Idle Thoughts – Post Revis Edition

[Sicilian]

My natural instinct when something disappointing happens to a sports team I follow is to look forward. I'm much more interested in what we can do now than what we could have done in the past. So I'll be waiting for the next Patriots moves, and I rarely see them coming. I didn't see them targeting Adalius Thomas (who despite not working out long term was the consensus jewel of defensive free agency that year). I didn't see the trade for Moss coming until the day it happened. I didn't see Wes Welker having the impact he did. And I didn't see Revis coming here after Talib went to the Broncos.

The point being, they've got a plan B. So far this morning both radio shows have been beating the, "Well, name me a corner available out there who's any good?" And that's exactly my point: We can never name the impact guys that are going to end up on this team. Just like we can never predict the Logan Mankins or Sebastian Vollmer reaches that turn out to be stallwarts on the line, or the Devin McCourty pick that turns into a pro bowl safety. Something will happen, even if we can't see it coming.

And my final addition: The Super Bowl winning formula changes every year. When the Giants beat us in 07 it was "You need a relentless pass rush!". When the Packers won it was "You need four great wide receivers!" Now after back to back Super Bowls by Seattle and New England, it's "You need that shut down corner!" Ignoring that outside of those two teams, most SB champions DON'T have one of the best corners in the league. They help, don't misunderstand, I would MUCH rather have Revis than not have him, but there are so many ways to win a Super Bowl. We're just going to have to find one of those alternatives now.

 

[Sicilian]

One player did allow the Patriots to play man defense, 1 player did allow the defense to play a style that gave guys like Andrew Luck fits....without that 1 man, we are looking at a zone defense and zone defense is dead in the NFL.

We gave that Colts team fits without Revis too. That's a terrible example. Revis helps, but if having one of him was the only way to win in the NFL then it would become the NBA where you know only one of four teams is going to win the championship.

 

[1960Pats]

2. With the money the Pats saved by Revis leaving, I'd like to see the Pats go after Terrence Knighton.

 

[reflexblue]

As i posted in another thread...typical jest move. One shut down corner is not going to make the jest a winner. They could have used that money to plug other holes, but have ham strung themselves with a massive contract. The True Revis surfaced, hes All about the money, i guess he doesn't mind losing as long as he has a fat contract.
The Pats could offset the loss to a great degree with a better pass rush, Sign J Sheard, draft a pass rushing end etc.

 

[Patriots1364life]

We can sugarcoat it all we want but this defense is a mess right now. It sucks because I wanted tommy to get a crack at a 5th championship. That schedule next year looks daunting now

 

[Nunchucks]

We gave that Colts team fits without Revis too. That's a terrible example. Revis helps, but if having one of him was the only way to win in the NFL then it would become the NBA where you know only one of four teams is going to win the championship.

We had Talib at that point, you remember that guy, right? Look, I completely understand the whole concept you are trying to use to make yourself feel better. But, Revis is a transcendent player and we had him under contract and let him walk out of the building. What he allowed this defense to do was amazing and without him, well....it is just disappointing.

We have lots of hopes and dreams for the future...but, in today's NFL, if you cannot cover, you are in a shootout. Sure, I like the Patriots chances in a shootout, but I really enjoy watching good defense. Watching teams move up and down the field and score at will...that is not the football I enjoy watching and prior to Talib being on the Patriots, we were subject to that week in and week out.

Belichick needs players for his defensive genius moniker and right now the patriots do not have those players.....

 

[Nunchucks]

2. With the money the Pats saved by Revis leaving, I'd like to see the Pats go after Terrence Knighton.

Knighton is not the player you think he is. He is solid, but he has been fairly invisible since he beat up the Patriots last year.

 

[makoute]

I'm not overly concerned at what Miami and New York have done. They're both investing a silly amount of money (with significant guarantees) into one player who doesn't happen to be a Quarterback. That's a fast track to nowhere.

If that doesn't scream they're still chasing the Patriots, then I don't know what does. I can't wait to see the countermoves.

Every team is chasing the Pats, they are the superbowl champs, and none of those teams really have qbs that they can invest money in, so they are spending it elsewhere, and they are spending it on proven, great, HOF caliber talent. Doesn't mean they will win, but we all can admit here, that as it stands today, the Pats are slightly worse off than they were at the end of the season, whereas the Bills, and Jets, are slightly better, not sure about the Doolphins though.

 

[patfanken]

I'd like to talk about thought #1...

And on thought #1 I believe you meant Andre Johnson, not Andre Williams, the giants 2nd year RB.

OK, I probably should explain the #1's.

I don't know if this ever happens to you, but occasionally as my fingers fly around the keyboard, I, for some reason will miss hit a key, or series of keys and suddenly my post disappears. That can be extremely frustrating, especially when you are putting together a long post (and I've been known to occasionally write some looooonnnnngggg posts ). So now when I know when I'm writing something long, I do it on Word, then copy and paste.

Now when I do this, for some reason I lose the space between the individual thoughts. I like those spaces. I think they make it easier to read. But when I added the space between them this time, for some reason, the numbers lost continuity and just became #1's. By then it was close to 2am and I didn't know how to fix it, nor did I care at that point. My solution will be to go to asterisks or dashes to separate ideas.

.....and you were right, I did mean Andre Johnson. I will fix that.

 

[ausbacker]

Every team is chasing the Pats, they are the superbowl champs, and none of those teams really have qbs that they can invest money in, so they are spending it elsewhere, and they are spending it on proven, great, HOF caliber talent. Doesn't mean they will win, but we all can admit here, that as it stands today, the Pats are slightly worse off than they were at the end of the season, whereas the Bills, and Jets, are slightly better, not sure about the Doolphins though.

No, they're significantly over investing in great talent. That simply doesn't hold when building a championship roster. The Patriots will continue to add to their roster with unsexy, highly productive additions.

 

[Sicilian]

We had Talib at that point, you remember that guy, right? Look, I completely understand the whole concept you are trying to use to make yourself feel better. But, Revis is a transcendent player and we had him under contract and let him walk out of the building. What he allowed this defense to do was amazing and without him, well....it is just disappointing.

We have lots of hopes and dreams for the future...but, in today's NFL, if you cannot cover, you are in a shootout. Sure, I like the Patriots chances in a shootout, but I really enjoy watching good defense. Watching teams move up and down the field and score at will...that is not the football I enjoy watching and prior to Talib being on the Patriots, we were subject to that week in and week out.

Belichick needs players for his defensive genius moniker and right now the patriots do not have those players.....

And we got Talib for a 4th round pick in the middle of a season, and to that point no one had any idea he was on the Pats radar (or even as good as he turned out to be). And again, I implore you to find a team outside of Seattle and New England in the last ten years who needed a top 5 CB to win their Super Bowl. Pittsburgh? Green Bay? New Orleans? Indy? Baltimore? The Giants? Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, and nope. There are options, don't fall for the flavor of the month.

 

[Nunchucks]

And we got Talib for a 4th round pick in the middle of a season, and to that point no one had any idea he was on the Pats radar (or even as good as he turned out to be). And again, I implore you to find a team outside of Seattle and New England in the last ten years who needed a top 5 CB to win their Super Bowl. Pittsburgh? Green Bay? New Orleans? Indy? Baltimore? The Giants? Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, and nope. There are options, don't fall for the flavor of the month.

lol, strong corner play is no flavor of the month

 

[Sicilian]

lol, strong corner play is no flavor of the month

And Revis isn't the only way to have strong corner play. And I'm still waiting for the high priced, elite corners on those Super Bowl teams. I'm not saying Revis doesn't make the defense much better, OF COURSE he does. But there are many ways to win in the NFL, people just tend to fixate on the one they've seen lately.

 

[Tunescribe]

I still might feel a tad better if I knew specifically what the Pats offered Revis and why they didn't somehow top the Jets deal with him. They could've done it knowing he'd be a key cog in a repeat title run, but didn't. Why?

 

[Nunchucks]

And Revis isn't the only way to have strong corner play. And I'm still waiting for the high priced, elite corners on those Super Bowl teams. I'm not saying Revis doesn't make the defense much better, OF COURSE he does. But there are many ways to win in the NFL, people just tend to fixate on the one they've seen lately.

Well the Packers had sam shields and some old guy...what is his name charles woodson or something? I forget...The saints had the most turnovers that season with Darren the rapist Sharper playing safety...they could also rush the passer like nobody's business. Indy got very hot at the end of the year with Bob Sanders playing out of his skull...their corners were solid..they also had a couple of nobody's rushing the passer named Dwight Freeny and Robert Mathis ...the Patriots got knocked out by the Jets that year...oh and the Ravens played awesome defense in the playoffs...with Ed Reed and they could rush the passer as well and you continue to denigrade the Ravens corners but those guys could play some football.

The patriots play a 2-gap technique on the DL....unless that changes, we will not see pass rushing like the teams above utilized....that and of course the talent gap.

 

[1960Pats]

Knighton is not the player you think he is. He is solid, but he has been fairly invisible since he beat up the Patriots last year.

I think he's just what we need, but I haven't seen that much of him to disagree.

 

[hwc]

Why?

3 years. $48 million, $39 million fully guaranteed.

$16 million a year is $2 million more than the next highest paid CB in the NFL. $39 million guaranteed over 3 years would cause major problems with every other contract the Pats have or want to have with players in the future.

 

[Sicilian]

Well the Packers had sam shields and some old guy...what is his name charles woodson or something? I forget...The saints had the most turnovers that season with Darren the rapist Sharper playing safety...they could also rush the passer like nobody's business. Indy got very hot at the end of the year with Bob Sanders playing out of his skull...their corners were solid..they also had a couple of nobody's rushing the passer named Dwight Freeny and Robert Mathis ...the Patriots got knocked out by the Jets that year...oh and the Ravens played awesome defense in the playoffs...with Ed Reed and they could rush the passer as well and you continue to denigrade the Ravens corners but those guys could play some football.

The patriots play a 2-gap technique on the DL....unless that changes, we will not see pass rushing like the teams above utilized....that and of course the talent gap.

Woodson is a good example. Every other team you listed had an elite (or playing elite at the time) SAFETY. Oddly enough, we still have that.

 

[Nunchucks]

Woodson is a good example. Every other team you listed had an elite (or playing elite at the time) SAFETY. Oddly enough, we still have that.

heh, elite safety that made plays...ours just stops QBs from throwing his way....They also had solid corner play and an elite pass rush.

 

[patfanken]

One player did allow the Patriots to play man defense, 1 player did allow the defense to play a style that gave guys like Andrew Luck fits....without that 1 man, we are looking at a zone defense and zone defense is dead in the NFL.

Not to be confrontational, Nun, but the Pats have a lot of luck crushing Andrew Luck BEFORE last season. And I would be willing to guess the Pats have experimented a bit with man coverages BEFORE Darelle Revis joined the team. They might even play it some in 2015 with the players they have available.

Sorry for the sarcasm, but it seemed you were falling into the trap that Revis was the key to any success the Pats had on defense. While you can't deny he had a significant impact, his value has been blown out of the realm of reality by a rabid media who ALWAYS wants to explain everything, good or bad, as being the responsibility of one person.

If his impact was THAT big, why is it that his teams have only been to the playoff 2 or 3 times in a 8 year career BEFORE he got to the Pats. If having great shut down CB's are so universally important, why have we put up 40+ points so consistently on a Colt team that has 2 very good CB's.

You see Nun, putting together a winning TEAM is a lot more complex than that. The decisions are often messy, and not easy, and you never know if you were right or wrong until October or November of the next year. That's why I won't bother listening to the mediots for the next few weeks, because you and I already know what they will be saying. Listening to them would be a kind of self flagellation....and quite frankly I'm not into pain.