OT: Things looking to be getting worse for Mangini

[Tunescribe]

i've said it before: The problem with Mangina is that he's good at aping BB's style, but he doesn't have the substance to back it up. That's why his players are turning on him.

 

[The Gr8est]

It's too bad we can't have a discussion about the performance of coaches out of the Dungy tree, but there aren't any. In fact, as great as the Colts organization supposedly is, I can't remember any Colts assistants in recent times even being interviewed for HC openings, let alone actually get the job.

Why aren't teams as anxious to hire coaches out of the Colts organization?

Could it be that other franchises know that the Pats are the best organization in the business?

 

[Tunescribe]

It's too bad we can't have a discussion about the performance of coaches out of the Dungy tree, but there aren't any. In fact, as great as the Colts organization supposedly is, I can't remember any Colts assistants in recent times even being interviewed for HC openings, let alone actually get the job.

Why aren't teams as anxious to hire coaches out of the Colts organization?

Could it be that other franchises know that the Pats are the best organization in the business?

No, it's because other franchises know that coaching has practically nothing to do with the Colts' success. It begins and ends with the quarterhick.

 

[CopenhagenPatsfan]

Two as a secondary coach and one as a DC who had play-calling duties suspended by his head coach.

Adam Vinitieri has FOUR rings but that doesn't qualify him to be a head coach either.

Sorry to nick pick, but Manboobs did not win a ring as a DC, the Pats lost in Denver in the 2005 playoffs, the only year he was DC for the Pats.

 

[He Ban Me]

It's too bad we can't have a discussion about the performance of coaches out of the Dungy tree, but there aren't any. In fact, as great as the Colts organization supposedly is, I can't remember any Colts assistants in recent times even being interviewed for HC openings, let alone actually get the job.

Why aren't teams as anxious to hire coaches out of the Colts organization?

Could it be that other franchises know that the Pats are the best organization in the business?

you're kidding, right?

how often does a coach go up against his disciple in the SB??


http://pewterpirates.blogspot.com/2007/01/dungy-coaching-tree.html

 

[PatsFanInVa]

And more importantly, from the Dungy perspective, how often are they both CHRISTIANS!!!!!

By the way, you guys interview Kitna yet?

 

[Tunescribe]

you're kidding, right?

how often does a coach go up against his disciple in the SB??


http://pewterpirates.blogspot.com/2007/01/dungy-coaching-tree.html

You're saying that Lovie Smith coached with the Colts? The poster is referring to COLTS coordinators/coaches, not the Bucs. Besides that, he went to Bears from St. Louis, not from directly under Dungy. Martin Luther Dungy does not have a coaching tree.

 

[TruthSeeker]

You're saying that Lovie Smith coached with the Colts? The poster is referring to COLTS coordinators/coaches, not the Bucs. Besides that, he went to Bears from St. Louis, not from directly under Dungy. Martin Luther Dungy does not have a coaching tree.

I believe that Lovie Smith sees himself as a Tony Dungy adherent which is good enough for me.

 

[PromisedLand]

Sorry to nick pick, but Manboobs did not win a ring as a DC, the Pats lost in Denver in the 2005 playoffs, the only year he was DC for the Pats.

You're right, but that only strengthens my point.

 

[Tunescribe]

I believe that Lovie Smith sees himself as a Tony Dungy adherent which is good enough for me.

We're talking coaching trees, not "adherents." Their connection is more personal than professional.

 

[Fahrenhype]

I doubt most players on the team hate him, that is the media once again blowing things out of proportion. But people have to be looking at some of the decisions that have been made and wondering what the logic was. Getting Thomas Jones has been a complete non-factor after failing to work out an arrangement with Pete Kendall.

 

[patchick]

They are such different people. (I certainly don't know them except from what I have seen on the tube.) And I am not disagreeing with you except to say that it is so much more. Their personalities are way different.

Just to clarify, I don't believe I ever suggested in any way that Mangini and Belichick have similar personalities or characters. I just think that Mangini looked at the HCs he'd worked under, most notably BB, and took away the wrong lessons.

There are rah-rah coaches, father-figure coaches, and what I chose, perhaps foolishly, to call "hardass" coaches. It's just a matter of personal style, and you can succeed or fail with any of the above style depending on the substance that backs it up. BB's games with the injury report, his intentionally banal press conferences, his "there were some good things, there were some bad things" responses to blowout victories...those aren't the source of his success, they're just reflections of an overwhelming attention to every detail of football preparation.

The fact is, BB had 25 years in the league and was the architect of two Superbowl champion defenses before he joined the Patriots. He's a walking encyclopedia of football history. Trying to graft a BB-style surface onto a young, green coaching staff is a bad fit, exacerbating other problems the Jets face. Similarly, trying to run the Patriots defense with a totally different set of personnel is a mismatch. (Remember that BB didn't switch to his preferred 3-4 in New England until he had the right players.) Nothing's pre-fab in this league, you have to look at the reality of your situation and adapt your approach to fit.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

No, it's because other franchises know that coaching has practically nothing to do with the Colts' success. It begins and ends with the quarterhick.

:agree: Post of the day!

 

[The Gr8est]

No, it's because other franchises know that coaching has practically nothing to do with the Colts' success. It begins and ends with the quarterhick.

Bingo! We have a bingo!

There is no Dungy tree because contrary to what many of the Colts fans would like to believe, opposing organizations do not see coaching as the key to the Colts success. Colts fans can argue that Dungy is better than BB all day long, but when teams are looking for coaching upgrades for their own organizations, they come to the Pats, not the Colts.

Anyone could have seen that Peyton Manning had what it took to be a great QB, but not everyone saw the same greatness in Brady. Granted there were things for Brady to overcome to become a great QB, such as build himself up physically, and he didn't have the track record of Manning, but it was a greater coaching challenge to develop Brady than to draft Manning and then stand back and watch him perform.

If Manning and Brady were to die in a plane crash, there is no doubt in my mind that the BB led Patriots would recover and be a SB challenger again much quicker than the Dungy led Colts.

 

[He Ban Me]

Bingo! We have a bingo!

There is no Dungy tree because contrary to what many of the Colts fans would like to believe, opposing organizations do not see coaching as the key to the Colts success. Colts fans can argue that Dungy is better than BB all day long, but when teams are looking for coaching upgrades for their own organizations, they come to the Pats, not the Colts.

Anyone could have seen that Peyton Manning had what it took to be a great QB, but not everyone saw the same greatness in Brady. Granted there were things for Brady to overcome to become a great QB, such as build himself up physically, and he didn't have the track record of Manning, but it was a greater coaching challenge to develop Brady than to draft Manning and then stand back and watch him perform.

If Manning and Brady were to die in a plane crash, there is no doubt in my mind that the BB led Patriots would recover and be a SB challenger again much quicker than the Dungy led Colts.

So, Lovie, Marinelli, Edwards and Tomlin don't count?? Seems like they are doing better than Weis, crennel, and Mangini

 

[The Gr8est]

So, Lovie, Marinelli, Edwards and Tomlin don't count?? Seems like they are doing better than Weis, crennel, and Mangini

Please refresh my memory. When did those guys coach for the Colts under Dungy?

I don't recall the Bucanneers being touted as one of the top organizations in the NFL.

Do you think the Colts organization is one of the best? If so, then why don't other teams want their coaches?

 

[He Ban Me]

Please refresh my memory. When did those guys coach for the Colts under Dungy?

They didn't.

 

[LoveDemPats]

Similarly, trying to run the Patriots defense with a totally different set of personnel is a mismatch. (Remember that BB didn't switch to his preferred 3-4 in New England until he had the right players.) Nothing's pre-fab in this league, you have to look at the reality of your situation and adapt your approach to fit.

Yea, I agree. Mangini is not a very creative dude. I think that this is what the pats players were getting at when they made a few remarks after he left about him not being a really solid leader (not exact words but something to that effect) They knew that he would run into some problems and he has.

 

[LoveDemPats]

It's too bad we can't have a discussion about the performance of coaches out of the Dungy tree, but there aren't any. In fact, as great as the Colts organization supposedly is, I can't remember any Colts assistants in recent times even being interviewed for HC openings, let alone actually get the job.

Why aren't teams as anxious to hire coaches out of the Colts organization?

Could it be that other franchises know that the Pats are the best organization in the business?

Dude!!!

Don't you know that members of the Dungy tree go onto more substantial spiritual endevors that you and I will never be able to grasp? (whispered with a pleading scared look in my eye)

Sheese!!!

(matter of factly)
I think that we should all say some kinda reverent mumblings so that we don't get struck by lightening or something.

 

[He Ban Me]

Please refresh my memory. When did those guys coach for the Colts under Dungy?

I don't recall the Bucanneers being touted as one of the top organizations in the NFL.

Do you think the Colts organization is one of the best? If so, then why don't other teams want their coaches?

Pretty well known that Tom Moore does not covet a HC job. Some guys know when they have a good thing. Too bad guys like Norv and Cam can't grasp this. Meeks' name has been mentioned in the past for HC jobs. Maybe you could write into the BPolian show, or better yet, call in and ask. Heaping all this on Manning is quite a compliment though. he must therefore be the best ever, right?? I mean, we don't need any coaches, cause we have Manning? But BB is great, and you guys could win w/o Brady?? Can't have it both ways. And what, you guys proud of Mangini? Doesn't sound like it, yet he came from the BB tree, right??