Top 4 Players that would help the Pats Defense

Discussion in 'Patriots Draft Talk' started by KillEM, Oct 13, 2008.

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  1. KillEM

    KillEM Banned

    The 34 simply doesnt work with an old Mike Vrabel and Adalius Thomas. Neither can generate any sort of pass rush this year at all. It's still a mystery where we will end up drafting but I will assume its in the 15-24 range. But we have two 2nd rounders and possibly two 3rd rounders. Moving up to take a high impact player could be in our best interests.

    1. George Selvie - Best pass rusher in college. Potentially a Top 5 pick. Could slip due to lack of size. Would be a perfect 34 OLB... 6'4 245lbs... quick off the edge and a great motor. Linebacker speed.

    2. Brian Orakpo - Top 8-15 pick... could fit the 34 OLB as well. Might be a bit of a project. Will definitely impress at the Combine and raise his draft stock a la Vernon Gholston.

    3. Rey Maualuga - Top 8-18 pick... ILB with great size and blitzing ability. Would be a perfect fit next to Mayo. Downhill type guy that would fit the SILB role perfectly and allow our sideline to sideline LB Mayo make his plays. Shows good instincts and hands in coverage even though he's a bit raw in that area.

    4. Brandon Spikes - 20-30 pick at this point. ILB that makes tackles and can drop back in coverage and get INTs. Seems like a "safe" pick. More of a sure thing than #2 and 3. Vocal/Emotional leader of the Gators D.

    I'm looking at our LB corps right now and comparing it to the Superbowl years when we had one of the deepest LB corps in history. We are a couple years late in rebuilding the LB's. We should already have back ups that are ready to step in and take over for Bruschi and Vrabel. Yet we used a Top 10 pick on an ILB last year and still have two major holes to fill. I'm not alone when I say we MUST get another impact LB next year. Dansby and Suggs will be too expensive in free agency. One of the 4 LB's above will slip to the 15-20 range. We might have to trade up.

    Our defense simply has too many holes to draft another TE in the 1st rd or take a WR and wait a few years for them to develop.

    I know there are needs on Offensive Line as well but you can get a quality RG or RT in the 2nd round. Same with CB, as it's a really deep class for corners and we already have a future starter in Wheatley. The 34 simply does NOT work without quality linebackers and our Defense will look old and slow as long as we have Bruschi and Vrabel in there.
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2008
  2. KillEM

    KillEM Banned

    Ideally George Selvie would slip to us. This is the type of player that could come in and have a Merriman-type impact for someones defense.

    His size will scare off a lot of 43 teams. I originally had him going to Miami Dolphins BUT Joey Porter and Matt Roth are starting to look like a good combo of OLBs over there. SanFran might also want to upgrade at OLB, but they have other needs as well. If Selvie passes those two teams, he could slip to us, or at least slip enough that we'd trade up and nab him.

    I'm not as sold on Orakpo. He hasn't produced nearly as well as Selvie has. Orakpo does however have better size for the NFL.
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2008
  3. Jimke

    Jimke In the Starting Line-Up

    While the defense needs pass rushers badly, I believe the Pats need a top

    notch offensive lineman even more. If Brady plays behind the current

    bunch, he is going to get injured once again. The Pats are no longer a

    team that is loaded with talent. They need half a dozen new starters

    at OG, OT, TE, SS, MLB, and CB. BB/Pioli have had some average/poor

    drafts and the talent had eroded.
  4. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    #12 Jersey

    We need two impact players on defense.

    1.) A pass rushing demon off the edge. See last night's San Diego game for reference. We didn't touch Rivers all night. Thomas needs to be moved inside and Mayo needs to be moved to ST.

    2.) A shut down corner that won't give up 50 yard bombs and forces opposing QB's to look to the other side of the field or underneath rather than challenge the shut down CB. Then let BB draw up some exotic schemes to deal with those areas. Our current secondary is weak and does not have 1 single playmaker in it.

    Everything else on your list is wondow dressing. Although I am becoming more and more convinced Watson is not the answer at TE and BB needs to re-examine this position some in the off season.
  5. BradyManny

    BradyManny Pro Bowl Player

    You have it in for Mayo or something? He wasn't the problem last nite.
  6. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    #12 Jersey

    We all know that BB loves his veterans. They have won him a ton of games in the past and he values them very highly. A lot of people are wishing that BB would have started his LB replenishment program years ago so we would have young veterans to move into the line up now, and while that is wishful thinking, the bottom line is we can't change the past.

    At the end of the day, it is how this team does in Nov and Dec that will ultimately determine if BB's faith in his veterans was correct.
  7. Jimke

    Jimke In the Starting Line-Up

    Without any improvements in the offensive line, how do you plan to keep

    Tom Brady in a vertiical position?
  8. BRiZ

    BRiZ Third String But Playing on Special Teams

    if Maualuga is on the board when its our pick you simply cannot pass on him. He is the perfect 3-4 inside strongside backer and with Bruschi retiring its almost a no brainer. Him and Mayo inside would be downright scary.

    They really need to draft a stud corner though, its getting rediculous getting burned by the pass over and over again, Malcolm Jenkins is 6'0" with sub 4.5 speed he has great size and physicality we desperatly need at the position.

    Vrabel needs to be upgraded with a stud pass rushing OLB, we could probably find a decent one with one of our two 2nds or two 3rds.
  9. BritPat

    BritPat In the Starting Line-Up

    #54 Jersey


    I know you didn't want us to draft Mayo, but he has been by far our best linebacker (which admittedly isn't a huge achievement right now) this year. He is not the problem. Anyone believing he is has either a major grudge, or doesn't watch nearly as much football as they should. Tedy has been my favourite Patriot forever, but his time is done. Did he even register a single tackle last night?

    I do agree with the rest of your post though. We need a 'sudden' off the edge. A Ware, a Merriman, a young Adalius. Move the old one inside and get someone outside that is going to make the opposing OT wish he'd phoned in sick.

    And we desperately need OT help in the draft. Whether they be LT, or RT. Something needs to be done.
  10. BritPat

    BritPat In the Starting Line-Up

    #54 Jersey

    I think both OLB positions need to be looked at, whether it be through a change in personnel or a change in schemes. Whatever we are doing is not working, whether that be because of the player or the scheme. It needs sorting. And soon.
  11. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 Supporter Supporter

    #54 Jersey

    Great post, nice info. I don't know how they got that picture of me running a 40, usually I keep my shirt on...

    Since this is a crazy season, I will post my crazy idea. Wilfork's play has slipped a little since he became leaner and meaner. I had hopes for him to become the next Casey Hampton or Jamal Williams. I don't want to give up on him but just as a possibility, what if the Pats didn't extend Wilfork and decided to spend their money on a DE like Terrell Suggs.

    Potential NTs
    Terrance Taylor, Michigan, 6'0, 318, round 1
    B.J. Raji, Boston College, 6'1, 325, rounds 2-3
    Ron Brace, Boston College, developmental

    Terrence Cody, Alabama, 6'5, 368 - big and slow, but big
  12. KillEM

    KillEM Banned

    Terrell Suggs production has dropped every year he's been in the league and he's only 25....

    Not a good sign
  13. patsfan55

    patsfan55 In the Starting Line-Up

    #95 Jersey

    I know we can't change the past, but omg the last few drafts have been sooo frustrating. First, I want linebackers, then I want Greg Jennings. I thought, ehh I'll just drink the koolaid and believe in BB and Pioli. Look where that has gotten us. In trouble, that's where. Sorry, had to rant. The problem with the whole vet linebackers is he inherited a few great ones: Willie, Bruschi, Ted who weren't too old, and grabbed a few cheap: Vrabel, Phifer, Cox who all panned out. Bruschi was a playmaker when BB first got here, Willie still had some gas left in the tank, Ted was still a great run stuffing silb, and Vrabel was just being discovered. Phifer was great in pass coverage, and Cox was the vet who could lay the lumber. Now? Adalius is the overpaid decent at everything great at nothing scrub, Vrabel is out of position (as the go to pass rusher, trust me he was never that great, only good as a guy to scheme with, not just take a guy one on one), and Bruschi who is running on fumes. At least we have one promising young linebacker. Thing is, if we had drafted linebackers a few yrs ago we'd have our replacements ready, and they would have already learned the system.
  14. KillEM

    KillEM Banned

    Thanks bud. That's what I was trying to get at. Don't forget about losing Colvin and Junior Seau too.

    Did BB and Pioli seriously not foresee this happening?

    When we won our last SuperBowl I remember one of the commentators saying the Pats had the DEEPEST LB Corps ever.

    Did BB think we could replace that with Eric Alexander and Pierre Woods?
  15. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    #12 Jersey

    Whoever is in charge of weighing people at Alabama is obviously "challenged numbers wise". If Cody is a pound under 400 is it because he hasn't had breakfast yet. But what a huge clog in the middle of the defense. He commands double teams, can't be moved and naturally funnels everything to the outside. I think this kid is a future starter in a 3-4 defense. BB don't let Pittsburgh or San Diego beat you like a dog and draft this kid out from under your best friend's nose.

    But I think you have an excellent point, Wilfork is not the same player he was last season. I think he is more focused on staying injury free for the next 27 games then mixing it up inside. However important to note, Seymour and Warren have not been anything special either this season.

    One More note on Alabama. BB draft ILB McClain in April 2010. The kid is a beast and will have had 3 years of experience in YOUR defense by April 2010. He has size, speed, some intelligence and is extremely adept at run stuffing and not too horrible in pass coverage.

    PS: BB, your best friend is a liar when it comes to evaluating offensive personnel. John Parker Wilson is not NFL QB material. Stay away from him, let the Jets or Miami take him. He is horrible!!!!!!!!!!
  16. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    #12 Jersey

    It's still early in the season and the Pats players played a ton of games last season and suffered a devastating injury to their QB earlier in the year. Mentally they are probably extremely exhausted. I am willing to give them a couple more games to see if they improve their play.
  17. dryheat44

    dryheat44 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    #11 Jersey

    Yeah, I don't really get that. I don't think he's as good as Croyle.
  18. Warren94

    Warren94 Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

    Give me Wm Moore in the first round IT sures up the secondary from WR having all the pasture around. Cushing is going to fall in the 2nd round ala Paul Pozluns (however u spell it) take him 2nd round and the other pick use OG or CB take ur pick.
  19. captain stone

    captain stone Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

    No Jersey Selected

    Great thread, folks. I'm glad to see that everyone here has put down the kool-aid and has looked at this team for what it is: a former dynasty whose time has gone, and whose roster is lacking youthful quality depth at several positions because of the craptacularly atrocious drafts of 2004 & 2007. Not only does the defense - and the OL - need an overhaul, but the FO does also, esp. its college scouting dept. In fact, if the value is there, then the OL must be given top priority in next year's draft, because Protecting The Franchise must be the top priority of this FO.
  20. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 Supporter Supporter

    #3 Jersey

    College scouting is as much art as it is science. The best analogy I've ever heard is one describing college admissions: deciding who to draft isn't comparing apples to oranges; it's comparing apples, oranges, pears, bananas, etc., while trying to decide which one, when fed to a cow today, will produce the tastiest steak two to three years down the road.

    As a case in point: consider Chad Jackson v. Greg Jennings. We see Chad Jackson as a bust, and Greg Jennings having success in Green Bay. Unfortunately, though, the Pats don't have a crystal ball, so they can only work with the information they had at the time. Yes, in retrospect, they made a mistake, but you can't make the argument that "they should have known" back then that Jennings would be better; the information they had simply did not lead them to that conclusion. [And, I might add, there's no way of knowing, e.g., that Jennings wouldn't have had even worse injuries in Foxboro than Jackson did.]
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