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idle thoughts....delayed


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Ken,

Great write-up. Thanks for typing it again! :)

questions on our CB technique: if this technique (not looking back) is coached - and insisted? - by the Pats, shouldn't Arrington also exhibit similar tendencies? How is it that the opponents consistently managed to achieve that success only against McCourty?

Ken - not sure if you saw my earlier query. Can you - or somebody else who agrees with Ken on this issue - throw some light on it please? Thx
 
I finally got to watch the game on the NFLN replay and I didn't think our defense (or our offense) played as bad as advertised. Sure, there were mistakes that cost us pretty big, but take out those handful of mistakes and it was a pretty solid effort.

I am kind of surprised that no one has mentioned Branch's bonehead move at the end of the half to not go out of bounds. That was a complete ROOKIE mistake, not something a veteran should ever do.

Defensively Inheidgobojololfo (however you spell it) looked pretty poor along with McCourty (for the most part) but I think our front 7 put forth a solid effort the entire game.

Offensively considering our line was 1 injury away from starting Edelman I thought they played as good as you could hope for. Brady got pressured a lot which I think was partly responsible for his errant throws. I remember one specifically he had to side arm it around a rushing defender and it hit, I believe Welker, in the feet. Ridley once again made me excited for our future at runningback. Hernandez had one throw bounce off his hands which seems to happen at least once a game. Gronk once gain turned a 5 yard throw in to a 20 yard gain by throwing off multiple defenders like he is Andre the Giant vs a bunch of Ray Mysterios.

Play calling was for the most part pretty good. I only remember 2 or 3 calls that made me facepalm.

The game, as I've said before, gives me hope not only for the future, but for our upcoming playoff run. I think it is exactly the kind of mental and physical test we needed to prepare ourselves for what we will be going up against in the upcoming weeks.

I've got my popcorn ready and I am eagerly awaiting the show we are going to put on this postseason!!!
 
Ken - not sure if you saw my earlier query. Can you - or somebody else who agrees with Ken on this issue - throw some light on it please? Thx
If I'm answering the right quesion, I will infer you are asking why doesn't Arrington seem to run with his back to the ball as often as McCourty.

There are a couple of answers. First he might be the guy who is always assigned to the guy most likely to go deep. Secondly he probably has better technique than Mc Courty, and third, he's been in the league a year longer and SHOULD have better technique
 
If I'm answering the right quesion, I will infer you are asking why doesn't Arrington seem to run with his back to the ball as often as McCourty.

There are a couple of answers. First he might be the guy who is always assigned to the guy most likely to go deep. Secondly he probably has better technique than Mc Courty, and third, he's been in the league a year longer and SHOULD have better technique

Great job as always, Ken. I enjoy reading your write ups after the games, and they provide a lot of insight.

I am going to respectfully disagree on your assessment regarding the CB's though.

First off, I do not believe that Arrington is always assigned the guy most likely to go deep. We all have seen McCourty's coverage this yr on the majority of other teams' #1 WR's. Guys like Vincent Jackson, Brandon Marshall, Moss (WSH), Bryant, Calvin Johnson (last yr's Thanksgiving game)etc have the potential to go deep more than any other WR out there.

I also believe that Arrington's "being in the league longer" is a huge stretch. This is Arrington's 3rd yr vs McCourty's 2nd yr, that should not make that much of a difference, especially when considering that Arrington was undrafted out of Hofstra, and saw a very low-level of competition; while McCourty was a FIRST rounder who saw a lot of top level competition at Rutgers.

The one part I certainly do agree with you is that Arrington probably has better technique than McCourty. That is certainly a valid point, and seems to be the ultimate answer here.

When your high-paying job is to turn around and look for the ball, yet you consistantly do not do that, you are going to raise some questions. My question is which season is the real McCourty? Some are starting to wonder if it is this one.
 
Ok. I'll take my shot at this part. You answered your own question beforehand. The truth is, neither Green Bay nor the New England Patriots have bad defenses. What they have is a low ranking in opponents yards allowed per game. The issue isn't with the defense of these teams, but with the measurements most people are stuck on when it comes to grading defenses:

1. total yards per game. A most terrible measurement.
2. a ranking number. Not the actual value of the rank. Most people compare ranks not the actual value.

Is the difference between allowing 330 and 355 yards per game that significant? An extra 25 yards? If you said no, then keep in mind that's the difference between a #10 and a #20 defense. If you said yes keep reading.

It really depends on where they happen, right? Do they lead to first downs, a touchdown or are they "good yards" and "a waste" for their opponents offense because those defenses allowed a few yards on first and 2nd down but got the stop on third?

Not only are vacuum stats bad measurements of rating anything in football, but most people are more concerned with one of the least important. There's never been a a time, year or era since the game of football was invented when points were less important than yards. Nobody cares about how many yards-or meters-a soccer player racks up running up and down the field. Nobody cares how many dribbles a basketball player makes or how many up and down runs on the court one makes. How many miles of travel does a hockey player make around a ring? Who's #1 in history? Anybody know? Nobody? :D People are much to focused on the wrong measurements when it comes to football.

What to keep in mind:

Yards= effort. work.
Points = reward. results.

You know the old saying work smart not hard? It's the same in football. But it is a little bit more complex than that, of course.

1. Almost all of these yards measurements are offensive measurements. They are all correctly defined as "opponent's [insert yards measurement] allowed". People miss-use them constantly. We need better ways of measuring defenses.

2. Efficient passing teams can easily have longer games. They score faster, and incompletions stop the clock.(more yards get racked up on both ends).

3. The number of drives in a football game is not always consistent. A defense that allows 400 yards per game might actually allow less yards per drive than a defense that allows 350 ypg if they average more drives. For example:

yards allowed per game:
11th San Diego 335.1
18th Chicago 353.7

yards allowed per drive:
8th Chicago 26.88
21 San Diego 31.69

So which one is it Mr. Yard Stat? Does San Diego's defense rock or suck? Is Chicago top 10 or 18th?;)

In addition, the difference in yards allowed per drive between the #1 defense and the #32 defense is 14 yards. NE's bottom of the league in both, so at least for NE, Mr. Yard Stat appears to have its mind made up. So basically an extra first down. That's really what NE gives up on average. But...

-If Pat's offense and special teams is always scoring and forcing opponents to take a knee in the end-zone after a kick-off,does that mean the Patriots defense is bad because they will on average allow more yards?
-If a team has a bad special teams unit that always gives up yards(this by default leads to their "total defense" allowing fewer yards), does that mean that team's defense is better?

Could this be the case? Let's find out.

NE's opponent average starting field position(NE's defending starting field position):
#2 24.40 yard line.

So yards per game allowed, and Mike Ditka on ESPN, says the Patriots have a bad defense, because their special teams defense pins opponents back so it forces opponents to travel longer to score a touchdown. But isn't this also what gives a defense a good chance to get a stop, thus keeping points allowed low? Good one.

The difference between one NFL defense and another, especially as far as yards go, is almost a statistical wash when you take into consideration: style of offense, time of possession, number of drives, play calling, playing with or without a lead, turnovers, etc. In combination these factors and others have a much GREATER effect on a defense's ranking in yards allowed, compared to their OWN ability to stop teams from getting yards. In other words, unless you have a defense that truly stops everybody from moving, a team's defense in today's NFL has very little control over where they rank in yards allowed per game. That measurement is affected just as much by all other areas of their own team and flow of the game as it is by their own ability to stop an opponent.

In fact, one of the best measurements in football(I'd say the 2nd most important stat in football), yards per point, which has one of the best correlations to winning(the #1 stat) says that for an offense to be efficient you need the FEWEST yards and MOST points. For a defense, it's the complete opposite. Allowing the MOST yards and FEWEST points. Either that or 0 yards or 0 points, which is pretty much impossible, at least when it comes to yards(that would more readily indicate you are playing against a terrible NFL offense, not that you have an amazing defense). In which case, both NE and GB qualify as one of the most efficient defenses in the game.

yards:
1 Pittsburgh 273.9
4 San Francisco 308.1
31 Green Bay 400.7
32 New England 412.1

points:
1 San Francisco 13.5
2 Pittsburgh 14.5
12 Green Bay 21.2
14 New England 21.4

opponents yards per point allowed:
1 San Francisco 22.9
2 New England 19.3
3 Green Bay 18.9
4 Pittsburgh 18.8


Huh, interesting. So basically NE and GB are every bit as good as Pittsburg and San Fran in making their opponents bust their ass to get a FG or TD against them, just accomplishing it in different ways.

And winning and losing records?
1 Green Bay
2 New England
3 San Francisco
4(tied) New Orleans
5(tied)Pittsburg

Now keep in mind even yards per point, is also mainly an offensive measurement not a defensive measurement heavily impacted by the other side of your team by way of turnovers and field position. The above yards per point measurement is combined opponent's yards per point allowed. So a better way to say it would be not that NE's defense is one of the most efficient defenses in the league, but rather: whatever it is they are doing, they have forced their opponents offenses to play most inefficiently against them when it comes to scoring. NE makes opponents work really hard to score a point. It also means their opponents have inefficient offenses.

So looking at offensive yards per point:
1 Green Bay 11.5
4 San Francisco 13.4
6 New England 13.7
26 Pittsburgh 17.9

What does this mean? What it means is Pittsburg is busting ass for their offense and helping to make up for Ben's interceptions, stalls and 3 and outs. NE's defense has been helping it's offense out lately, but they are both playing very efficiently and therefore GB, NE and San Francisco have some of the best defenses and offenses in the league. Go figure!

For NE it makes sense considering what happened in Miami. Offense was very ineffective in the first half, raking up yards and no points. The defense, as you pointed out really stepped up and held Miami down for the offense to begin catching up. This stat is typically not a game average and also measures your "true" total defense and offense. It measures a team's total offense ability to score and and a team's total defense ability to stop opponents. Yards per point, doesn't ignore those finer details, like yards do(like special teams).

So to recap the reason NE's is ranked lowed in yards allowed is because:
1. They have a very efficient offense who score a lot and forces kick-offs.
2. NE is #2 in defending starting field position thanks to their awesome special teams pinning opponents back.
3. NE's defense doesn't give up points, and opponents die trying.
4. NE's true total defense efficiency(scoring defense yards per point allowed): #2

Conclussion:
The Patriots has the #2 defense in the league because they happen to play with the New England Patriots offense and special teams. GB is #3. People are silly creatures and are easily influenced by TV and Mr. Yard Stat. Mr. Yard Stat is full of it. In fact it's so bad at measuring things it can't even figure out if Chicago is a top 10 defense or if it's San Diego that's better by its own measurement. Mr Yard Stat doesn't know what it's doing.


I look forward to what the naysayers who claim our defense is horrible have to say...
 
This is a great thread filled with insightful posts. My thoughts are:
- our offense is great and is more important than defense in this age of football.
- our offense puts the defense in great position to limit points due to field position and minimal turnovers
- our defense is young and has decent talent to be good when healthy
- injuries have depleted our defense especially secondary. Due to the injuries, our defense is not very good. If you put our defense with the NJ Jets offense, we would be near bottom in the league for points given up due to their inept offense.
- BB is ahead of the game and is focused on a great offense and defense that can cause big plays (turnovers, sacks) so the offense can get the ball back. The attempt to switch to a 4-3 was to create opportunities to get the ball back. The 3-4 is a react defense and let's an efficient opponent such as the Saints or Packers to march down the field in a methodical way. 4-3 creates pressure and disrupts - we will be fine once we get some more DE talent and recover from injuries.
- this playoffs will depend on the play of the o-line protecting Brady and the defense getting big plays to give the ball back to the offense. Defense needs to be physical, grab, hold and take the penalties for pass interference (after awhile, refs just let you play physical because they can't call a penalty on every play).
 
This is a great thread filled with insightful posts. My thoughts are:
- our offense is great and is more important than defense in this age of football.
- our offense puts the defense in great position to limit points due to field position and minimal turnovers
- our defense is young and has decent talent to be good when healthy
- injuries have depleted our defense especially secondary. Due to the injuries, our defense is not very good. If you put our defense with the NJ Jets offense, we would be near bottom in the league for points given up due to their inept offense.
- BB is ahead of the game and is focused on a great offense and defense that can cause big plays (turnovers, sacks) so the offense can get the ball back. The attempt to switch to a 4-3 was to create opportunities to get the ball back. The 3-4 is a react defense and let's an efficient opponent such as the Saints or Packers to march down the field in a methodical way. 4-3 creates pressure and disrupts - we will be fine once we get some more DE talent and recover from injuries.
- this playoffs will depend on the play of the o-line protecting Brady and the defense getting big plays to give the ball back to the offense. Defense needs to be physical, grab, hold and take the penalties for pass interference (after awhile, refs just let you play physical because they can't call a penalty on every play).

Good stuff. I like the added physicality part a lot, and I feel that some improvement in that area (especially in the trenches) will determine our outcome.

I am not sure that I necessarily agree on the manner which you suggest, in terms of holding, grabbing and drawing pass interference calls. You claim that the refs cannot call it every play, but as we saw in the NYG game, sometimes just one or two PI calls can change the game in a very negative way.

If the defense can get some pressure on the QB, and watch the big plays in the passing game (#32 I'm talking to you), we should be okay. I really think that if the defense limits our opponents to the early to mid 20's (which is our defensive pts average) we should be just fine.

The pass protection and allowing Brady to be successful will be the wildcard in the next couple/few/several games. To me, if you give TB the time to throw, there is no possible way the other team can stop him. I like the adjustments from the offensive line in the past few games, but I still feel as though there can be serious improvement there.
 
If I'm answering the right quesion, I will infer you are asking why doesn't Arrington seem to run with his back to the ball as often as McCourty.

There are a couple of answers. First he might be the guy who is always assigned to the guy most likely to go deep. Secondly he probably has better technique than Mc Courty, and third, he's been in the league a year longer and SHOULD have better technique

Great job as always, Ken. I enjoy reading your write ups after the games, and they provide a lot of insight.

I am going to respectfully disagree on your assessment regarding the CB's though.

First off, I do not believe that Arrington is always assigned the guy most likely to go deep. We all have seen McCourty's coverage this yr on the majority of other teams' #1 WR's. Guys like Vincent Jackson, Brandon Marshall, Moss (WSH), Bryant, Calvin Johnson (last yr's Thanksgiving game)etc have the potential to go deep more than any other WR out there.

I also believe that Arrington's "being in the league longer" is a huge stretch. This is Arrington's 3rd yr vs McCourty's 2nd yr, that should not make that much of a difference, especially when considering that Arrington was undrafted out of Hofstra, and saw a very low-level of competition; while McCourty was a FIRST rounder who saw a lot of top level competition at Rutgers.

The one part I certainly do agree with you is that Arrington probably has better technique than McCourty. That is certainly a valid point, and seems to be the ultimate answer here.

When your high-paying job is to turn around and look for the ball, yet you consistantly do not do that, you are going to raise some questions. My question is which season is the real McCourty? Some are starting to wonder if it is this one.

Thank you both.

Yes Ken, my query was along the similar lines. Fact that Arrington may be covering with an eye on the ball (vs. McC who is not) indicates that the coaches are giving our CBs leeway in tailoring their techniques, right? If yes, it is not the coaching that resulted in this habit. Surprised how a pro-bowler can have such a significant change. Hopefully it is corrected in his third year.

Supafly - great points on Arrington.
 
Great job as always, Ken. I enjoy reading your write ups after the games, and they provide a lot of insight.

I am going to respectfully disagree on your assessment regarding the CB's though.

First off, I do not believe that Arrington is always assigned the guy most likely to go deep. We all have seen McCourty's coverage this yr on the majority of other teams' #1 WR's. Guys like Vincent Jackson, Brandon Marshall, Moss (WSH), Bryant, Calvin Johnson (last yr's Thanksgiving game)etc have the potential to go deep more than any other WR out there.

I also believe that Arrington's "being in the league longer" is a huge stretch. This is Arrington's 3rd yr vs McCourty's 2nd yr, that should not make that much of a difference, especially when considering that Arrington was undrafted out of Hofstra, and saw a very low-level of competition; while McCourty was a FIRST rounder who saw a lot of top level competition at Rutgers.

The one part I certainly do agree with you is that Arrington probably has better technique than McCourty. That is certainly a valid point, and seems to be the ultimate answer here.

When your high-paying job is to turn around and look for the ball, yet you consistantly do not do that, you are going to raise some questions. My question is which season is the real McCourty? Some are starting to wonder if it is this one.
Sup, its never a problem disagree. However in this case I only want to rebut on half my post. After re-reading my previous post, I realized that I failed to identify McCourty as the Player who most often takes the deep receiver. Bad sentence structure on my part.

But as far as the advantage Arrington had by being in the league an extra year STILL holds. You have forgotten that once they get to the NFL, it has no relevence WHERE they come from. First round, 7th round, UDFA. Hey its not like they give the 1st round picks special drills or teach them special techniques. Once they get there they only have their skills and results to judge them.

Arrington not only had a full extra year of reps, he also had an extra year with a full off season, and even though it is only one year, its significant. Now don't get me wrong, I'm disturbed that McCourty's techniques are not were they should be. Hopefully a full off season at Foxboro will help alleviate that, but you have to understand that what we see this year shouldn't be what we get down the road either
 
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