Taking another look at the cap situation for next season.

[supafly]

If Gronk was just a "TE" this would make emminent sense. But Gronk is not only the best in-line TE in the league, he's also happens to be our best outside WR as well. Our best deep threat, because even when he's covered he's a bad match up most of the time, and our best GL option.

So what are the best WR's making? Say its in the 10-12 range (just a guess, btw) The best TE's are in the 8 range (as you point out) So isn't Gronk's versitility worth something extra as perhaps the most impactful non-QB offensive player in the league. The guy plays a key role in both the pass and run games, and is the player you know other teams have to make special adjustments to.

But like you said, he's missed a season's worth of games, and he's under contract for another 3 seasons after this one. So I guess you don't HAVE to do anything, but SHOULD you?

I don't think they should concern themselves with this issue for at least another year. Possibly after the end of the 2017 season, prior to 2018. I think that would be fair and reasonable for both parties.

 

[Miguel]

So I guess you don't HAVE to do anything, but SHOULD you?

In return for extending Gronk in 2017, what do the Patriots get?
Can we please refrain from the words HAVE and SHOULD? The NFL is a business. Therefore, SHOULD and HAVE are inappropriate terms.

 

[Miguel]

So what are the best WR's making? Say its in the 10-12 range (just a guess, btw) ?

The best WRs are being paid in the 14M range.

 

[Miguel]

Is it even in Butler's best interest to take a long term offer from the Pats?

Yes.
1.) Passing on the risk of injury to the Patriots.
2.) Time value of money. A dollar received today is worth more than a dollar received a year from today.

Is it in the Patriots' best interest to offer Butler a long-term deal?

Yes.
1.) On a team that has yet to settle on their number 2 and number 3 cornerback Butler is by far the Patriots best player on a key position in this passing league.
2.) If Butler continues to improve, his price tag will only increase.

 

[PScottman]

Unlikely that he leaves. He really likes it here. This is a place that appreciates his high IQ and recognizes all the small things he does in a game to ensure victory.

I would postulate that the outcome of the season will have a significant influence - both on the team as well as Bennett. There is a vast difference between winning the Super Bowl and not in regards to how free agent vets approach resigning as well as how the team reacts in kind.

 

[PScottman]

I've never understood why they throw deep to Edelman, it never really seems to work

He has to have separation enough for Brady to "lay it in" over the top and while he has excellent shuttle speed and acceleration, his straight-line speed isn't his best skill. He also doesn't have the height to create space at the point of the catch if the DB is tight where he can reach ahead to snag the over the top throw.

I've said before, this team will utilize early plays to set up later plays. Now if the play works - awesome, but if it doesn't it does force the opposition to adjust against a similar look later which may allow exploitation whether by the same player or another versus the defense or player alignment that offensive formation may now dictate.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

In return for extending Gronk in 2017, what do the Patriots get?
Can we please refrain from the words HAVE and SHOULD? The NFL is a business. Therefore, SHOULD and HAVE are inappropriate terms.

Gronkowski has a lot of tread wear on his tires. I just wonder if bb will go there.

 

[Ivan]

Gronkowski has a lot of tread wear on his tires. I just wonder if bb will go there.

Look at Brady's numbers in the red zone with and without Gronk, an extension would be wise.

 

[PP2]

I would postulate that the outcome of the season will have a significant influence - both on the team as well as Bennett. There is a vast difference between winning the Super Bowl and not in regards to how free agent vets approach resigning as well as how the team reacts in kind.

That's true, except Bennett is on the downside of his career- this is his 9th year. I think he's going to want to stay with a highly competent team that will manage him very efficiently (and he is smart enough to recognize that).

 

[tasmlab]

You heard it here first - Pats extend Jimmy G this offseason - part of the reason they've accumulated that excess cap space. He's going nowhere, he's the QB of the future in NE. They hand JG some decent money up front -say $10M- but put off the bulk of big guaranteed bonuses for 2 years (meaning they start to come after next season). Brady has this year and next, that's it. And don't be shocked if he gets Tony Romoed next fall.

This doesn't fit with my idealized, fantasy-like storyline I prefer of Brady playing in New England for the next 20 years.

 

[goheels22002]

Just out of curiosity, how do both player + team go about attempting to determine proper financial compensation at this point in time?

Is Garoppolo worth, say, 5m dollars a year, 10m dollars a year, or 20m dollars a year? Lots of gray area there. I think it would be quite difficult to try and come to an agreement right now. Just my opinion.

You are correct. Garoppolo is worth what some other team is willing to offer him.

The Brock Osweiler contract has to give most teams pause - $72M over 4 years with $39 guaranteed for years 1 and 2. So far, that contract hasn't been worth it, but we need to wait until the end of the 2017 season to be sure.

Some team could be desperate enough to offer that kind of money to Garoppolo, especially since he's got some legitimate experience. Unless the Patriots have a clear understanding of Brady's situation, they'll never commit to that kind of deal.

 

[PP2]

You heard it here first - Pats extend Jimmy G this offseason - part of the reason they've accumulated that excess cap space. He's going nowhere, he's the QB of the future in NE. They hand JG some decent money up front -say $10M- but put off the bulk of big guaranteed bonuses for 2 years (meaning they start to come after next season). Brady has this year and next, that's it. And don't be shocked if he gets Tony Romoed next fall.

Then you'll have to re-register as Garappolo'sbuttboy

 

[patfanken]

I originally posted this thread because, with the probable end of Volmer's career, the Collins and Jones' trades, and Sheard's demotion, the Pats seemed to be in the situation of having more cap space than anticipated (now upward of $70MM), and fewer high profile FA's that they need to sign. Thus the situation has changed a bit from questioning, 'do we have enough cap space to sign everyone', to looking more like the Pats being significant players in next season's FA market.

There is STILL a lot of work to do with our own FA's but it would seem the high profile needs are narrowing to the point where this upcoming FA period could be more interesting for Pats fans than in the past.

BTW- Thanks for all the good discussion and information.

 

[meatface]

Hightower has to get the tagged right?

 

[patsbrasilpatriotas]

Here' the elephant in the rook: Brady

Despite how long HE thinks he can play, we can still see a bit of the sharpness coming off the blade. His long balls haven't been what they used to. He makes some, to be sure, but he's also been off target on several in the past few games, especially to Edelman. Now, Brady is locked up through the '17 season, IIRC, but after that? I know folks don't want to think about the post-Brady era, let alone TALK about it, but it will happen, and odds are it will be sooner than we think.

Right now New England has Jimmy G in the fold. I'd be holding off talk on trades until the team gets through THIS season. What happens if New England wins it all, and Gisele talks Tommy into hanging up his cleats? It's not that far-fetched a scenario. At some point, she's going to want him home as a full-time dad to the kids. So if the team trades Alladin early, and then Brady suddenly decides to retire?

Yeah, I know. I know. Crazy talk. Brady's gonna play forever, yadda yadda yadda. But teams need a contingency plan, and to my mind, New England would be foolish to trade Jimmy G before seeing how things play out with Brady next year at training camp.

YMMV, of course, but these sorts of scenarios need to be addressed by teams that have an edge and want to keep it.

Sir, all do respect but you are wrong... Maybe it's more a problem with Edelman. He is the BEST slot receiver but that doesn't mean that he can be a great deep target.

With Hogan:

Brady has been extremely efficient with the deep ball, sitting at first in adjusted completion percentage, at 66.7, and passer rating on deep throws, at 143.8. Despite the fewest deep attempts (15), Brady is 14th in deep-passing yards, at 383, and his average yards per deep completion has been 42.5, second only to Ryan Tannehill.

Bovada is not giving money away ... There is a reason he will be mvp,

 

[patsbrasilpatriotas]

You heard it here first - Pats extend Jimmy G this offseason - part of the reason they've accumulated that excess cap space. He's going nowhere, he's the QB of the future in NE. They hand JG some decent money up front -say $10M- but put off the bulk of big guaranteed bonuses for 2 years (meaning they start to come after next season). Brady has this year and next, that's it. And don't be shocked if he gets Tony Romoed next fall.

Yes, they've accumulated cap space to extend the backup QB, not Collins, HT, Chandler Jones, Butler and all other depth guys ...

So, they will cut Brady in 2018 and his brand new 14m dollars dead money that they signed this year, because they always knew that JG is ''the future'' and that's why they add 2 more years to Brady's previous contract instead of just wait his original contract end in 2017 ...

2016:BB: JG is ''the future''
What we do?
2016: Kraft: Brady's contract is up in 2017. BB: Let's give him 2 additional years and after one we cut him.

 

[Miguel]

You heard it here first - Pats extend Jimmy G this offseason - part of the reason they've accumulated that excess cap space. He's going nowhere, he's the QB of the future in NE. They hand JG some decent money up front -say $10M- but put off the bulk of big guaranteed bonuses for 2 years (meaning they start to come after next season).

Brady is due $31 million in cash the next 3 seasons. How much do you expect to pay his backup for those years? More or less?

 

[Marqui]

I hope they resign Vollmer to a cheap team friendly contract if he still wants to play.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Can Herr Vollmer play? Hip status & outlook?

Alles ist ordnung, oder nicht?

 

[VJCPatriot]

Butler and Hightower are our top 2 extension priorities imo.
After that, everything is pretty much gravy.
It would be nice to extend Bennet to an extra 2-3 year contract.

After that we have some room to manuever with the cap.
Here are the top free agents of 2017:

2017 NFL Free Agents Tracker

Of those Jason Pierre-Paul DE, Eric Berry FS, Matt Kalil LT, Trumaine Johnson CB, Luke Joeckel G could be difference makers for us.
If we add one of those players, how much better would our defense or offensive line become?