Mayo as "the anti-BB" -- something to watch going forward

[Real fan 02]

New Patriots Running Back Makes Telling Comment on Jerod Mayo

Recently-signed New England Patriots running back Antonio Gibson likes what he sees in first-year head coach Jerod Mayo.

heavy.com

This comment by Gibson seeing Mayo as "one of the guys" caught my eye. Is that what you want in a head coach? Apparently at Bob Kraft's behest, team culture in Foxboro is undergoing a radical change -- for better or worse is TBD. Yes, it's extremely early for the new regime and one isolated example of the anticipated "player-friendly vibe" Jerod brings to the table. I'm just hoping the pendulum doesn't swing too far in the direction opposite Bill Belichick's iron-fisted approach, that discipline and individual sacrifice toward team goals don't become casualties along the way.

It's very interesting... ownership I can say knows the culture of thier franchise.. even vets like McCourty had mentioned that he sensed thier needed to be some change when he was there last 2 seasons..

I can this.. if we can get back to winning sooner than later it makes the belief and buy in much realer.

 

[palialka]

Nobody wants another Pete Carroll.
But what kind of player was Mayo?
Very good, not a superstar but a very good,dependable player.
Go back to when he was playing, numerous players and coaches felt he'd be an nfl hc.
BB called him a " coach on the field".
He had great work ethic and was highly disciplined.
A HC can be  both a "players coach" and the unquestioned boss who can lay down the law when necessary.
Ex.A is one if the greatest HC's in the history of American team sports, Coach Pop of the San Antonio Spurs.
As tough,hard-nosed and intelligent as BB but also a players coach.
As for explayers, I see 2 guys who were both known to be players coaches starting out- Mike Ditka and Larry Bird. But both were the boss and could be disciplinarian when necessary. Similar to how both played
Those 2 were unusual in that both were superstar players who went on to become great HCs. Bird didn't do it for too long. It just wore him out. But he was good.
So I guess we can take some hope from those dudes.
Have to see how it plays out with Mayo but the type of player he was suggests he won't be a pushover

This

For me, the fascinating/exciting aspect of all of this is that we’re heading into totally new territory with probable radical changes. It has been decades since the Pats organization and the fans have experienced such a difference.

As far as what type of HC Mayo will be, that’s TBD. It’s certainly doable to be a “player’s coach” but still command the respect of the players and hold them accountable. As you noted, Mayo could fit this bill because of the type of player he was on the field and how he was a natural leader.

It’s easy to be a “player’s coach” in the off season when trying to build a rapport with the team. The key for Mayo will be how he can balance that with commanding respect and getting the team to function as a unit under his direction. We should start to see the signs of this come OTAs and TC.

We also have to keep in mind that Mayo finding his identity as a HC will be a fluid process; especially in the beginning. The HC he is now might be vastly different from what we see this time next year. He has to learn on the job.

 

[condon84]

Mayo should be judged on his own merit. Whether it's more player friendly or not, let the guy run his own ship.

Kraft needs to give Mayo space and let him run his program.

 

[Real fan 02]

Mayo should be judged on his own merit. Whether it's more player friendly or not, let the guy run his own ship.

Kraft needs to give Mayo space and let him run his program.

Absolutely correct!!! Get the QB, develop him correctly, allow JM to run his team, coach his own way, his own style..

 

[TheRainMaker]

I don't want a BB imposter as it has been proven to not work. I'm totally fine with Mayo being himself and if he wants to be "one of the guys" then so be it. That is the current trend in today's NFL. But where it's crossing the line is Coaches are celebrating with players which I find very cheesy and slightly unprofessional. Don Martindale regularly celebrated with the Ravens players and was wearing gold chains. Sean McVay ran into the end zone and celebrated a TD where the ref came in and told him to exit the field. The That's the kind of stuff I don't want to see.

 

[TommyD4207]

Idk, but found it shocking if true. Not sure why he would lie.

So people like you will quote him on messageboards, forcing them to remember who the hell Adam Butler was?

 

[upstater1]

I'm sure a lot of us have been around coaches all our lives, whether they coached us or coached our kids, and sometimes the chemistry is right, and sometimes it isn't. I've seen yellers who the kids loved, I've seen coaches who don't say much during games but who are pricks, I've seen liars and straight shooters. There's really no way to know. Some players really liked Matt Patricia, others didn't.

The most important thing when it comes to player-coach dynamics is the players themselves. If you have a certain type of player and certain kind of mindset, and enough strong-willed players are on the team, then all the rest of the players will bend toward them and take their cues.

If your leaders are selfish, the coach really doesn't matter.

I look at a guy like Keion White and I think, how do you coach him? From the outside looking in, he appears to be a mean SOB. Joe Greene? Terrell Suggs? Just a straight cuss of a player.

What do you do with him?

 

[Tunescribe]

I'm sure a lot of us have been around coaches all our lives, whether they coached us or coached our kids, and sometimes the chemistry is right, and sometimes it isn't. I've seen yellers who the kids loved, I've seen coaches who don't say much during games but who are pricks, I've seen liars and straight shooters. There's really no way to know. Some players really liked Matt Patricia, others didn't.

The most important thing when it comes to player-coach dynamics is the players themselves. If you have a certain type of player and certain kind of mindset, and enough strong-willed players are on the team, then all the rest of the players will bend toward them and take their cues.

If your leaders are selfish, the coach really doesn't matter.

I look at a guy like Keion White and I think, how do you coach him? From the outside looking in, he appears to be a mean SOB. Joe Greene? Terrell Suggs? Just a straight cuss of a player.

What do you do with him?

As I've said, where the rubber meets the road is how players respond to being pushed beyond their comfort level. This is inevitable, since most won't or can't do it on their own. Keion White strikes me as a guy who's pretty self-motivated.

 

[vicspats]

Inevitably, push will come to shove. Whether Mayo can be "one of the guys" yet crack the whip when needed will be interesting to see play out.

In your personal life .. as far as career went.. did you ever see it work out? Has to be some chain of command?

 

[vicspats]

I think a big difference between Mayo's role and BB's, is former will only be HC, while the latter was HC/GM. That's a huge difference.

Many players complained about Bill the GM, which I have to believe forced Bill, the HC, not to get too close.

Regardless, there's nothing new here. Mayo in his introductory speach pretty much spelled it out: he wants to empower players to hold themselves accountable. If they don't, he'll drop the hammer. Mayo comes from a disciplined family background. Nobody is going to push him around. You don't need to have players, literally living in "fear" to get goals accomplished.

He said he was gonna spend a lot of cash. Seems like he already got pushed around.

 

[venecol]

So people like you will quote him on messageboards, forcing them to remember who the hell Adam Butler was?

 

[patfanken]

In your personal life .. as far as career went.. did you ever see it work out? Has to be some chain of command?

Yes there HAS to be a chain of command...BUT the only real way a coach can be successful is to "be himself". Mike Vrabel was a "players coach" with the titans, but also stayed to his :LB's mentality and laid down the law fearlessly.

Listen, the only thing that matters for Mayo is will the team follow his program, and that depends on whether the team believes in what he and the staff are doing. Think about this. What do players ultimately want? They want a coach and coaches who bring out the best from them. They have to the believe that the various game plans give them a great chance of winning, and IF they lose believe that if the plans were executed better they would have won. This is the way Bellichick did it. He got his players to believe that every week, REGARDLESS of the other team's strengths, their team's game plans were better than the other teams....at least most of the time. If Mayo can create that belief then players will accept ANY adversity, even losing at first....IF they can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

AND just like in players coaches develop too AND their style has to change to reflect their ever changing rosters and strengths and weaknesses. If I were coaching the Pats for THIS season, positivity would be the mantra. The Pats didn't go nuts and immediately bring on big contracts on older players. This will be a fairly young group. They will all come in understanding that this is a rebuilding program. The goal for THIS team is to see consistent improvement from August to January, in ALL areas of play.

In the isn't what we as fans really want to see this year. I would love to think this is like 2001 where the Pats were selected as the team LEAST likely to win a superbowl over the next 5 seasons, and then proceeded to win 3 in the next 4 years. But more realistically, I think the vast majority of Pats fans will be very happy IF they see things coming together over the course of the season.

THEN as the team matures and grows into a contender, I would hope Mayo changes with it. WHEN this team learns what it takes to win consistently in this league and has created a culture of success, THEN he can be anything he wants to be as long as it isn't fake. Players want consistency over all. They WANT to believe.

We shall see. Could be a great situation, could be a disaster. But think about this, the Krafts have had pretty good run of HC's the last 30 years. Parcells, Carroll (who was sabotaged by the GM here, but history proved he was a very good HC), and Bellichick. They have been a patient and consistent presence .

 

[venecol]

As I've said, where the rubber meets the road is how players respond to being pushed beyond their comfort level. This is inevitable, since most won't or can't do it on their own. Keion White strikes me as a guy who's pretty self-motivated.

This is such nonsense. This isn't peewee. These are men in the N F L. Stop acting like they're a bunch of ignorant children that need to be whipped into compliance.

The biggest difference is Mayo/Wolf will treat these guys like men and with respect. There's no need to scream at, or embarrass players in front of the entire team, to motivate them. There's no need to leave a talented player off the field because they fumbled a ball 6 games ago.

Things will be different, but at the end of the day, it'll be about the talent of the players. You guys give coaching waaaaaay too much credit. It's the players, stupid. 100% the players.

 

[venecol]

He said he was gonna spend a lot of cash. Seems like he already got pushed around.

Was never up to him. He's not the GM.

 

[TommyD4207]

View attachment 57216

Ok, so people like you, and Ian?

 

[JohnJH]

So basically, no 9 SB appearances with 6 SB wins in 20 years (or reasonable facsimile thereof). Got it.

 

[Boomer B]

As I've said, where the rubber meets the road is how players respond to being pushed beyond their comfort level. This is inevitable, since most won't or can't do it on their own. Keion White strikes me as a guy who's pretty self-motivated.

About 10 years ago, in my late 30’s I ran a financial institution. I had one older guy who was rough around the edges, not always politically correct, but his clients loved him and he was my top sales person. Our corporate head hated him and asked me to fire him. refused and said I ain’t firing my top guy. The employees appreciated that I would stand up for them and I had a great relationship with them but I held them accountable to produce.

That in my opinion is the key for Mayo. You can be nice but the players have to be held accountable. I hope he does well.

 

[Tunescribe]

This is such nonsense. This isn't peewee. These are men in the N F L. Stop acting like they're a bunch of ignorant children that need to be whipped into compliance.

The biggest difference is Mayo/Wolf will treat these guys like men and with respect. There's no need to scream at, or embarrass players in front of the entire team, to motivate them. There's no need to leave a talented player off the field because they fumbled a ball 6 games ago.

Things will be different, but at the end of the day, it'll be about the talent of the players. You guys give coaching waaaaaay too much credit. It's the players, stupid. 100% the players.

You don't understand and never have. Organized team sports -- football in particular -- aren't in your personal realm of experience, it's obvious.

No, they're not "a bunch of ignorant children that need to be whipped into compliance," have to be punished for messing up or driven by fear. That's not what this is about. Winning on talent alone happens, certainly. Winning consistently at a championship level over an extended period requires extraordinary effort beyond what talent offers. Talent is just the baseline. It necessitates discipline, commitment and a level of personal sacrifice most people aren't comfortable with and can't achieve alone. That's where good coaching is an essential difference maker. It doesn't matter what style, hard-ass, player's coach, etc. as long as it works and players are sufficiently motivated to accomplish what they never could individually.

Rob Gronkowski praises Bill Belichick amid ‘The Dynasty’ backlash

Speaking on MassLive's "Eye on Foxborough" podcast, Rob Gronkowski heaped plenty of praise on his former head coach in Bill Belichick.

www.boston.com

 

[venecol]

It necessitates discipline, commitment and a level of personal sacrifice most people aren't comfortable with and can't achieve alone. That's where good coaching is an essential difference maker. It doesn't matter what style, hard-ass, player's coach, etc. as long as it works and players are sufficiently motivated to accomplish what they never could individually.

Then this ^^^ doesn't make your OP below, make much sense.

I'm just hoping the pendulum doesn't swing too far in the direction opposite Bill Belichick's iron-fisted approach, that discipline and individual sacrifice toward team goals don't become casualties along the way.

If the style doesn't matter, why would you be concerned with swinging too far in the direction opposite of the hard-ass approach?

Maybe you have an agenda: laying seeds questioning Mayo's style (of which you know nothing about), to blame him at the first sign of adversity (which is bound to happen w/ a rookie HC, QB and new O coaching staff).

 

[vicspats]

Yes there HAS to be a chain of command...BUT the only real way a coach can be successful is to "be himself". Mike Vrabel was a "players coach" with the titans, but also stayed to his :LB's mentality and laid down the law fearlessly.

Listen, the only thing that matters for Mayo is will the team follow his program, and that depends on whether the team believes in what he and the staff are doing. Think about this. What do players ultimately want? They want a coach and coaches who bring out the best from them. They have to the believe that the various game plans give them a great chance of winning, and IF they lose believe that if the plans were executed better they would have won. This is the way Bellichick did it. He got his players to believe that every week, REGARDLESS of the other team's strengths, their team's game plans were better than the other teams....at least most of the time. If Mayo can create that belief then players will accept ANY adversity, even losing at first....IF they can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

AND just like in players coaches develop too AND their style has to change to reflect their ever changing rosters and strengths and weaknesses. If I were coaching the Pats for THIS season, positivity would be the mantra. The Pats didn't go nuts and immediately bring on big contracts on older players. This will be a fairly young group. They will all come in understanding that this is a rebuilding program. The goal for THIS team is to see consistent improvement from August to January, in ALL areas of play.

In the isn't what we as fans really want to see this year. I would love to think this is like 2001 where the Pats were selected as the team LEAST likely to win a superbowl over the next 5 seasons, and then proceeded to win 3 in the next 4 years. But more realistically, I think the vast majority of Pats fans will be very happy IF they see things coming together over the course of the season.

THEN as the team matures and grows into a contender, I would hope Mayo changes with it. WHEN this team learns what it takes to win consistently in this league and has created a culture of success, THEN he can be anything he wants to be as long as it isn't fake. Players want consistency over all. They WANT to believe.

We shall see. Could be a great situation, could be a disaster. But think about this, the Krafts have had pretty good run of HC's the last 30 years. Parcells, Carroll (who was sabotaged by the GM here, but history proved he was a very good HC), and Bellichick. They have been a patient and consistent presence .

Excellent post. And I agree with the idea Mayo needs to get his guys to buy in. I just think that we come from a different time. And by that I mean this new generation of players are here to get paid. I’m not sure 100% of today’s athletes once they become professional across the board care about the championships like us fans do. So when you ask what do players ultimately want, in high school and college I absolutely agree. They want leadership and tough coaching , for the most part. At the pro level I’m going out on a limb and say there’s a growing number of athletes want to stay healthy, good investment advice , and walk away with some type of legacy wealth. I could be wrong. I think that’s were Bill lost his players. He knew nothing about the crypto market or the sneaker deals. This pro sport field definitely changed over the last 20 years.