found a way to reach 1,000 yards multiple times before Warner arrived. In fact, he lead the league in receiving yards with Tony Banks at QB in 1996. I'm not going spend my day looking up more examples as you should be getting the point by now.

Getting back to the original argument, you can't put Edelman and Branch in the same class as Moss, Terrell Owens, Marvin Harrison, Steve Smith, Reggie Wayne, Fitzgerald, Julio Jones, Andre Johnson, Antonio Brown, Chad Johnson, Holt, Bruce, etc because they have more rings than them and played in more big games. That's just stupid talk.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

A lot of us knew the Patricia experiment would be a disaster.

I never had a problem with the Patricia and Judge hirings.

The entire media and fan world obviously did, still do and will forever.

Patricia IS qualified and DID do an actually good job.

Zappe is and will continue to be capable of leading an NFL team to the playoffs at least.

It is Bill O'Brien who is actually deserving of all the criticism leveled at Matt Patricia.

And Mac Jones is not as good as Hugh Millen or Tony Eason.

And the flying elvis sucks. Always has, always will. Brady won here despite a lot of things, especially the uniform.

 

[Steve102]

And the flying elvis sucks. Always has, always will. Brady won here despite a lot of things, especially the uniform.

Do you have this coded into every post ? Like HTML or some ****? You are consistent, my man.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Belichick kept him and believed in him; he was Welker's heir apparent

Edelman was supposed to be that guy. Remember when Bill featured him earlier over Welker in the 2012 season? But then Bill signed Amendola with the intention for him to be the guy. Edelman turned out to be the guy after all.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Isaac Bruce found a way to reach 1,000 yards multiple times before Warner arrived. In fact, he lead the league in receiving yards with Tony Banks at QB in 1996. I'm not going spend my day looking up more examples as you should be getting the point by now.

Getting back to the original argument, you can't put Edelman and Branch in the same class as Moss, Terrell Owens, Marvin Harrison, Steve Smith, Reggie Wayne, Fitzgerald, Julio Jones, Andre Johnson, Antonio Brown, Chad Johnson, Holt, Bruce, etc because they have more rings than them and played in more big games. That's just stupid talk.

I get your point and your analysis is still incomplete. Need to factor in everything else not just the QB.