Nice NFL.com article categorizing QBs

[thenepatsrule]

QB factions: From elite to unknown, and everything in between - NFL.com

I agree with the classifications, The word ELITE gets used a lot these days in the NFL when it comes to QB. Eli was elite in 2011 and now? Giants fans cant wait to get rid of him. What about Flucco? or shall we say Trent Dilfer II, Flucco was called Elite by many at the beginning of the season, now that the Ravens D has lost its shine he cannot carry the team on his back.

The new Elite QB going into this upcoming season is Russel Wilson, Only time will tell how good he is when it comes to carrying the team when the chips are stacked against him. I like Brees and consider him a dangerous QB but in a game played outdoors in the elements I wouldn't worry too much about him beating my team. These days in the NFL you also need to have a great D to get the job done in the SB, an Elite QB can only take you so far . The problem with having an elite QB? with the salary you pay them you can hardly afford to have a stellar supporting cast, and this is what makes the NFL so great.

In fact, there are just three elite quarterbacks in the NFL today: Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.

The next tier
Drew Brees, Ben Roethlisberger

Young guns
Andrew Luck, Colin Kaepernick, Russell Wilson, Cam Newton, Robert Griffin III, Nick Foles, Andy Dalton, Ryan Tannehill

Vets with rings
Eli Manning, Joe Flacco


Vets with big money ... and no rings
Tony Romo, Matt Ryan, Matthew Stafford, Jay Cutler

The curious case
Philip Rivers

The forgotten man
Alex Smith

Young Guns II
Mike Glennon, Geno Smith, EJ Manuel

Mixed bag
Carson Palmer, Sam Bradford, Jake Locker

 

[Gumby]

32 Teams in the league and about 40 QBs were starting at some point during the season. Schein lists 27 in the categories you showed.

In fact, there are just three elite quarterbacks in the NFL today: Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.

The next tier
Drew Brees, Ben Roethlisberger

Young guns
Andrew Luck, Colin Kaepernick, Russell Wilson, Cam Newton, Robert Griffin III, Nick Foles, Andy Dalton, Ryan Tannehill

Vets with rings
Eli Manning, Joe Flacco


Vets with big money ... and no rings
Tony Romo, Matt Ryan, Matthew Stafford, Jay Cutler

The curious case
Philip Rivers

The forgotten man
Alex Smith

Young Guns II
Mike Glennon, Geno Smith, EJ Manuel

Mixed bag
Carson Palmer, Sam Bradford, Jake Locker

He throws out another couple of other guys names in his NOT APPLICABLE category:
(Matt McGloin , Terrelle Pryor , Brandon Weeden, Matt Cassel, Matt Schaub, Blaine Gabbert ,Josh Freeman )

but that leaves other guys WHO HAVE STARTED (Hoyer, Fitzpatrick, garrard, grossman, Sanchize, Vick, +more?) not even categorized as 'losers' or 'wanna-bes' or 'washed-ups'.

I think if you look at TB, Sea, Vikings situations where the presumptive heirs that got big $ or top draft selections dont actually become THE GUY when they have to compete for the job; that its a bit incomplete to not look at the rest of the guys in that 25-40th best QB range as well.

A couple of those 25-40 tier guys WILL likely BE in the top 10 for a year or two span in the coming decade. Which ones??? Every GM would like to know that too. It's more like darts than rocket science.

 

[upstater1]

If I had to choose a QB for the next 5-7 years, this would be my list:

1. Andrew Luck
2. Aaron Rodgers
3. Russell Wilson
4. Colin Kaepernick

 

[borg]

Elite QBs mean elite paychecks that hamstring teams. These teams win lots of games, but, at the end of the day, the last team standing is usually the most complete team. When you look at Seattle and SF, think of the holes those teams were able to fill with the $15-20 mill not allocated to the QB position. Unlike NE, these two team could buy FAs without warts.
How many rings do the "elites" have after the mega contract?

 

[Deus Irae]

Elite QBs mean elite paychecks that hamstring teams. These teams win lots of games, but, at the end of the day, the last team standing is usually the most complete team. When you look at Seattle and SF, think of the holes those teams were able to fill with the $15-20 mill not allocated to the QB position. Unlike NE, these two team could buy FAs without warts.
How many rings do the "elites" have after the mega contract?

The top 3 AFC QBS have been to 11 of the past 13 SBs. The payment myth is exactly that. It's a myth.

 

[borg]

The top 3 AFC QBS have been to 11 of the past 13 SBs. The payment myth is exactly that. It's a myth.

Here's the AFC breakdown.......of WINNING QBs

Brady's cap # in 2001 was approx. $300,000......in 2003 was $5.3 mill....in 2004 was $7.7 mil
Roethlisberger's cap in 2005 was approx $3.7 mill...
Manning's cap in 2006 was $17.76 mill
Roethlisberger's cap in 2008 was $7.7 mill
Flacco' cap in 2012 was $8 mil

Tell me more about this myth. I guess winning the Super Bowl doesn't fit your narrative so you needed to include the losers bracket as well.

 

[primetime]

It's a myth because you're choosing an arbitrary and non-representative way to show that a team is good (just as 'rings' is a terrible indicator of a team or individual's performance).

Even if you take just Super Bowl participants as Deus did, it blows it out of the water. And then if you take the most representative indicators of 'good teams' - wins, playoff appearances, etc. - where you smooth out some of the randomness inherent in a single game playoff versus a 16-game regular season, you'll find that teams aren't hamstrung at all by paying a good QB.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

If I had to choose a QB for the next 5-7 years, this would be my list:

1. Andrew Luck
2. Aaron Rodgers
3. Russell Wilson
4. Colin Kaepernick

1. Rodgers
2. Wilson
3. Luck

No one else worth mentioning right now.

 

[Deus Irae]

Here's the AFC breakdown.......of WINNING QBs

Brady's cap # in 2001 was approx. $300,000......in 2003 was $5.3 mill....in 2004 was $7.7 mil
Roethlisberger's cap in 2005 was approx $3.7 mill...
Manning's cap in 2006 was $17.76 mill
Roethlisberger's cap in 2008 was $7.7 mill
Flacco' cap in 2012 was $8 mil

Tell me more about this myth. I guess winning the Super Bowl doesn't fit your narrative so you needed to include the losers bracket as well.

Well, trying to use only the winning SB in the formula is both idiotic and deliberately misleading. I'm sure you know that, though, since I'm sure you realize that the difference between the Patriots winning and losing the SBs in 2007 and 2011, just for two easy examples, was not how much money Tom Brady was making at the time.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Elite QBs mean elite paychecks that hamstring teams. These teams win lots of games, but, at the end of the day, the last team standing is usually the most complete team. When you look at Seattle and SF, think of the holes those teams were able to fill with the $15-20 mill not allocated to the QB position. Unlike NE, these two team could buy FAs without warts.
How many rings do the "elites" have after the mega contract?

Obviously, in an ideal world, you get premium production on a rookie contract that pays table scraps per year.

Assuming you aren't lucky enough to stumble into that goldmine, give me Tom Brady for $15M any day. You want to know how you can be pretty sure that it's a good deal? If the Pats cut him tomorrow, at least 20 teams would be lining up to give him a raise over that to come play for them.

Here's the AFC breakdown.......of WINNING QBs

Brady's cap # in 2001 was approx. $300,000......in 2003 was $5.3 mill....in 2004 was $7.7 mil
Roethlisberger's cap in 2005 was approx $3.7 mill...
Manning's cap in 2006 was $17.76 mill
Roethlisberger's cap in 2008 was $7.7 mill
Flacco' cap in 2012 was $8 mil

Tell me more about this myth. I guess winning the Super Bowl doesn't fit your narrative so you needed to include the losers bracket as well.

In 2004, the salary cap was $80.582M. Brady's $7.7M cap hit, therefore, took up 9.5% of the team's salary cap. This past year, Brady's $13.8M cap hit came on a salary cap of $123M, so he was responsible for 11.2% of the team's salary cap.

If you take Brady's 2004 cap hit as a percentage of overall cap, that's equivalent to an $11.7M hit on the 2013 cap.

Are you seriously maintaining that a significant part of the reason why the Patriots win it all in 2004, and not in 2013, is because Brady was responsible for an extra 1.7% of the salary cap?

Here's a really striking example: as you pointed out, Manning's cap hit in 2006 was $17.76M, which was good for 17.4% of the $102M salary cap. This means that he was significantly more expensive in 2006 than he was in 2013, when he was 'only' responsible for a $17.5M cap hit (14.2% of cap). Didn't stop the Colts from winning it all in '06.

In 2009, Drew Brees had a $14M cap hit, against a salary cap of $123M, making his cap hit basically identical to Brady's right now. Didn't stop the Saints from winning the Super Bowl.

In 2011, Eli Manning had a $14.1M cap hit again a $120M salary cap, which meant he was actually more expensive as a percentage of cap than Brady was in 2013. Giants won the SB anyway.

If you came across a gas station that was selling for $2.50 per gallon, would you keep driving because you used to be able to get it for $1.50 per gallon back a decade ago?

 

[Oinko]

I would have put Andy Dalton somewhere else, like Mixed Bag.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

I would have put Andy Dalton somewhere else, like Mixed Bag.

Dalton is like that box of chocolates, you never know...

 

[eagle eye]

Drew Brees is part of the elite along with the other three.

 

[borg]

Elite QBs mean elite paychecks that hamstring teams. These teams win lots of games, but, at the end of the day, the last team standing is usually the most complete team. When you look at Seattle and SF, think of the holes those teams were able to fill with the $15-20 mill not allocated to the QB position. Unlike NE, these two team could buy FAs without warts.
How many rings do the "elites" have after the mega contract?

My original premise was about rings...."How many rings do the "elites" have after the mega contract?" And to get a ring, a team has to complete the cycle....win the last game.....Not be a participant. If you all believe closies is good enough....have at it

 

[BradyFTW!]

My original premise was about rings...."How many rings do the "elites" have after the mega contract?" And to get a ring, a team has to complete the cycle....win the last game.....Not be a participant. If you all believe closies is good enough....have at it

Eli won a ring while accounting for 11.75% of his team's cap, Brees won a ring while accounting for 11.4% of his team's cap, Brady won a ring while accounting for 9.5% of his team's cap, and Peyton won a ring while accounting for 17.4% of his team's cap.

So no, Brady being responsible for 11.2% of the Patriot's salary cap isn't an issue. It's self-evident if you actually look at the numbers.

 

[Jackson 2]

Eli won a ring while accounting for 11.75% of his team's cap, Brees won a ring while accounting for 11.4% of his team's cap, Brady won a ring while accounting for 9.5% of his team's cap, and Peyton won a ring while accounting for 17.4% of his team's cap.

So no, Brady being responsible for 11.2% of the Patriot's salary cap isn't an issue. It's self-evident if you actually look at the numbers.

Please don't cloud the matter with empirical evidence. It's bad for business...

 

[thenepatsrule]

If I had to choose a QB for the next 5-7 years, this would be my list:


4. Colin Kaepernick

He is on a team with a great D , Plus he is a very immature player. Did you or did you not see his TD celebrations?, Him mocking Cam after a TD in the Playoffs,Or read about his constant *****ing about the Seahawks?. Of all the current young QBs in the NFL CRAPernick is the most ****y/arrogant one

 

[thenepatsrule]

Drew Brees is part of the elite along with the other three.

His stats in outdoor games disagree with you.

 

[thenepatsrule]

In 2004, the salary cap was $80.582M. Brady's $7.7M cap hit, therefore, took up 9.5% of the team's salary cap. This past year, Brady's $13.8M cap hit came on a salary cap of $123M, so he was responsible for 11.2% of the team's salary cap.

If you take Brady's 2004 cap hit as a percentage of overall cap, that's equivalent to an $11.7M hit on the 2013 cap.

Are you seriously maintaining that a significant part of the reason why the Patriots win it all in 2004, and not in 2013, is because Brady was responsible for an extra 1.7% of the salary cap?

Here's a really striking example: as you pointed out, Manning's cap hit in 2006 was $17.76M, which was good for 17.4% of the $102M salary cap. This means that he was significantly more expensive in 2006 than he was in 2013, when he was 'only' responsible for a $17.5M cap hit (14.2% of cap). Didn't stop the Colts from winning it all in '06.

In 2009, Drew Brees had a $14M cap hit, against a salary cap of $123M, making his cap hit basically identical to Brady's right now. Didn't stop the Saints from winning the Super Bowl.

In 2011, Eli Manning had a $14.1M cap hit again a $120M salary cap, which meant he was actually more expensive as a percentage of cap than Brady was in 2013. Giants won the SB anyway.

If you came across a gas station that was selling for $2.50 per gallon, would you keep driving because you used to be able to get it for $1.50 per gallon back a decade ago?

You make some very valid points.... :rocker::rocker::rocker:

 

[1960Pats]

If I had to choose a QB for the next 5-7 years, this would be my list:

1. Andrew Luck
2. Aaron Rodgers
3. Russell Wilson
4. Colin Kaepernick

I'd have Aaron Rodgers in the top spot if it's for the next 5-7 years.

The other three are all young pups that could use another year, but so far I would go with Wilson. Kaepernick runs too much and Luck (my original top choice of the new breed) forces too many passes.

Nick Foles has gotten off to a pretty good start. Give him a little more time and he may end up being in the hunt for top puppy too.