Poor drafting now biting the Patriots in the butt?

[BaconGrundleCandy]

He praises a lot of other teams' players. Mixon is a fine player. Never said he wasn't. Cincy uses their lead RB, we bury ours. Mixon might be a tick better than what Michel is.

I was specifically talking about NE's quality, versatility and depth, not to list other teams who have a good RB starter.

LOL

I guess unimpressive is another word for "fine"

 

[Chris Stevenson]

I guess unimpressive is another word for "fine"

Right, not impressive enough to make it seem like they have some kind of superior RB. Like I said, maybe Mixon is a tick better than Michel?

Drooling over Mixon as we don't even use Michel enough is the point. And, the depth of RBs here. We have Damien Harris kidnapped and Bolden who isn't even used.

I am still waiting for an RB group 1-4 in the AFC that trumps ours.

And, yes, Burkhead did a pretty good Roger Craig yesterday. Looks a lot like him with the hard running style (not saying he is on Craig's level, just style and skill set).

 

[captain stone]

The Pats can't improve their ability to draft WR's (put more time/attention/resource into it) without upsetting the apple cart somewhere else. They have finite resources, and a lot of this is zero sum. Magic doesn't happen.

They might find a better WR but at the expense of finding a player at a different position that contributed to a SB victory.

If you want to mess with a complex system, you have to take responsibility for where all the dominoes fall.

I completely disagree here. One has absolutely nothing whatsoever with the other.

 

[BUSTAMOVE]

Makes Caserio leaving not so devastating.

 

[Chris Stevenson]

I completely disagree here. One has absolutely nothing whatsoever with the other.

He is not the GM. His role
is like Pioli’s..It is more
of an admin role following what BB wants, hence why he wants a GM role.

 

[203Pat]

He praises a lot of other teams' players. Mixon is a fine player. Never said he wasn't. Cincy uses their lead RB, we bury ours. Mixon might be a tick better than what Michel is.

I was specifically talking about NE's quality, versatility and depth, not to list other teams who have a good RB starter.

LOL

You're insane. Mixon is significantly better than Michel.

 

[RobertWeathers]

You're insane. Mixon is significantly better than Michel.

Stevenson has been banned. Hes insane regardless.

 

[203Pat]

Stevenson has been banned. Hes insane regardless.

I missed the boat on this guy. Was he an old poster that came back? Is he a troll or does he legitimately believe the crap he says?

 

[RobertWeathers]

I missed the boat on this guy. Was he an old poster that came back? Is he a troll or does he legitimately believe the crap he says?

Bold is yes

 

[jmt57]

I have yet to see any genuine impartial parameters of what constitutes a good draft.


Yet this topic crops up in 32 markets every year whenever the local team loses a game or two.

 

[203Pat]

I have yet to see any genuine impartial parameters of what constitutes a good draft.


Yet this topic crops up in 32 markets every year whenever the local team loses a game or two.

1st round: make a Pro Bowl/borderline Pro Bowler in the first contract.
2nd round: immediate role player eventual starter
3rd round: role player potential starter
4th round: role player/depth
5-7 round: depth/developmental

Obviously it won’t always work out in that exact way but if you come out of each draft with a couple above average/quality starters and some solid contributors I would say that’s a solid draft.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I have yet to see any genuine impartial parameters of what constitutes a good draft.


Yet this topic crops up in 32 markets every year whenever the local team loses a game or two.

I feel like you know when you see it.
Depends on how many picks you have. Where they are. I probably look at it different then most. Imo Anything after the 4th Rd is the real crapshoot people want to make the entire draft out to be.

I don't rank players although they obviously sort themselves out that way. I'm not interested in that personally. I want to get as specific as possible & get as close as I can on an individual prospect. I grade twice & avg them out. 1)Once mainly looking at that prospect from a position pov. Example: (RB) Vision, Balance/Contact Balance, Agility & a bunch of others.
2)Then I use certain combine/pro-day #'s for certain positions. I value specific ones more for some positions over others. I'll look at age. Production. Few others.
Then I'll look at floor/ceiling, best/worst cases landing spots (are a lot of teams that this prospect could go to & have success or does he need a perfect scenario) & 1 or 2 other things.

Again their are a ton of factors that go into it. Where are your picks? How many? Deep draft, top heavy?

A lot of people love saying trading down is great but it doesn't = more hits. Not every draft has depth so trading down might not be the smart play in that particular draft.
Lots of context that comes into play. Esp when you consider coaching staffs, how they develop prospects etc Bill obviously isn't perfect but he's the best at doing everything by light years. No one is as good a coach, teacher, GM, defensive guru & on & on. You might get 1, maybe 2 but Bill is a football God tbh. I'm huge player/talent > coaching/scheme but Bill is just different.


I basically look at the 1st Rd as rounds 1 & 2 together. Broken down into 3 different levels. Again I try to get as specific as possible. I don't give points for positional value for example. Always thought abt giving QBs extra points just for being QBs but Id rather keep it the way it is. It's not like we don't know QB > everything. Anyway my scale ...

9.5 - 10 - HOF/Elite
8.5 - 9.4 - Impact Starter
8.0 - 8.4 - Future Starter
7.0 - 7.9 - Impact Rotation/Contributor
6.5 - 6.9 - Take a shot
6.0 - 6.4 - Take a shot
5.5 - 5.9 - Take a shot
5.0 - 5.4 - Take a shot


2018 grades
2018 NFL DRAFT GRADES.xlsx

2017 grades
2017 NFL DRAFT GRADES (1).xlsx

2016 grades
2016 NFL DRAFT GRADES (1).xlsx

2015 grades
2015 NFL DRAFT GRADES.xlsx

2014
2014 NFL DRAFT GRADES.xlsx

2013 grades
2013 NFL DRAFT GRADES.xlsx

2012 grades
2012 NFL DRAFT GRADES.xlsx

 

[luuked]

A lot of people love saying trading down is great but it doesn't = more hits

Really good post the only thing I disagree with is this.

No amount of study or trying to make the evaluation of young players look quantifiable by translating traits into numbers will ever strip away the inherent uncertainty in properly projecting college players to the pros.

And like with everything where there is uncertainty that can't be reduced any further the only way to improve chances is taking multiple shots. And the farther you get away from the blue chip area (lets say on average the top 12) the more and faster uncertainty grows.

This is not something that is limited to sports I mean it is all around and this guy Jim Collins made it a big part of his successful book series about company sustainability. Intel or Apple have fired a lot of smaller bullets to calibrate and be sure about the trajectory. And a lot of bullets that they fired didn't necessarily amount to much.

Now I am not advocating to just trade down mindlessly for value's sake and throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks. You still gotta work your ass off on the players you choose and make sure that there is something there you think might give the player a chance to earn a spot.

If you fire bullets, fire them excellently. And not randomly just because the odds are slightly more in your favor.

 

[Pats2000]

This guy prefers that we are the Browns, getting top draft choices every year and hitting on top talent in the higher rounds of the draft.

Sorry dude, your point is ridiculous, you're saying a team that has had multiple high round draft picks over the years stolen, consistently picks in the bottom of every round, has been to 9 super bowls, 11 straight conference championships, and outside of this year where injuries and crazy has bit them... who btw are still 11 and 3, has failed at proper player acquisition strategies... you are definitely off your rocker

 

[captain stone]

This guy prefers that we are the Browns, getting top draft choices every year and hitting on top talent in the higher rounds of the draft.

Sorry dude, your point is ridiculous, you're saying a team that has had multiple high round draft picks over the years stolen, consistently picks in the bottom of every round, has been to 9 super bowls, 11 straight conference championships, and outside of this year where injuries and crazy has bit them... who btw are still 11 and 3, has failed at proper player acquisition strategies... you are definitely off your rocker

This isn't a serious post...this is merely fanboy excuse-making.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Really good post the only thing I disagree with is this.

No amount of study or trying to make the evaluation of young players look quantifiable by translating traits into numbers will ever strip away the inherent uncertainty in properly projecting college players to the pros.

And like with everything where there is uncertainty that can't be reduced any further the only way to improve chances is taking multiple shots. And the farther you get away from the blue chip area (lets say on average the top 12) the more and faster uncertainty grows.

This is not something that is limited to sports I mean it is all around and this guy Jim Collins made it a big part of his successful book series about company sustainability. Intel or Apple have fired a lot of smaller bullets to calibrate and be sure about the trajectory. And a lot of bullets that they fired didn't necessarily amount to much.

Now I am not advocating to just trade down mindlessly for value's sake and throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks. You still gotta work your ass off on the players you choose and make sure that there is something there you think might give the player a chance to earn a spot.

If you fire bullets, fire them excellently. And not randomly just because the odds are slightly more in your favor.

No it's not an absolute or guarantee. Like I mentioned in my post every draft is different, some just might not be the deepest of classes. In those cases trading down won't help as much as some think. If you look at most classes you'll see maybe 4-5 players from Rd 5 on that are worth anything.
Off the top of my head, like in 2015 I think there was only a few guys that stuck. Grady (no idea how he fell that far that's a crime), K Alexander, Waller & Diggs. Again this is just off the top Of my head, one example so I might be missing some. Sounds obvious & I guess it is but its all abt hitting on the right guys.

In some cases it'll help, some it won't. There's a thought out there, maybe not a huge group of people but some think it'll equal success in terms of picks. That's what I mean when I say more picks doesn't = success.
Cleveland, SF & a bunch of others had tons of picks & just struck out big time. Of course that deserves further investigation in terms of who's actually making the picks.

Its a fluid process, have to be able to adapt, reset & not get caught up in the whirlwind. I imagine it's a lot faster once you're in the mix of making picks, trying to deal picks or possibly trade for a vet.

 

[aluminum seats]

I have yet to see any genuine impartial parameters of what constitutes a good draft.

Bingo. That’s why you have people talking past each other, but that’s most threads really.

Couple points made here I agree with:

—Picking later in the draft is a factor in draft success.

—Saying “the Pats could have had X!” is lazy and usually pointless.

—I think the Pats having trouble drafting wide receivers has a few factors, and somewhat related, a guy leaving the Pats and failing to light it up elsewhere is not proof that how they are handled here might not be flawed.

 

[Pats2000]

This isn't a serious post...this is merely fanboy excuse-making.

No this is serious... what's not serious is these folks in here acting like the Patriots cant draft during an 11 and 3 season where the offense is really struggling for the first time in a decade.