PI on Butler before Colts 4th TD?

[nashvillepatsfan]

What constitutes making a play on the ball? He was facing it, looking at it, and reaching for it?

Agreed. I watched it over, and over again today. Its my understanding that the CB has every right to make a play on the ball, and he was. He was turned with his back to the WR, and trying for the ball. Thats not PI, atleast to my knowledge

 

[ausbacker]

This is the defensive pass interference explanation taken from the NFL website itself NFL Rules Digest: Pass Interference

Actions that constitute defensive pass interference include but are not limited to:

(a) Contact by a defender who is not playing the ball and such contact restricts the receiver’s opportunity to make the catch.

(b) Playing through the back of a receiver in an attempt to make a play on the ball.

(c) Grabbing a receiver’s arm(s) in such a manner that restricts his opportunity to catch a pass.

(d) Extending an arm across the body of a receiver thus restricting his ability to catch a pass, regardless of whether the defender is playing the ball.

(e) Cutting off the path of a receiver by making contact with him without playing the ball.

(f) Hooking a receiver in an attempt to get to the ball in such a manner that it causes the receiver’s body to turn prior to the ball arriving.

Judging by that summation, it would have to be definitions A or E wouldn't it? I'm not sure how either applied to what happened.. or didn't happen.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

This is the defensive pass interference explanation taken from the NFL website itself NFL Rules Digest: Pass Interference


Judging by that summation, it would have to be definitions A or E wouldn't it? I'm not sure how either applied to what happened.. or didn't happen.

Nice find. Thats the whole point though. He was playing the ball, and had his head turned. It should not have been PI. Oh well, at game speed, refs screw up. That one call didnt cost us the game, but it is rather annoying

 

[bradydaman29]

These penalties are sooooo costly, I don't know why the refs can't just keep the hanky in their pocket if it's a borderline call. IMO they are much too liberal with the hankies.

Did anyone else get a Groundhog Day feeling watching that game:

1) bogus PI call that gives the opposing team hope.
2) Pats can't get a 1st down so they have to give the ball back with a couple minutes left.
3) opposing team walks down the field for an easy score with no resistance.

This is getting old.

 

[Bostonian1962]

Can't find anyone talking about this, but I WAS FUMING over that penalty. My wife took my kid for a walk.

Anyone else think it was BS? They were facing, looking at, and GOING AFTER the ball. AND the receiver didn't even go back into him at all.

I really kind felt like the calls going to Indy in the past may be something that I really imagine, but it was CLEARLY favoring Indy last night. Bogus.

That was the worst call of this NFL season, and yet with the 4th and 2 issue getting all the attention, the refs get off the hook on this call publically. THAT was not interference. In fact, it wasn't even close to being interference.

It was a bogus call that may well have determined home field throughout the playoffs. I've watched replays of the play and it gets my blood boiling even more. I never ever want to hear an opposing fan complain about a call in favor of the Patriots, because the calls against the Patriots Sunday night were PATHETIC!

 

[DaBruinz]

From one Pats fan to another it was clearly pass intereference. I don't know how this has become an issue.

HUH? How do you figure it was pass interference? Butler has every right to the ball as Collie. Collie initiated the contact because the ball was underthrown by Manning. How is that DEFENSIVE pass interference?

 

[DaBruinz]

I agree with you 100% and had Butler made a play for the ball it may not of been called.

WTF are you talking about. Butler DID make a play for the ball..

 

[stevedogc]

NFL Videos: NFL GameDay: Patriots vs. Colts highlights

Its starts at 4:33 of the highlights. Butler is clearly following the ball and clearly make a play on the ball. How can he be blamed for Collie slowing down because the ball was not thrown on target? Are we supposed to tell CB's now that they need to be in control of the actions and the WR's? And if thats a penalty what to stop every WR in the league from just slowing down or stopping their route to initiate contact?

I love it on the highlights when you here someone say "thats a horrible call" after the replay.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

From one Pats fan to another it was clearly pass intereference. I don't know how this has become an issue.

I agree, it was pass intereference......... Offensive pass intereference. Blutler was in positon and Collie initiated contact as he slowed up to catch the underthrown ball.

This is the defensive pass interference explanation taken from the NFL website itself NFL Rules Digest: Pass Interference

Butler, using these definitions, certainly should not have called. It was a bad call, that when coupled with an equally poor application of the spot on the 4th and 2 play, really made this a bad night for the officials.

They officially altered the course of the game. That's a shame, but it's now the standard for the NFL. The poor quality of officiating this year, and the last several I might add, has been terrible.

 

[mystrymaster]

The reason I think it was called was if you watch it again Butler's left arm is clearly in the back of Collie while his right arm is reaching up to grab the ball, Collie tries to jump. Collie can't jump right there because Butler is running through him.

Both players have a right to the ball however neither player has the right to push the guy off his spot.

Collie stopped to get ready to Jump as the ball was underthrown and a little high and that is when Butler just runs through him.

It was a very close call and no matter the call, PI or no PI one fan base would have been upset with it. It was a judgement call and the ref felt like there was to much contact to let it go.

This call was not about being in Bill Polian's inner circle or Bill's influence on the competition committee the call was about the defense getting shafted on PI call's, it always does and it always will just the nature of the beast.

 

[Buchanty]

That was the worst call of this NFL season, and yet with the 4th and 2 issue getting all the attention, the refs get off the hook on this call publically. THAT was not interference. In fact, it wasn't even close to being interference.

!

Interestingly the 4th and 2 decision and the likelihood of yet another marginal PI call are never linked. BB has too many memories of losing large yardage at the end of games to such calls and this supports his statement that he thought he had a better chance of winning going for it rather than leave it to the refs inclination to the throw the flag on potential and actual PI.

While changing the rule may be difficult - I had thought that making such calls reviewable would help, but that wouldn't be the case either as there has to be incontrovertible evidence to overturn such decisions.

I do think that there should be a limit though on PI. 15 yards would be acceptable or half the distance to the goal in short yardage situations. But that seems to penalize the longer plays. Suggesting an arithmetical solution would be fairer for example 10 yards plus 10% of actual distance. So for a 30 yd PI the penalty would be 13 yds with the largest penalty for the unlikely 99 yd being just under 20yds. However it may put more demands on the zebras and a section of the audience.

 

[Yehoodi]

From one Pats fan to another it was clearly pass intereference. I don't know how this has become an issue.

from a third pats fan to the second pats fan, it was not PI as Butler was making a play on the ball, is entitled to his position on the field and if there is incidential contact then its not PI. The NFL rules read in pertinent part as follows:

Actions that do not constitute pass interference include but are not limited to:

(a) Incidental contact by a defender’s hands, arms, or body when both players are competing for the ball, or neither player is looking for the ball. If there is any question whether contact is incidental, the ruling shall be no interference.

 

[Yehoodi]

The worst thing about it is that I saw it coming a mile away. Realizing we were up by 13. I just knew it. That is why I was cool with the call to go for it.

+2

10 char

- it just stated to feel like 06 AFFCG where the zebras felt the need to get involved (not to mention the franchise record penalty yards in the 07 regular season game)

 

[DaBruinz]

The reason I think it was called was if you watch it again Butler's left arm is clearly in the back of Collie while his right arm is reaching up to grab the ball, Collie tries to jump. Collie can't jump right there because Butler is running through him.

Both players have a right to the ball however neither player has the right to push the guy off his spot.

Collie stopped to get ready to Jump as the ball was underthrown and a little high and that is when Butler just runs through him.

It was a very close call and no matter the call, PI or no PI one fan base would have been upset with it. It was a judgement call and the ref felt like there was to much contact to let it go.

This call was not about being in Bill Polian's inner circle or Bill's influence on the competition committee the call was about the defense getting shafted on PI call's, it always does and it always will just the nature of the beast.

I would expect nothing less from a Colts fan. Your players can do no wrong.

First of all, Butler's left arms was NOT clearly in the back of Collie. In fact, Butler never brought his left hand up at all. Collie's back was FACING Butler. Collie stopping abruptly is what caused the contact. That's not Butler's fault as Butler was clearly going for the ball. In fact, if you watch closely, Collie actually braces himself for the contact by leaning into Butler.

BTW, the defense doesn't always get shafted on the PI calls. Fact is that Manning has had 3 games handed to him on bogus PI calls and one NON-CALL when Hayden mauled Caldwell in the end zone.. THAT was a perfect example of PI. Not the play by Butler.

 

[stevedogc]

BTW, the defense doesn't always get shafted on the PI calls. Fact is that Manning has had 3 games handed to him on bogus PI calls and one NON-CALL when Hayden mauled Caldwell in the end zone.. THAT was a perfect example of PI. Not the play by Butler.

YouTube - Patriots were robbed

just in case anyone forgot what the play was.

 

[ivanvamp]

YouTube - Patriots were robbed

just in case anyone forgot what the play was.

Ugh. Thanks for that memory. In the early years of this decade, I thought the Pats got a few breaks from the refs...i.e., lots of grabbing by our DB's against their WR. But man, the last 4-5 years or so, the Colts get every call. This non-call against the Colts...the totally phantom P.I. call against Ellis Hobbs...the *awful* P.I. call against Butler...the bad spot on Faulk....the list goes on.

 

[mystrymaster]

I would expect nothing less from a Colts fan. Your players can do no wrong.

First of all, Butler's left arms was NOT clearly in the back of Collie. In fact, Butler never brought his left hand up at all. Collie's back was FACING Butler. Collie stopping abruptly is what caused the contact. That's not Butler's fault as Butler was clearly going for the ball. In fact, if you watch closely, Collie actually braces himself for the contact by leaning into Butler.

BTW, the defense doesn't always get shafted on the PI calls. Fact is that Manning has had 3 games handed to him on bogus PI calls and one NON-CALL when Hayden mauled Caldwell in the end zone.. THAT was a perfect example of PI. Not the play by Butler.

Every game I watch there is 2-3 defensive PI calls, and 1 out of every 4-5 games there is an offensive PI call. Even though 90% of the passes in the NFL have some offensive PI on it.

 

[Sicilian]

I thought it was a terrible call too. Obviously not an excuse for losing the game, but it's one of those frustrating moments that just seems to happen for the Colts a lot.

If nothing else, this is a great example of the need for two kinds of PI. I wouldn't have felt nearly as bad about it if it resulted in a 5 or 10 yard penalty like a defensive holding. It's simple, borderline play = 5 yards and auto 1st. Blatant grabbing, tackling, intentionally disrupting the receiver because you're clearly beat = spot of the foul.

 

[Raymond]

We all knew, going into this game, there would be PI calls favoring Indy in their house.

They've never beaten the Pats without them. Write this down. If the Pats happen to meet them again in the po's, in Indy, there will be more.

 

[SoCal Pmen]

Watched it again on NFL Network replays last night and it was clearly a very questionable call and one that should not have been called at that juncture of the game. Even the analysts who I don't normally care for agreed that it was questionable. Those are the types of calls that go against you when you're on the road. If the game was in Foxboro it would have gone in favor of the Pats.