OT: Things looking to be getting worse for Mangini

[Tunescribe]

Pretty well known that Tom Moore does not covet a HC job. Some guys know when they have a good thing. Too bad guys like Norv and Cam can't grasp this. Meeks' name has been mentioned in the past for HC jobs. Maybe you could write into the BPolian show, or better yet, call in and ask. Heaping all this on Manning is quite a compliment though. he must therefore be the best ever, right?? I mean, we don't need any coaches, cause we have Manning? But BB is great, and you guys could win w/o Brady?? Can't have it both ways. And what, you guys proud of Mangini? Doesn't sound like it, yet he came from the BB tree, right??

Polian has his own show? I hope it's radio and not television, or else folks will think Halloween has come early this year.

Yeah, I think the Patriots can win without Brady. Why? Because this team has balance.

No, I don't think the Colts can win without the quarterhick, they depend on him too much. He very well might be the best ever, but hasn't proven it yet.

 

[The Gr8est]

Pretty well known that Tom Moore does not covet a HC job. Some guys know when they have a good thing. Too bad guys like Norv and Cam can't grasp this. Meeks' name has been mentioned in the past for HC jobs. Maybe you could write into the BPolian show, or better yet, call in and ask. Heaping all this on Manning is quite a compliment though. he must therefore be the best ever, right?? I mean, we don't need any coaches, cause we have Manning? But BB is great, and you guys could win w/o Brady?? Can't have it both ways. And what, you guys proud of Mangini? Doesn't sound like it, yet he came from the BB tree, right??

Peyton Manning, like Tom Brady, is a future 1st ballot HOfer. The difference is that while the Colts took Manning with the 1st pick in the draft, just like everyone else would have, Brady was drafted in the 6th round because he had flaws that needed to be polished. Not everyone was able to see the QB he could be if the flaws were polished, or even be capable of helping him become polished. Everyone could see that Manning had the makings of becoming an all-time great.

It's a hypothetical, and I hope to never have to see it proven by the tragic deaths of Manning and Brady, but based on their track record of coaching up players, I fully expect that Pats would recover far more quickly than the Colts would and become a SB challenger again. The Colts are far more dependent on Manning than the Pats are on Brady.

Finally as to the lack of success of Mangina, the point is that everyone hopes to find the next BB and in looking for the BB magic, will give opportunities to guys who BB deems worthy to coach under him.

Nobody is looking for the next Dungy.

I will give Dungy credit for being a good coach, not everyone can win with great talent as Norv Turner is proving, but I don't see anything about Dungy that suggests he is anything better than a good coach. Even Barry Switzer won a Superbowl with great talent.

 

[He Ban Me]

Peyton Manning, like Tom Brady, is a future 1st ballot HOfer. The difference is that while the Colts took Manning with the 1st pick in the draft, just like everyone else would have, Brady was drafted in the 6th round because he had flaws that needed to be polished. Not everyone was able to see the QB he could be if the flaws were polished, or even be capable of helping him become polished. Everyone could see that Manning had the makings of becoming an all-time great.

It's a hypothetical, and I hope to never have to see it proven by the tragic deaths of Manning and Brady, but based on their track record of coaching up players, I fully expect that Pats would recover far more quickly than the Colts would and become a SB challenger again. The Colts are far more dependent on Manning than the Pats are on Brady.

Finally as to the lack of success of Mangina, the point is that everyone hopes to find the next BB and in looking for the BB magic, will give opportunities to guys who BB deems worthy to coach under him.

Nobody is looking for the next Dungy.

I will give Dungy credit for being a good coach, not everyone can win with great talent as Norv Turner is proving, but I don't see anything about Dungy that suggests he is anything better than a good coach. Even Barry Switzer won a Superbowl with great talent.

You guys got, for lack of a better word, "lucky" in drafting Brady. It wasn't even BB's decision (some other dude from the org was high on him, right?)

Polian is a great GM. Wins wherever he goes. They would recover. That's just a silly argument to begin with.

Seriously, let's post back and forth about who would have more wins w/o their starting QB.

I guess if you say NE, than Manning is better than Brady, eh??

It's like you guys want everything both ways.

freaks.

 

[The Gr8est]

You guys got, for lack of a better word, "lucky" in drafting Brady. It wasn't even BB's decision (some other dude from the org was high on him, right?)

Polian is a great GM. Wins wherever he goes. They would recover. That's just a silly argument to begin with.

Seriously, let's post back and forth about who would have more wins w/o their starting QB.

I guess if you say NE, than Manning is better than Brady, eh??

It's like you guys want everything both ways.

freaks.

No, YOU guys got lucky having Peyton Manning falling into your laps, and all it took was having the worst record in the NFL to get that.

Manning and Brady are both 1st ballot HOFers, they are both great players. Whichever one you think is the best is fine by me, there are good arguing points to made for either, and have been done many times here and at IndyStar.

The difference is your QB came ready made, while Brady took work, both on his part and the Pats' coaches part to become a star.

You are right in your assertion about Bill Polian being a great GM. He has been successful wherever he has gone, but BB is the HC AND has final say on personnel moves. He has also proven to be very adept at taking players who weren't highly valued by other franchises and making them stars, like Mike Vrabel.

Getting the #1 pick in the draft when a prospect like John Elway or Peyton Manning comes along is rare, and a tremendous boon for your team if you're the recipient. Given the rarity of it, and the Pats' proven ability to find and develop late draftees and UDFAs, I think the Pats would recover quicker from the loss of Brady than the Colts would recover from the loss of Manning.

 

[reflexblue]

You guys got, for lack of a better word, "lucky" in drafting Brady. It wasn't even BB's decision (some other dude from the org was high on him, right?)

Polian is a great GM. Wins wherever he goes. They would recover. That's just a silly argument to begin with.

Seriously, let's post back and forth about who would have more wins w/o their starting QB.

I guess if you say NE, than Manning is better than Brady, eh??

It's like you guys want everything both ways.

freaks.

Bill Polian a great G.M? I never thought so. He was always good at picking offensive players. It took him about 25 years,and 4 teams to finally win a SB. Like I say "Every once in a while even a blind squirrel finds a nut.

 

[He Ban Me]

No, YOU guys got lucky having Peyton Manning falling into your laps, and all it took was having the worst record in the NFL to get that.

Manning and Brady are both 1st ballot HOFers, they are both great players. Whichever one you think is the best is fine by me, there are good arguing points to made for either, and have been done many times here and at IndyStar.

The difference is your QB came ready made, while Brady took work, both on his part and the Pats' coaches part to become a star.

You are right in your assertion about Bill Polian being a great GM. He has been successful wherever he has gone, but BB is the HC AND has final say on personnel moves. He has also proven to be very adept at taking players who weren't highly valued by other franchises and making them stars, like Mike Vrabel.

Getting the #1 pick in the draft when a prospect like John Elway or Peyton Manning comes along is rare, and a tremendous boon for your team if you're the recipient. Given the rarity of it, and the Pats' proven ability to find and develop late draftees and UDFAs, I think the Pats would recover quicker from the loss of Brady than the Colts would recover from the loss of Manning.

Get over yourselves, it was dumb luck. And as stated, BB didn't even have an eye on Brady. Manning didn't quite fall in our lap. They COULD have taken Leaf. Just like they COULD have taken Ricky Williams. BB is obviously a talent, and has done very well with his personnel. So have the Colts. Plenty of UDFA's and late rounders that have contributed. 15 of 16 draft picks on our roster from the last 2 seasons. The thing is, there are really VERY FEW top notch QB's in the league, so no Manning means we are on par with about 26 other NFL teams. But again, I think it's a silly arguement, who would be better w/o their respective QB. Material is getting thin.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Actually, there are big differences in coaching styles between Mangini and Belichick. People who have observed Jets practices have compared how Mangini runs practice more like Crennel and Parcells than Belichick. Mangini is far more hands on and abrassive in practices while Belichick is more stoic and allows his assistants more leeway to run their squads. Belichick is still a hardass, but he isn't in the players' faces like Mangini (or Crennel or Parcells are/were).

I do admit if Belichick didn't win the Super Bowl either in 2001 or a year after, players would probably have turned on him. But the rumors that players hated the Pats was never like they are about Mangini.

That is a universal comment.

Ask any of the early Lombardi players. It was touch and go with putting up with Vince Lombardi hard ass, tyrannical ways.

Especially when he did crazy things like when he took the football away from he the First pick in the Draft, Golden Boy QB from Notre Dame and said 'Run it" and turned to an 15th round unknown, and said "Throw it".

It worked because the Pack won. But several players said if they hadn't won quickly, it was problematical if the players would have rebelled against what was later lovingly said of Lombardi:

"He treats us all the same" .."Like equal dogs"