Rebuilding: Where do we start

[Deus Irae]

*LOL* That tells me, right there, that you don't know nearly as much as you claim.

Another ironic statement comes to the fore.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Draft Needs:
OLB
DE
(Invest multiple picks in these two positions injuries to McKenzie and Crable the last few years have been devastating to our defenses youth movement)
WR
TE
RB
CB
QB

Agree with the first 3 and I'd add OG/C to the list unless Kaczur can move to OG. I don't see Neal coming back. As far as:
TE/RB- No thanks, maybe a lower round pick, but I'd rather draft another WR and get a bargain TE. Remember who our RB/TE's were in the Super Bowl years (aside from Corey Dillon, and he was only aquired as a luxury when the team really didn't have other needs). Neither position requires supreme talent for the team to be successful.
CB - Maybe a low rounder, but not really a need IMO especially if Bodden is kept.
QB - No

 

[DaBruinz]

Ok.. We all know that the Patriots draft based on perceived value to the Patriots organization. And that perceived value takes into consideration that person's tangible skills, intangibles (like leadership and instinct), and the need to the team. With that being said, here is how I see the Pats top priorities based on need only.


1) Defensive End
2) Offensive Guard
3) OLB
4) ILB
5) Tight End
6) Center
7) Wide Receiver
8) Offensive Tackle
9) Running back
10) Nose Tackle *
11) Punter
12) Kicker
13) QB


*NT will become the Number 2 issue if the Pats can’t reach a deal with Wilfork.

Now, for Kicker and LG, I expect the Pats to tender both Gostkowski and Mankins. As for Wilfork, I hope the Pats and he can come to some kind of agreement, but, if not, then Wilfork gets franchised and traded to someone like Tampa Bay.

Now, looking beyond 2010, the Pats have the following who become free agents. Tom Brady,Randy Moss, Matt Light, Fred Taylor, Sammy Morris, Brandon McGowan, Eric Alexander, Isaiah Stanback (RFA), BJGE (RFA), Kyle Arrington and a slew of other players.

Because of the uncertainty of the CBA, there are questions regarding long term deals beyond 2010. That being said, I believe the Pats will sign Brady to a 3 year extension in the 40 million range. Other than Arrington (who I think will replace Aiken) I don’t see anyone out of that group who is a must sign beyond Brady.

 

[DaBruinz]

Another ironic statement comes to the fore.

Unfortunately for you, there was no irony in the statement. What I described is exactly how knee injuries are treated during the end of rehab/start of activity phase.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

the first 3 things the pats need are coaching, coaching, and coaching.......BB need to bring guys in who can develop players

this team has lost all of its capacity to develop a player........its been 5 years since anyone has developed here.......in fact, wilfork may be the last successful project in terms of getting his techinque down to play his position......go through all the draft picks, if they showed up ready to play, then great.....otherwise, its down the tubes they went......the only development thatis done with the pats now is game time experience.

 

[Patstopia]

Well as my priorities I would go

1) OL - Center and Guard
2) DB
3) WR
4) OLB
5) RB
6) WR
7) WR

Sign Wilfork
Sign Ghost
Get some coaches

 

[Deus Irae]

Unfortunately for you, there was no irony in the statement. What I described is exactly how knee injuries are treated during the end of rehab/start of activity phase.

Actually, it was nothing but irony. Any trainer who couldn't figure out that a knee wasn't ready to go after months of rehab and weeks of practice would be fired from every team I've played on or associated with in any way. Whoever cleared a player to play full contact football only to have the knee 'fail' in the first game would be considered incompetent and dangerous.

In the case of the NFL, that's why teams have 3 weeks to decide about a player after PUP.

 

[mayoclinic]

Whoever cleared a player to play full contact football only to have the knee 'fail' in the first game would be considered incompetent and dangerous.

That would presumably be the same person(s) who made the decision to bring Mayo back 4 weeks after his MCL injury. We're lucky that Mayo was able to play the entire season without re-injuring himself, even though he wasn't the same player. Another poor decision.

 

[mayoclinic]

Well as my priorities I would go

1) OL - Center and Guard
2) DB
3) WR
4) OLB
5) RB
6) WR
7) WR

Sign Wilfork
Sign Ghost
Get some coaches

Let's divide this up into offense and defense.

Offense

- I assume that QB will be vastly improved next year, as Brady will have had a full off-season to prepare as opposed to last year, and will not be rusty.

- The #1 priority should be the offensive line. I expect Neal to retire. Re-signing or tendering Mankins is the #1 offensive priority, and then addressing a replacement at RG. I believe the plan should be to move Nick Kaczur to RG, which would give us a starting OL of Light-Mankins-Koppen-Kaczur-Vollmer, with LeVoir, Ohrnberger, Connolly, Wendell and Bussey as reserves. That's a fairly solid group. I think the OL would be improved over 2009 because Vollmer would have a year under his belt, and because hopefully we could have more continuity in our OL formation. I think Kaczur would make a terrific RG.

- The 2nd priority should be the WR/TE positions. With Welker likely not back until at least week 7 of 2010 and more likely 2011, we have Moss and a bunch of other folks. That might make re-signing Ben Watson more of a priority, though I expect Watson is gone and Chris Baker will become the #1 TE. Signing 1-2 FA WRs should be a priority. Guys like Donte Stallwork and Deion Branch could provide familiarity with Brady and the system, while guys like Antonio Bryant offer solid #2 potential. How aggressive we are here will depend in part on the team's assessment of Julian Edelman and Brandon Tate is potential major contributors in 2010.

- I think the RB position needs to be re-assessed. 3 of our RB's have contracts expire in 2010 plus Faulk this year, and 3 are 33 over older. We need some fresh legs. I would like to see us bring in at least one younger RB in FA.

Defense

- The defense showed promise in 2009 with a lot of speed, athleticism and playmaking capability, but struggled with a lack of veteran leadership, communication problems, and a lack of pressure up front. These need to be addressed. Darius Butler and Patrick Chung will likely be significant contributors next year, which should make our defense potentially much improved.

- First priority should be re-signing Vince Wilfork and Leigh Bodden. We need continuity and leadership in the defense, and both would suffer with those losses.

- Second priority should be addressing the middle of the defense. I would make a strong run at Karlos Dansby, who will likely be a FA and who could be the ideal counterpart to Mayo. Re-signing Wilfork and signing Dansby would make us extremely solid up the middle, allowing us to address the outside of the front 7 in the draft. Interior pressure would also do a lot to improve our pass rush and our overall defense.

- Third priority should be to address the OLB position prior to the draft. I would trade or cut Adalius Thomas, re-sign TBC, and either re-sign Derrick Burgess or sign a pass rusher in FA such as Aaron Kampman. Quentin Groves might be an option if he is cut by Jacksonville.

Special Teams

- Re-signing or tendering Gostkowski is the #1 priority by far.

That's where I would start. If we can achieve something at all close to this in the next 8 weeks then I believe that we would head to the draft a much better team than we were in 2009, with a finite set of holes which need to be plugged.

 

[Sweet Chin Music33]

Not really a rebuilding answer, more of a what do you think.

Ricky Williams.......any chance at all we could sign him? He is supposed to retire this offseason, but he just had one hell of a season. We have taken on head cases in the past, and for the most part they have worked out. The thing that stands out to me about our SB winning teams, is that we had a workhorse RB. Antoine Smith was solid for a short run, and Corey Dillion was a solid workhorse. Ricky Williams is not an old man by any means, as he has only really logged 7 complete seasons in his 10 year career. He is a very young 32 (age) by NFL RB standards. Any chance we will kick the tires on this? If people are throwing LT's name out there (hes all done), then we could at least give Ricky Williams a phone call.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Not really a rebuilding answer, more of a what do you think.

Ricky Williams.......any chance at all we could sign him? He is supposed to retire this offseason, but he just had one hell of a season. We have taken on head cases in the past, and for the most part they have worked out. The thing that stands out to me about our SB winning teams, is that we had a workhorse RB. Antoine Smith was solid for a short run, and Corey Dillion was a solid workhorse. Ricky Williams is not an old man by any means, as he has only really logged 7 complete seasons in his 10 year career. He is a very young 32 (age) by NFL RB standards. Any chance we will kick the tires on this? If people are throwing LT's name out there (hes all done), then we could at least give Ricky Williams a phone call.

not as a feature back, but I would love to have tomlinson as a 3rd down back

 

[Deus Irae]

Not really a rebuilding answer, more of a what do you think.

Ricky Williams.......any chance at all we could sign him? He is supposed to retire this offseason, but he just had one hell of a season. We have taken on head cases in the past, and for the most part they have worked out. The thing that stands out to me about our SB winning teams, is that we had a workhorse RB. Antoine Smith was solid for a short run, and Corey Dillion was a solid workhorse. Ricky Williams is not an old man by any means, as he has only really logged 7 complete seasons in his 10 year career. He is a very young 32 (age) by NFL RB standards. Any chance we will kick the tires on this? If people are throwing LT's name out there (hes all done), then we could at least give Ricky Williams a phone call.

Williams will be playing for the Dolphins in the upcoming season. I think you misunderstood reports you read or heard:

n Tuesday, Williams revealed to The Miami Herald that he signed another one-year contract extension this offseason that will keep him in Miami through the 2010 season, at which point he said he plans to then retire as a Dolphin.

Miami Dolphins' Ricky Williams signs extension, plans to retire after 2010 - Miami Dolphins & NFL - MiamiHerald.com

 

[DaBruinz]

Actually, it was nothing but irony. Any trainer who couldn't figure out that a knee wasn't ready to go after months of rehab and weeks of practice would be fired from every team I've played on or associated with in any way. Whoever cleared a player to play full contact football only to have the knee 'fail' in the first game would be considered incompetent and dangerous.

In the case of the NFL, that's why teams have 3 weeks to decide about a player after PUP.

WOW. Just WOW.

First off, Tate's knee didn't "fail" in the first game he played and no where did I imply that it had. A "failure" of the ACL would be it tearing again. And that isn't what I said. Secondly, if you were as smart as you pretend to be, you'd know that game conditions are different than practices. And how the knee reacts under those conditions is how they determine in what direction you're going. So, even though he might have been cleared to play, they are still going to check the knee after the practices and after the games to see how it's doing. That is standard procedure with any LEGITIMATE team. And if they feel that it's regressing, which can happen, then they can shut him down for the year instead of risking the possibility of making it worse. You seem to have forgotten that every person is different.

 

[Deus Irae]

WOW. Just WOW.

First off, Tate's knee didn't "fail" in the first game he played and no where did I imply that it had. A "failure" of the ACL would be it tearing again. And that isn't what I said. Secondly, if you were as smart as you pretend to be, you'd know that game conditions are different than practices. And how the knee reacts under those conditions is how they determine in what direction you're going. So, even though he might have been cleared to play, they are still going to check the knee after the practices and after the games to see how it's doing. That is standard procedure with any LEGITIMATE team. And if they feel that it's regressing, which can happen, then they can shut him down for the year instead of risking the possibility of making it worse. You seem to have forgotten that every person is different.

First, a "failure" of the ACL wouldn't necessarily require a re-tearing.

Second, despite your claim, it's actually extremely easy to simulate game conditions. In fact, physical therapists can put you through paces that are more intense than most game conditions. What you can't simulate is the impact of the emotional stress and the mental aspects of being 'tuned in'. All the physical stuff can be easily duplicated. Naturally, freak occurrences in either rehab or live games are things that are not generally pre-tested.

Third, your comment about how trainers analyze the injury during the rehab is exactly the point. They have to get it right. If not, it's a problem. If it's a big enough screw up, or if it happens often enough, they get the axe. I've seen it happen on multiple occasions. I didn't forget anything. Screwing the pooch on an ACL repair/rehab, if that's what happened, would be just the sort of thing that could cost jobs.