Hmm... let Talib walk and cut Wilfork?

[BelichicksHoodie]

Yeah! Let's get rid of our 2 best players and replace them with draft picks! Great idea! Those never bust or anything! And it's not like we have a finite amount of time before TFB retires!

Wilfork wasn't our best or even second best defender on our roster last year, his play slipped dramatically from years prior. There are no sentimental roster spots in this league anymore. If the Baltimore Ravens can cut the greatest safety of all time in Ed Reed, we sure as heck can cut Vince Wilfork, and should if he isn't healthy or he can't return to the form we need him to. I hope we don't have to, because he's one of my all-time favourite Patriots, but I'm coming to grips with the possibility

Talib though, I agree with you 100%

 

[Kontradiction]

Yeah! Let's get rid of our 2 best players and replace them with draft picks! Great idea! Those never bust or anything! And it's not like we have a finite amount of time before TFB retires!

Why are you so confident that Wilfork will return to previous form? List the reasons, please.

The team could go any number of routes. Realistically, this thread isn't soley about just cutting them/letting them go and replacing them. It's about freeing up cap space in the case of Wilfork, who is less likely to return to form given the injury and letting Talib walk if he asks for top five money. I then detailed ways (though both FA and the draft) to fill in and improve other areas of the defense while not completely falling apart at those two positions by offering ideas for adequate replacements. Naturally, you're more than welcome to offer up alternatives of your own so we can have a reasonable debate, but I guess it was easier to just go the passive aggressive route with zero substance.

 

[Kontradiction]

Letting Talib go is a dangerous game of chicken. While he certainly has had injury concerns I'm not confident in the Pats ability to draft a replacement. I'm also not so confident that the other free agent options are going to be any cheaper. A Guy like Grimes, who IMO is abetter player, are not going to be easily signed. At this point I think resigning Talib hopefully in the 4-6 mil a year range is the safest option.

Yeah but what if Talib is looking for top five CB money? Do you give that money to a guy that injures the same area of his body literally every single season and never returns to the player that he was, pre-injury/aggravation? I wouldn't I'd let him walk and used that money to improve other areas of the defense while trying, either through FA or the draft, to find a suitable replacement.

 

[RayClay]

You obviously didn't read the post because you only replied to the FA part of it without acknowledging the draft prospects I mentioned as well. For instance, if Talib signs a team friendly, incentive loaded deal, the team could also use a day two pick on guys like Purifoy or Baptiste (both of whom are taller and physical CB's). I'm not advocating to cut Wilfork just because of money. I'm advocating to cut him because of that combined with the fact that the odds of a man his size coming off of a torn Achilles and recovering are extremely slim.

You're right, I didn't seriously consider letting go a current all pro CB hoping we'd get one in the draft.

I see where now talking about signing him plus draft picks. Whatever.

I haven't examined Wilfork, I don't know what the odds are. I'd be surprised if anyone here does, but you never know.

 

[Coach42]

Yeah but what if Talib is looking for top five CB money? Do you give that money to a guy that injures the same area of his body literally every single season and never returns to the player that he was, pre-injury/aggravation? I wouldn't I'd let him walk and used that money to improve other areas of the defense while trying, either through FA or the draft, to find a suitable replacement.

That's the scary part. I would not pay him top 5 money personally. Our ability to replace him, unless by some miracle a guy like Grimes comes cheaper, is not good. I can't see Miami letting grimes go or KC Shields so your essentially hoping that one our current CBs makes the leap (unlikely), we nail a great CB pick in the draft (even less likely if we look a recent history) or we find a diamond in the rough 2nd tier FA.

I think we have to hope Talib is willing to take less money to stay a Patriot otherwise our Defense takes a significant step backwards.

 

[kennyb]

I see this mentioned all the time. Why would a team try to trade a first rounder for Talib after he gets tagged when they can just wait a year to negotiate a contract with him while keeping the first rounder? I don't see any team dumb enough to take that cheese (not even the Jets) and the Pats would be on the hook for the franchise tag cap hit it takes to keep him for one more year.

It's done though. The reason is they couldn't be SURE they'd get the player NEXT year. Also teams have a WIN NOW mentality.

How'd the pats trade a QB to KC when he was tagged? He wasn't worth the tag amount, yet they still got something for him. Although, in that case, I thought the pats were lucky they could get anything for him, given how high the QB tag was.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

It's done though. The reason is they couldn't be SURE they'd get the player NEXT year. Also teams have a WIN NOW mentality.

How'd the pats trade a QB to KC when he was tagged? He wasn't worth the tag amount, yet they still got something for him. Although, in that case, I thought the pats were lucky they could get anything for him, given how high the QB tag was.

Cassel deal was contingent on him negotiating a new contract. If he had tried to play out under the tag and then re-sign a long term deal the deal never would have gotten done. Plus, he was a QB. They are highly valued commodities.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

It's not like we have unlimited funding so ... He wasn't on the field a lot of the time since he's been with us.

"It's a balance of us balancing all that out and what is he worth," Kraft continued. "I think he's happy here and would like to be here and we're happy with him and we'd like to have him here and now it's just about doing business

Kraft knows he can't stay healthy and will be the reson he probably won't be back and it's a smart move unless he comes back for cheap

 

[Kontradiction]

You're right, I didn't seriously consider letting go a current all pro CB hoping we'd get one in the draft.

I see where now talking about signing him plus draft picks. Whatever.

I haven't examined Wilfork, I don't know what the odds are. I'd be surprised if anyone here does, but you never know.

I suggest you start taking a look at how deep this draft is. Not sure if we'll get an All-Pro and not sure that guy can even replace Talib, but if he's going hamstring that much of the salary cap, we're going to have to let him walk. Whether you want to admit it or not, the team does have alternatives. Thanks for adding less than nothing to the thread, though!

 

[Love The Drake]

I say Talib comes back 3 years 19.5 million anymore I would let him walk is there a defensive back out there that had a off year that could be a cheap solid addition for us?
Do we rely on a draft pick at Defensive Back can Logan Ryan make a big year 2 jump. Also what do people think about signing Nick Collins? If we replace Talib theres two guys I like Captain muneryln and Richard Marshall. I would be happy with a haul of Michael Johnson , Arthur Jones and Captain Munerlyn over Talb and Edelman if that were to come if Edelman walks I'm in the Danario Alexander Emanuel Sanders crowd. Tight End its Chandler or bust or Draft Ebron I like him better then Colt or Jace.

 

[SalemPats]

I say Talib comes back 3 years 19.5 million anymore I would let him walk is there a defensive back out there that had a off year that could be a cheap solid addition for us?
Do we rely on a draft pick at Defensive Back can Logan Ryan make a big year 2 jump. Also what do people think about signing Nick Collins? If we replace Talib theres two guys I like Captain muneryln and Richard Marshall. I would be happy with a haul of Michael Johnson , Arthur Jones and Captain Munerlyn over Talb and Edelman if that were to come if Edelman walks I'm in the Danario Alexander Emanuel Sanders crowd. Tight End its Chandler or bust or Draft Ebron I like him better then Colt or Jace.

physical corners are hard to find, i don't think we can just plug and play. It hasn't worked that way in the past for us in the secondary.

Also, whose to say we get those guys, in FA we're competing with 31 other teams. you make a better living room GM than an actual one.

 

[RayClay]

I suggest you start taking a look at how deep this draft is. Not sure if we'll get an All-Pro and not sure that guy can even replace Talib, but if he's going hamstring that much of the salary cap, we're going to have to let him walk. Whether you want to admit it or not, the team does have alternatives. Thanks for adding less than nothing to the thread, though!

I believe we draft 29th. We don't have any extra high picks that i know of. I disagree with your approach and didn't intend to add to your thread, merely give my opinion on cutting players you know in favor of the unknown. Wilfork might not might not be able to play. We lost both our starters and have only overachieving backups right now.

 

[Kontradiction]

Kraft knows he can't stay healthy and will be the reson he probably won't be back and it's a smart move unless he comes back for cheap

Kraft is thinking the same way a good amount of us are.

 

[Miguel]

The patriots can get to 28 million under the cap?


That's some serious surgery.

Patriots Salary Cap Picture ? 2/4/2014 Update atriots Salary Cap

details how

Summary:
Release Isaac Sopoaga - net cap savings of $2.080 million. -

Release Dan Connolly - net cap savings of $2.580 million

One of the following
a.)Reduce Wilfork's salary from $7.5 million to $4 million while converting $3.5 of his salary into a NTLBE incentive - cap savings of $3.5 million
•b) Release Wilfork - net cap savings of $7.505 million
•c) Extend Wilfork through the 2016 season - converting $6 million of his $7.5 million into a signing bonus - cap savings of $4 million

Convert $4.5 million of Mankins's $6.5 million salary into a signing bonus - cap savings of $3 million while pushing out $1.5 million of signing bonus proration to the 2015 and 2016 seasons.

Extend Gostkowski's contract by 4 years while giving him a $5 million signing bonus and lowering his salary from $2.9 million to $900,000 - cap savings - $1,000,000

Extend McCourty's contract by 4 years while giving him a $10 million signing bonus while lowering his 2014 salary from $3.92 million to $1 million - cap savings - $1,000,000

Release Steve Gregory - net cap savings of $2.23 million
Release Tommie Kelly - net cap savings of $1,661,250
Release Adrian Wilson - net cap savings of $746,667

 

[mgteich]

The draft is a pipe dream. Why would Belichick go into the draft counting on finding this year's #1 corner? This doesn't happen very often at #29. In any case, Belichick won't count on that kind of miracle. I don't have any problem drafting a corner. I just don't think that this can be Belichick's method of filling this years #1 CB job.

I expect us to sign a Bodden-like contract with Talib.

However, I do understand that Talib could ask too much and that we may need to sign at least one top or mid-level free agent instead of Talib.

Yeah but what if Talib is looking for top five CB money? Do you give that money to a guy that injures the same area of his body literally every single season and never returns to the player that he was, pre-injury/aggravation? I wouldn't I'd let him walk and used that money to improve other areas of the defense while trying, either through FA or the draft, to find a suitable replacement.

 

[RayClay]

Patriots Salary Cap Picture ? 2/4/2014 Update atriots Salary Cap

details how

Summary:
Release Isaac Sopoaga - net cap savings of $2.080 million. -

Release Dan Connolly - net cap savings of $2.580 million

One of the following
a.)Reduce Wilfork's salary from $7.5 million to $4 million while converting $3.5 of his salary into a NTLBE incentive - cap savings of $3.5 million
•b) Release Wilfork - net cap savings of $7.505 million
•c) Extend Wilfork through the 2016 season - converting $6 million of his $7.5 million into a signing bonus - cap savings of $4 million

Convert $4.5 million of Mankins's $6.5 million salary into a signing bonus - cap savings of $3 million while pushing out $1.5 million of signing bonus proration to the 2015 and 2016 seasons.

Extend Gostkowski's contract by 4 years while giving him a $5 million signing bonus and lowering his salary from $2.9 million to $900,000 - cap savings - $1,000,000

Extend McCourty's contract by 4 years while giving him a $10 million signing bonus while lowering his 2014 salary from $3.92 million to $1 million - cap savings - $1,000,000

Release Steve Gregory - net cap savings of $2.23 million
Release Tommie Kelly - net cap savings of $1,661,250
Release Adrian Wilson - net cap savings of $746,667

I like that approach (your preferences, boldeds) better than anything I've seen.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

If Kraft let Talib go, our secondary will be garbage again. " He wasn't on the field a lot of the time since he's been with us" and the result of those games wasn't good.Shutdown corners are tough to find,pay me the man Kraft.

 

[Kontradiction]

The draft is a pipe dream. Why would Belichick go into the draft counting on finding this year's #1 corner? This doesn't happen very often at #29. In any case, Belichick won't count on that kind of miracle. I don't have any problem drafting a corner. I just don't think that this can be Belichick's method of filling this years #1 CB job.

I expect us to sign a Bodden-like contract with Talib.

However, I do understand that Talib could ask too much and that we may need to sign at least one top or mid-level free agent instead of Talib.

The draft is a pipe dream? 100% of the shutdown corners in NFL history came from the draft.

 

[Bhelmet]

WOW!! Good to see so many fans are Douchi Ireas. In that spirit - you are ALL sheep and stupid - BOW to my greatness!

 

[AzPatsFan]

You forgot about Mankins and Edelman.

People don't remember the non-BB and Parcells years

Those junior GM suggestions,, WOULD remind them...