Report: Pats sign DT Tommy Kelly

[Brady2Moss]

Because your point IS poorly supported, thoughtless graffitti.

Kontradiction made an argument on the very same side of yours and it was a quality, thoughtful and informative one. No one came down on him.

Have you ever put down your crayons and wondered why?

What kind of mod are you when all you do is insult posters to make yourself feel better?

I just put a huge post about the old guys we've signed from 2010 on and how the only good ones are Waters, Carter, and maybe Lloyd (I count him as good, but many do not).

I think you view Kontradiction's post as "quality, thoughtful, and informative" because it was more tempered and less likely to enflame your homer senses. He essentially said the same thing, but that theres a chance it could work out.

Which if you paid attention I concede early on, just pointing out he is more likely than not going to be meh.

 

[Danger Zone]

Because your point IS poorly supported, thoughtless graffitti.

Kontradiction made an argument on the very same side of yours and it was a quality, thoughtful and informative one. No one came down on him.

Have you ever put down your crayons and wondered why?

This sums up my entire opinion on the matter very nicely.

Between this and Jack Bauer's thoughts, I have nothing to add. Well said.

 

[JackBauer]

It's not "what I do" you do not understand what the phrase "playing the victim" means I'm not hurt or looking for support from you or anyone else. I'm just responding to those that respond to me. I don't plan to say people are being unfair, I actually never said that. I just point out that calling me a **** and a douche doesn't make my opinion not valid or me any less knowledgeable than the know it alls on this board. It is hilarious how you seem to be implying I have no right to defend my opinion and am a cry baby

Yes there is a lot of negativity towards these signings from me because the past has shown they are not going to fix the problems the team has. I'm not going to go through this thread to placate you, go look through yourself plenty are acting like we're going to have some super duper interior pass rush now because of this guy.

I don't plan to say people are being unfair, I actually never said that. I just point out that calling me a **** and a douche doesn't make my opinion not valid. You act like I come here wanting to be called a **** for disagreeing

Sorry, but when people come into this thread quoting me saying they added more to the board by not posting in 3 weeks or to call me a **** because I have not agreed with them in every circumstance I tend to think its because they have some bias in regards to my opinion.

What exactly is the "obvious" that you think everyone is stating. To me it just seems like everyone is sick of me not being positive about moves I think are crap. Which seems like a defense mechanism by some on here against anything negative against this team.

So, to summarize:

1.) You say you're not playing the victim, and then proceed to play the victim.
2.) You say the "the past has shown they are not going to fix the problems the team has," which is so mind-boggling I'm going to simply note it without comment, other than to note that if you want to know why you're such a lightning rod for criticism, this would be exhibit A.
3.) You neglect, once again, to support your assertions by quoting the remarks you've taken exception to, reinforcing the perception that you're playing the victim and not arguing in good faith.

I think what's obvious is people are just tired of your one-trick pony show. It's really a chore, more than anything else.

 

[Ring 6]

What kind of mod are you when all you do is insult posters to make yourself feel better?

I just put a huge post about the old guys we've signed from 2010 on and how the only good ones are Waters, Carter, and maybe Lloyd (I count him as good, but many do not).

I think you view Kontradiction's post as "quality, thoughtful, and informative" because it was more tempered and less likely to enflame your homer senses. He essentially said the same thing, but that theres a chance it could work out.

Which if you paid attention I concede early on, just pointing out he is more likely than not going to be meh.

Perhaps you should take a step back and realize that your posts are generally focussed on trashing the opinions of others, while lumping anyone who is naturally going to disagree with you into a category that you go on to describe as mindless.
Beauties such as this abound:

If BB signed a turd he crapped out 2 years ago people would be saying what a great value signing and that the turd was all-toilet bowl caliber 2 years ago.

And maybe you might stop being so defensive, obstinate, and anti-social in your posting, and focus on football.
Then maybe people will read and think about your opinions instead of laughing at your demeanor, and dismissing that there is any unbiased rational thought behind it.

Just sayin.

 

[Deus Irae]

This is another signing that we can't really evaluate without knowing the money end. He was either in pretty steep decline last season, or he just mailed it in. Either way, as long as the deal is low in immediate guarantees/bonuses, and protects the team in the event that Kelly flames out, it's a solid signing and a worthwhile attempt to make at shoring up the line. I'd rather have gotten his former teammate, but that was never going to happen. So, the DT rotation seems something like this, to date...

Run tackles: Love, Deaderick
Rush tackles: Armstead, Kelly
The man: Wilfork


Seem about right?

 

[Brady2Moss]

Well that isn't true.
What is consistent is that you take exaggerated opinions on everything, almost always negatively, and are widely disagreed with. It isn't any faction of people that always disagree with you, its that almost everything you say is disagreed with by many. The disagreers are wide and varied.

Just like those that disagree with me exaggerate my opinions like you proceed to do in this very post (4 wins a year comment ) Pot calling the kettle black.

See above. No one has made those comments. You will get disagreed with on this because, well, you are wrong. Then you will call anyone who disagrees a homer.

Obviously no one has said it but implicitly it is implied because of the same comments year after year that these signings are cutting it. 3 years of accepting this type of garbage hole filling is implicitly saying what I said.

This one is somewhat self-explanatory.

It is actually a double standard, not self-explanatory.

Again, a wild exaggeration.

Not a wild exaggeration, posters bring up Rodney, Phifer, etc. and Carter aka signings made 10+ years ago and Carter

We have consistently used veterans as part of the team building method and have consistently won. Your support that a plan is bad would need to include a lack of success, would it not?

You act like the measure of success is not different for this team. It is Super Bowl or Bust every single year and guess what by that standard its been a bust for 8 years.

Older players are also better. Would you rather have a healthy young guy that can't play?

Older players are less expensive and therefore a smaller risk when signed, but also less likely to fix the problem. Are you serious that a 32 year old is better than a player in his prime? Wait you would rather have an injured guy that can play? Because that is what you just implied whereas I never implied that I wanted a healthy guy that can't play I want a healthy guy that can.

They were role players. Every team has them. Brown was not a veteran. Moulden was a waiver wire pickup not a FA.

Exactly I never said I expect every signing to have great expectations, exactly why I said meh? In response to the guy saying Kelly's decline was because his head was in his ass and that we're going to have a devouring line next year because of this signing. I understand there are role players, my meh was directly in response to some of the crazies in here overhyping this guy he'll be a role player at best. And yes they are role players, but they were the ONLY help brought in to fix the pass rush and outside receiver problem and they FAILED and the team FAILED because of it in the last game of the year.

That is my exact point you are bringing in ROLE PLAYERS to fix huge HOLES. DO YOU GET IT?

See above, this is an example of what is self-explanatory.

I don't even know what you mean by this.

So guys who were brought in to compete for a backup job are your definition of poor signings

Again taking this all out of context they are only poor signings if they are all they do to address pass rush, corner, and TE depth. Our TE depth was not good enough again and hurt us, our pass rush was not good enough again and hurt us. I admit they tried with Jones and Talib this year finally.

What position have 'holes existed for years' that they are doing nothing but signing over the hill players for? That is a ludicrous statement.

They've recently tried filling pass rush and corner with players that have worked: Jones and Talib this YEAR! Sorry but drafting busts at corner isn't really doing anything about it because the end result is the same. I guess we can give Bill an A for effort though wasting picks on busts

So your argument is that you choose why they lost (in 3 seasons where they were 39-9 a 1,1 and 2 seed, and went to a SB and AFCCG) in order to support your argument so therefore they lost for that reason?
They drafted Jones, Bequette, Cunningham. They signed Carter, Anderson, Fanene and Armstead.
At corner they drafted McCourty, Dowling, Dennard and traded for then signed Talib.
They do not value outside receivers, so they signed Amendola, drafted Gronk and Hernandez, and continue to fill in the outside receiver spot cheaply because they do not value it. Pretty simple actually.

Only good players out of all those "attempts" to fill the problem are Jones, Carter, Anderson, McCourty, and Dennard tons more failures partly because of bad scouting and bad free agent pick ups. I'm not going to go into a huge argument about how else you can fix these problems with more proven players (pssstttt young free agents in a year where the market is down)

And much more than you give credit for has been done and continues to be done which is why they contend and in fact were one play away from winning a SB a year ago.

They've done nothing to become better than the team that should've won the Super Bowl if Gronk was healthy. I'm expecting a similar result next year if this is the final team. I'm tired of being the team that "should've" won and making excuses apparently you are not.

Better why?
He hasn't missed a game in 5 years. What are 'these kind of players'? I wasn't aware Kelly was part of a race of players.

Better because it doesn't set up unrealistic expectations, I see that you have been in LaLa Land for so long you do not even understand the problem with unrealistic expectations. Players like old over the hill players that have been cut for being unproductive with their old teams. You can't be that dumb can you?

A lame, and untrue excuse. Many people dislike many moves, and some agree and some disagree, most often different people each time.
You take one side every time, and find some disagreeing with you then decide it must be the same people in order to pretend your take doesn't stink.
Your takes stink, and the majority is against almost all of your opinions.
That is a you issue, not a them issue.

I don't care abut the majority, it doesn't mean they are right. I believe I'm more right than they are as I'm sure they also feel. Problem is my view is supported by FACTS, these over the hill guys are RARELY working for us lately.

See above. Self explanatory.

What?

3 1 or 2 seeds is certainly a condemnation of the personell decisions around here, they should be embarrassed.

They sure should be when they have the best QB of all time and have wasted his last few years with crap defense and even crappier outside receivers. Stop acting like being the Colts of the early 2000s is good enough. It was something we made fun of those Colts fans for, for years.

Yes, this team just lacks 'real players'. Amazing they can win 4 games a year.
Again, self explanatory.

Nice exaggeration.

 

[Brady2Moss]

So, to summarize:

1.) You say you're not playing the victim, and then proceed to play the victim.
2.) You say the "the past has shown they are not going to fix the problems the team has," which is so mind-boggling I'm going to simply note it without comment, other than to note that if you want to know why you're such a lightning rod for criticism, this would be exhibit A.
3.) You neglect, once again, to support your assertions by quoting the remarks you've taken exception to, reinforcing the perception that you're playing the victim and not arguing in good faith.

I think what's obvious is people are just tired of your one-trick pony show. It's really a chore, more than anything else.

1)Your lack of reading comprehension is really troubling or maybe it is simply your opinion that anyone that defends themselves is playing the victim.
2) Really so the pass rush, defensive backs, and outside receiver has been fixed the last few years? You're really acting like it is so ludicrous to think these positions have been needs for years you are clueless.
3) Go look at the 1st freaking reply to this thread

Sorry, I'm going to take a step back and let the love fest continue. 19-0 :rocker::rocker::rocker::rocker::rocker::rocker::rocker:

 

[Brady2Moss]

Perhaps you should take a step back and realize that your posts are generally focussed on trashing the opinions of others, while lumping anyone who is naturally going to disagree with you into a category that you go on to describe as mindless.
Beauties such as this abound:



And maybe you might stop being so defensive, obstinate, and anti-social in your posting, and focus on football.
Then maybe people will read and think about your opinions instead of laughing at your demeanor, and dismissing that there is any unbiased rational thought behind it.

Just sayin.

You realize everyone's post in response to me saying a player was a bum, not a poster, has been to trash me too so it's pretty common here.

I focus on football and it always collapses into people taking pot shots at me which is fine, but I'll fire right back when that happens. If no one wants to think about my opinions that is fine, I'll try to be more social and drink the Kool-aid I heard its good.

 

[ausbacker]

Because they are the same people that act like every move made by the FO is great, that its ok that we have no competent outside receiver still 3 years down the road, that not having a competent secondary in 4 years is ok, and that having no pass rush is fine too because Bill is trying really hard by signing over the hill guys.

Why is it that you get offended that I call you homers, yet it is ok for your group to call me a ****, douche, moron, and claim that my point is poorly supported.

The only support you guys offer to counter the fact that these over the hill scrubs usually don't work out are moves made more than 10 years ago or Andre Carter It's great support when 40 other people are banging the BB we trust drum even if it isn't factually true.

What kind of support do you want for my argument that these over the hill guys haven't helped us the last few years?

2011: Good old guys: Waters and Carter. Carter was not there to help this team in the playoffs he got hurt, which is a problem that most here refuse to acknowledge with these older players they are more injury prone due to age.

Bad old guys: Haynesworth, Stinko, Shaun Ellis, all those jags that played safety and corner for us that year I cannot even begin to name (Brown, Moulden)

2012: Good old guys: Lloyd (Up in the air since half the homer brigade hates him for not catching 1600 yards like they predicted )

Bad old guys : Daniel Fells, Shiancoe, Trevor Scott, Gallery, Will Allen

My point is not that they shouldn't sign these guys its that when these types of players are some of the only moves made to bolster holes that have existed for years it isn't going to cut it and the "support" for that is the fact that they lost in 2010 because they had no pass rush, no corners, and no outside receiver. They lost in 2011 because they had no pass rush, no corners. 2012 they lost because they had no pass rush, no corners, no outside receiver, and no viable back up tight ends. 3 problems that keep hitting you in the face every January and you fill the needs mostly with JAGs and old guys.

I applaud them for keeping Talib and drafting Jones that's a real start to fixing the problem, but more needs to be done otherwise the team won't win another Super Bowl any time soon.

Either way this all started because I said this guy was a meh signing and a bum given his play last year in Oakland. Sorry if that is too pessimistic for you, but its better than the people acting like he's going to make a huge difference when recent history has shown these guys usually get hurt, don't make the team, or are just JAG players.

Posters here take umbrage with anyone that goes against BB or isn't happy anytime a new signing is made. If BB signed a turd he crapped out 2 years ago people would be saying what a great value signing and that the turd was all-toilet bowl caliber 2 years ago. That stance is fine, but I'm going to voice my opinion whether you like it or not. Just because you want to think its poorly supported doesn't mean it isn't true. The proof is in the pudding. 3 years, 3 number 1 or 2 seeds, 0 rings.

Edit* This is just going through the 53 man rosters, I do not even remember all the Jags that were signed to fill positions of dire need. How about getting some real players to fill these holes.

You're heavily discounting the reality of the salary cap. You can't have everything you want, especially with the draft, Free Agency, trades and UDFA remaining. You're a serial complainer when the Patriots take their time to address what they believe to be important ahead of your own personal wants for the team. Don't bother trumpeting that you focus on football. You do nothing of the sort.

Chill out and watch everything unfold.

 

[Danger Zone]

You realize everyone's post in response to me saying a player was a bum, not a poster, has been to trash me too so it's pretty common here.

I focus on football and it always collapses into people taking pot shots at me which is fine, but I'll fire right back when that happens. If no one wants to think about my opinions that is fine, I'll try to be more social and drink the Kool-aid I heard its good.

Forget the Kool-aid. You need a straight jacket and actual medication.

 

[Brady2Moss]

Forget the Kool-aid. You need a straight jacket and actual medication.

You are right I am insane and need medication because I do not agree with you. I sure hope you are never put into a position of power, I'd fear for the lives of those you oversee.

 

[Brady6]

He was trash last year. Not comparable to Wilfork at all. If Tommy Kelly is the best signing in an offseason that includes Armstead Wilson Amendola and then this team is in for a disappointing new cast.

Did you watch his games?

 

[RayClay]

He's been outstanding as far as playing every game, so wouldn't be surprised he was playing through injuries last year.

Not saying it's true, but I doubt he had no injuries while playing at least 80 games in a row.

 

[Brady2Moss]

You're heavily discounting the reality of the salary cap. You can't have everything you want, especially with the draft, Free Agency, trades and UDFA remaining. You're a serial complainer when the Patriots take their time to address what they believe to be important ahead of your own personal wants for the team. Don't bother trumpeting that you focus on football. You do nothing of the sort.

Chill out and watch everything unfold.

Right I don't focus on football but people like you do I only diverge from football when having to respond to people like you.

 

[Brady6]

This is another signing that we can't really evaluate without knowing the money end. He was either in pretty steep decline last season, or he just mailed it in. Either way, as long as the deal is low in immediate guarantees/bonuses, and protects the team in the event that Kelly flames out, it's a solid signing and a worthwhile attempt to make at shoring up the line. I'd rather have gotten his former teammate, but that was never going to happen. So, the DT rotation seems something like this, to date...

Run tackles: Love, Deaderick
Rush tackles: Armstead, Kelly
The man: Wilfork


Seem about right?

Great post DI..

 

[bagwell368]

I focus on football and it always collapses into people taking pot shots at me which is fine

Really? By the amount of your verbiage it seems like it's a life and death struggle...

but I'll fire right back when that happens.

I train dogs. It's clearly refocus time.... here, fetch the ball....

 

[ausbacker]

Right I don't focus on football but people like you do I only diverge from football when having to respond to people like you.

I have had plenty of run ins with you before, mainly because you post idiotic things that are unsubstantiated then tell me that I should educate myself in matters of football. I'm no football genius, far from it. What I do have up my sleeve, and so should you is the ability to watch as much football as possible, reference as many opinions as possible, read as many texts/books as possible then decide for yourself on an informed opinion.

The reality of the situation is your football knowledge doesn't match the opinion you have of your football knowledge. That's a dangerous mix.

 

[Brady2Moss]

I have had plenty of run ins with you before, mainly because you post idiotic things that are unsubstantiated then tell me that I should educate myself in matters of football.

The reality of the situation is your football knowledge doesn't match the opinion you have of your football knowledge. That's a dangerous mix.

I'm pretty sure I never told you to educate yourself in matters of football. Yes my opinions are all unsubstantiated and idiotic you caught me. Please tell me more about what my opinions should be master.

 

[AzPatsFan]

I haven't talked about Welker or the Patriots cheapness for a while just because that thread is always on your mind doesn't mean Im any more right or wrong then you Lord Shmessy. Hilarious how your response to me is to bring up stuff that I never said in this thread.

Ooh nice snark there I'm the most clueless person on the board because I don't agree with you. Maybe you should realize everyone is entitled to their opinion.

But you won't grant that courtesy to others, insisting on calling them homers...

 

[Brady6]

If someone can say on the very first response that this guys going to make us have a "watch out" and "devouring" interior line I can say the pessimist view that he'll be Haynesworth 2.0. Funny you ignore that.

Your calling a guy who has started all 80 games in the last 5 years Haynesworth 2.0?