The OFFICIAL Patriots vs Bills PostGame Thread

[Joker]

What are you talking about? Yes, the team has those problems, but when did I say they were playing poorly because they are coached to do so? All I'm saying is this is Belichick's defense, not Patricia's. Calling for Matt ******* Patricia to be fired is absolutely dumb, because he's doing what Belichick is telling him to do. He's running his system. If you think anyone here is at fault for this mess, it's Bill.

Uh...sorry...I forgot who you are...yeah, you're right...that wasn't Patricia making the calls every single play of the game...it was BB...carry on...Patricia is just a scarecrow.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

The Patriots are scoring at an all-time sort of level. Why would BB be so stupid as to fire McDaniels with that being the case?

Because people demand instant satisfaction and will cut off their nose to spite their face??

 

[jnug]

I am so tired of this trick play calling bull. For crying out loud as I said in the game thread can we never just line up and take it to somebody....even for a yard or two with multiple downs on the goal line? JM missed his calling. Needs to cart his butt off to arena football.

As for the defense, I am really worried now on several levels.

The Pats obviously feel like they must keep the lumber on the field particularly at LB or they get carved up by the opposing team's running game. However that leaves those same LB lumbering around the field like a herd of lost elephants several yards behind just about anybody they are covering.

I think this defense is actually worse than even the most pessimistic of us think it is because it really is not as adept as it used to be at stopping the run, has to leave its run stoppers on the field by necessity, guys that happen to be less capable as every down defenders as we are used to seeing. They are pretty terrible as pass defenders leaving the defense even more exposed to the pass. Then of course we are confronted by the dual problems of no pass rush and a horrific secondary.

I think the offense can certainly perform well enough even given some of the dropped balls and what have you if JM would just cut the horse manure and just let his superior players beat the other teams inferior players. This play calling garbage has just gotten to the point of being totally ridiculous.

If they can't really improve considerably on defense than JM really needs to cut the bull. They will need every point they can get their hands on every game they play and have the talent to just go out there and get it done. Cut the bull Josh....now please!

I no longer think this defense can make major improvement on the hoped for BB game by game improvement plan. Just to little talent fighting an uphill battle in a league that has made significant rule changes to favor offenses.

So, I think the problem for the offense is coaching while the problem for the defense is a significant lack of talent dictating some questionable coaching decisions. However I do think that the problems start for this defense with a significant lack of talent, more exposed year after year by the way this league has decided to bias toward offense. BB's traditional approach of using players that are smart and can absorb his schemes but that might not be very complete as athletes seems to be getting less and less relevant each year and less and less effective to boot.

 

[RodThePat]

Uh...sorry...I forgot who you are...yeah, you're right...that wasn't Patricia making the calls every single play of the game...it was BB...carry on...Patricia is just a scarecrow.

Do you honestly believe Patricia has the final word on the gameplan, or that he doesn't consult Bill on the playcall in do or die situations? Answer honestly. This is Bill Belichick's system, and it's his defense. Matt Patricia is a second-year DC, it's completely unfair to assign the blame unto him, and keep Belichick clean.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

The Patriots secondary is so maligned the last couple years that when they actually have a decent game like today, and still people are calling them out. The problem wasn't the secondary today, it was the front seven, specifically the LBs. Out of Fitzpatrick's 337 yards, 165 were to wideouts. Spiller and Jackson accounted for 246 yards in total offense. You can't blame that on the DBs. Nor the 76 yards the TEs picked up versus the LBs.

The DBs didn't play great, but if the front seven had played at the same level as them, the game would not have been close at the end.

I didn't pay attention to this. If true that is a good point of perspective.

 

[upstater1]

One other thing regarding people complaining about McDaniels switching RBs in and out. Ridley had another 22 carries today. He's toward the top in the league.

The Patriots' offense obviously runs a lot of plays. They need Woodhead and Vereen out there.

 

[hodgey]

Honest question I would love some different perspectives on:

Why does the D continue to employ the same strategy game after game series after series when it has been such a failure. Im thrilled to be at 6-3 and with the win today. The constant cover 2 shell soft zone rush 3 or maybe 4 men has been a disaster for a long while yet they keep doing it. Scoring 37 pts and having a stupid decision by an opposing QB saved our collective *sses. Our linebackers are slow and get killed in zone.... Who on this forum would fire the DC? Who on this forum recommends we keep the same defensive philosophy? we are wasting years of the best offense footballs ever seen with a vanilla crappy coached defense......

 

[Joker]

Because people demand instant satisfaction and will cut off their nose to spite their face??

In no way do I want any change at O co-ordinator. What I DO want is better situation awareness out of A FORMER HEAD COACH who should recognize the usefulness of end game strategy and clock burning..there NO justification for the quick pitch before the 2 minute warning just as there is NO justification for sitting Brady in the end zone for three consecutive passing plays, burning just TEN seconds, and giving the friggin' ball BACK to a QB who is tearing the defense apart at will...did McD NOT notice what Fitz was doing to the D?....the defense DID make two crucial TO's happen in the 4th quarter which led to the victory...it should NEVER have come down to that....you have the ball at the ONE yard line, first and goal with 2:30 left and the Bill get the ball back at 1:50????? without using a TO?

 

[goheels22002]

Honest question I would love some different perspectives on:

Why does the D continue to employ the same strategy game after game series after series when it has been such a failure. Im thrilled to be at 6-3 and with the win today. The constant cover 2 shell soft zone rush 3 or maybe 4 men has been a disaster for a long while yet they keep doing it. Scoring 37 pts and having a stupid decision by an opposing QB saved our collective *sses. Our linebackers are slow and get killed in zone.... Who on this forum would fire the DC? Who on this forum recommends we keep the same defensive philosophy? we are wasting years of the best offense footballs ever seen with a vanilla crappy coached defense......

Before you fire anybody, it's probably worth considering that the Patriots are tied with the Chicago Bears with a +16 takeaway ratio.

 

[Joker]

Do you honestly believe Patricia has the final word on the gameplan, or that he doesn't consult Bill on the playcall in do or die situations? Answer honestly. This is Bill Belichick's system, and it's his defense. Matt Patricia is a second-year DC, it's completely unfair to assign the blame unto him, and keep Belichick clean.

Like I said..you go GET that BB....he was the one who called a three man rush on third and nine at the Bills 22...it just LOOKED like Patricia made that call...BB made ALL the calls, you're right...I'm gonna go over here-------------> and carry on ,OK?...you go get that BB...

 

[DaBruinz]

One other thing regarding people complaining about McDaniels switching RBs in and out. Ridley had another 22 carries today. He's toward the top in the league.

The Patriots' offense obviously runs a lot of plays. They need Woodhead and Vereen out there.

No one is complaining about them rotating the backs. The complaint is the TIMING of the rotation and that it seems to cut into the momentum and telegraphs the upcoming play.

 

[Cassanova792]

Before you fire anybody, it's probably worth considering that the Patriots are tied with the Chicago Bears with a +16 takeaway ratio.

It's because we have talented playmakers out there, despite what people think. This defense would actually be very good if we had a different defensive philosophy that maximizes our players strengths instead of running a "one size fits all" scheme.

 

[QB12]

Mayo played horrible today. Surprised he wasn't on Reiss' 'Who's Down' list.

 

[Joker]

it was obvious Buffalo knew a large part of the offensive plays by recognition...that's an intradivision thing...you expect a defense to read and react better the second time around on certain packages...that STILL doesn't really matter because of how good this offense is at moving the ball no matter how many plays the defense makes on drives...the timing of these McD brainstorm plays has been widely argued here all season though and today's game had a few more of these WTF moments late in the 4th

 

[hodgey]

Before you fire anybody, it's probably worth considering that the Patriots are tied with the Chicago Bears with a +16 takeaway ratio.

Thats exactly why we need to make some drastic adjustments now. Maybe Talib will provide some of the answers. Today we benefitted from 148 penalty yards from the bills D, 3 turnovers from their offense opposed to 0 from ours. They had 481 total yards and 33 first downs despite the aforementioned and our O scoring 37 pts. If that doesnt scream scheme and or stategy change somebody is verging on insanity. Btw we needed a miracle to win this one.

 

[DaBruinz]

Do you honestly believe Patricia has the final word on the gameplan, or that he doesn't consult Bill on the playcall in do or die situations? Answer honestly. This is Bill Belichick's system, and it's his defense. Matt Patricia is a second-year DC, it's completely unfair to assign the blame unto him, and keep Belichick clean.

Have you read even ONE of the books that has been published about BB and the Patriots?

Gameplans are a conglomeration of all the coaches on that particular side of the ball. So, no, Patricia doesn't have the "FINAL" say.

But Patricia DOES have the final say on the calls going in unless BB specifically takes over. And he's done that in only ONE case that I can remember. That was when Eric Mangini was the DC.

Yes, it is Bill Belichick's system. While this is Patricia's second year as a DC, he's been a positional coach for some 6 years prior to that. BB wouldn't have put him in charge of the defense if BB didn't have full trust in Patricia.

What's funny is that people seem to have forgotten the job that Patricia did against the Broncos last year. How they totally switched up the gameplan after the 1st quarter and came storming back.

There are a variety of issues, but the biggest one is clearly the lack of practice time that 1st and 2nd year players have had because of the new CBA. It's resulted in a significantly slowed progression AND, imho, injuries to be higher.

 

[jnug]

As I mentioned in the post above I don't think the issue is coaching on defense. While there may well be some questionable defensive calls, they are really trying to work around a defense that is simply not very talented.

The reason you see pretty similar vanilla defense game after game is because they are overplaying the run. They are overplaying the run, leaving their run stoppers on the field. However these guys are not particularly great every down defenders and it exacerbates the situation on pass plays. The Pats are picking their poison on defense, choosing not to be carved up by the run and forcing the other team's QB and receiver corp to beat them....given the profile of this particular defense, it is likely the only choice they have. The Pats defenders are simply not very good. They just don't have enough guys that can both stop the run and not get eaten up in pass coverage. This defense will really struggle against teams that feature a truly balanced offensive attack and/or teams with great QB's.

To me, the Pats or I guess I should say BB's traditional approach to defense is simply growing long in the tooth. He needs better athletes to play against the high powered offenses are the outgrowth of league rules changes favoring offense.

The offense IS great and seems stymied by JM's determination to prove he is more clever than everybody else. He needs to cut the bull and just let his better offense beat the other team's lesser defense. If he keeps this up when they finally see a team that can keep up with them offensively (and they will) they will end up being eaten alive by JM's propensity to have his offense stop itself!

 

[Joker]

There are a variety of issues, but the biggest one is clearly the lack of practice time that 1st and 2nd year players have had because of the new CBA. It's resulted in a significantly slowed progression AND, imho, injuries to be higher.

exactl...and I'm just pi$$ed at Patricia because of the timing of his calls and the perfect counterplays being run by the Bills...the thing is it's Kirkpatrick...just rush this melonhead EVERY pass play, he'll fold...he will next week...watch

 

[Run DMC]

When Talib starts we need to play press coverage with the db's. DMc should stay at safety. He is clearly our best safety and better at safety than CB. Gregory blows. Chung is adequate at SS if he would stop launching himself on to the IR squad.

Our LB's are atrocious at pass coverage. Atrocious.

Rushing 3 and playing soft zone on 3rd and 10 with the game on the line? I will never understand that type of play calling.

McD getting cute late in the 4th qtr with the game on the line. Pulling Ridley out every time he started gaining momentum.

Lots of very questionable scheming.

Could've lost this one easily. Thankfully Fitz is fitz.

 

[jnug]

It does not matter whether the rules changes you want to talk about are those specific to protecting QB's and receivers thereby biasing toward offense or rules changes that limit practice time....it all means the same thing. The Pats need better athletes on defense, meaning more talented players and less reliance on defensive schemes.

By the way, that does not mean that the Pats must make a 180* turn on drafting defenders. However what we see today is a byproduct of using the very same approach to building a defense, draft after draft after draft. BB must feed in a healthier mix of talented athletes with guys that can absorb his complex defensive schemes quickly.