Grade our Draft

[jeffbiologist]

I would give this draft an A.

Everyone knew this was a deep draft. The patriots walked away with 4 picks in the second round's top ten, which with a little luck might pan out to be 4 first round picks. The patriots also got 2 more second round picks in 2010.

Drafting players is not an exact science, so if you walk away with more players to increase your probability of landing really good players for your team's future I say you did a pretty good job of drafting.

Its not an exact science, but an average draft lands 2 starters. A "good" draft lands more than that. Its been several years since we drafted 2 starters(NO-trading for Moss/Welker doesnt count), and we are starting to lose not just starters on Defense...but PLAYMAKERS(Harrison, Vrabes, and upcoming Bruschi/Seymour/Wilfork). I dont know where you got the idea this was a "deep draft", most 1sts were actually 2nds and its likely our 2nds would normally be 3rds...not 1sts. Personally I think we should have been looking for 2-3 starter/playmaker types rather than jag roster fodder. Jimmy Johnson built the 90s cowpokes the same way, cant complain about that I guess. But unless some of these guys turn into Emmit Smith/Ty Law types mediocrity is creeping into our locker room...but I have a feeling BB can coach em up. McShay just put it bluntly, the pats were the most active team, but they werent the most PRO-active team.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Impossible to grade. It's either you like it or you don't. In 2-3 years we will be able to hand out a grade. As of right now, Chung and Butler are my favorites.

 

[mgteich]

Perhaps. I expect us to keep a true back-up NT in Brace, who should be great in goal line situations, and be able to give Wilfork a few plays rest once in awhile, and finally start if Wilfork is injured.

Given our contract situation at DE, I would like us to keep LeKevin. That would have us keeping seven DL's as we have done occasionally in the past.

Even if and when Wilfork is extended, I would still like to have a solid backup.

Having 2 NT's has been Belichick's preference from the beginning. Kareem Brown was drafted 4th, and it didn't work out. It is difficult to find NT's.

Smith vs. Brace is looking like a huge TC battle.

 

[mgteich]

There will be more than two starters. Out of the following we should eventually have more than 2 starters. The key is that great teams don't need three or four immediate starters each year, the goal is NONE. The idea is to develop players for a year before they need to start. I didn't count the picks traded into 2010. BTW, I think that you should include trades. This doesn't matter this year since the 5th for Lewis will not produce a starter.

LEWIS will be a ST contributer and #4 WR, perhaps an expensive one.

CHUNG could be a starter at safety in 2010. He is an immediate ST starter.

BUTLER is likely to be a starter by 2010. He should be an immediate ST starter.

BRACE should not be a starter. He was drafted a backup at a key position. A 2nd is a heavy price, but NT's are rare.

VOLLMER is likely to be a starter at RT in 2010, or at least the #1 OT backup.

TATE is likely to be a 2011 starter, and a major contributer in 2010.

ORNERGER is likely to be a starter in 2011, or perhaps in 2010.

MCKENZIE could be an ILB starter in 2010, or at least be part of the Game Day rotation.

Its not an exact science, but an average draft lands 2 starters. A "good" draft lands more than that. Its been several years since we drafted 2 starters(NO-trading for Moss/Welker doesnt count), and we are starting to lose not just starters on Defense...but PLAYMAKERS(Harrison, Vrabes, and upcoming Bruschi/Seymour/Wilfork). I dont know where you got the idea this was a "deep draft", most 1sts were actually 2nds and its likely our 2nds would normally be 3rds...not 1sts. Personally I think we should have been looking for 2-3 starter/playmaker types rather than jag roster fodder. Jimmy Johnson built the 90s cowpokes the same way, cant complain about that I guess. But unless some of these guys turn into Emmit Smith/Ty Law types mediocrity is creeping into our locker room...but I have a feeling BB can coach em up. McShay just put it bluntly, the pats were the most active team, but they werent the most PRO-active team.

 

[JoeShmoe]

There will be more than two starters. Out of the following we should eventually have more than 2 starters. The key is that great teams don't need three or four immediate starters each year, the goal is NONE. The idea is to develop players for a year before they need to start. I didn't count the picks traded into 2010. BTW, I think that you should include trades. This doesn't matter this year since the 5th for Lewis will not produce a starter.

LEWIS will be a ST contributer and #4 WR, perhaps an expensive one.

CHUNG could be a starter at safety in 2010. He is an immediate ST starter.

BUTLER is likely to be a starter by 2010. He should be an immediate ST starter.

BRACE should not be a starter. He was drafted a backup at a key position. A 2nd is a heavy price, but NT's are rare.

VOLLMER is likely to be a starter at RT in 2010, or at least the #1 OT backup.

TATE is likely to be a 2011 starter, and a major contributer in 2010.

ORNERGER is likely to be a starter in 2011, or perhaps in 2010.

MCKENZIE could be an ILB starter in 2010, or at least be part of the Game Day rotation.

Great summary although I think Brace will play this year esp. in goalline, short yardage situations and to spell Vince if were well ahead in games

 

[aaron spacemuseum]

When the draft started out I was shocked repeatedly and questioning heavily. Like 08's class, it's starting to make sense now that i have some space from it. For instance, I was pissed that we bailed on a premier Left Tackle that fell right in to our lap and even more bummed to trade out of the first. When Delmas went before we picked Chung, I thought "damn, we just lost the safety we wanted and scrambled for Chung". But in listening to Chung's conference call today and also watching his interview on draftguys tv, he's clearly a sharp guy with a good maturity level. As enamored with Delmas as I was, I'm not sure that he gave that same impression. It all comes back to an article that was written last year (maybe by Lombardi?) the Patriots board is always going to look very different from everyone else's because the premium that they place on intelligence.

It goes to show that you can read every profile on these guys and watch all the clips online, but you'll never know what it's like to talk to them one on one and ask them to answer football questions quickly and coherently. I wanted Maualuga, I really did. But listen to Tyrone McKenzie's conference call today and then think of any Maualuga interview that you saw/heard recently. McKenzie sounds like his maturity level is 10-15 years higher.

The only pick that didn't upset me initially was Vollmer. If you haven't seen his profile on draftguys tv, look it up now. The guy is a talent and it looks like his best days are ahead of him. Don't be surprised if Vollmer is joining in on Welker and Wilhite's soccer team within a few months. Also he was ranked in the late second/early third round range on Gosselin's final 100 ranking so I'm not sure why so many people thin the pick was such a reach. Gosselin's a pretty connected guy and a good talent evaluator.

The thing about the draft class that does bother me is the doubling up of lineman towards the end, I thought we could have branched out and picked someone like Javon Ringer or looked at another position - I would have LOVED to take a chance on Frantz Joseph. But now, I'm getting the sense that BB was "insuring" his early picks much like he did with Wilhite and Bo Ruud last year. BB wants a quality reserve NT so now he's covered a little if Brace doesn't work out or gets injured. If Brace looks great though, don't be surprised if Pryor end up on IR right before the season starts.

Overall, I think this has potential to be a really good draft. I'm really psyched about all four of our 2nd rounders and McKenzie. I'm intrigued by the quickness of Edelman. Skeptical about an underweight longsnapper. Tate seems likely to redshirt his first year as well, but could be an amazing asset in 2010. Plus we got two 2nd rounders for next year!

 

[Nestapats]

When the draft started out I was shocked repeatedly and questioning heavily. Like 08's class, it's starting to make sense now that i have some space from it. For instance, I was pissed that we bailed on a premier Left Tackle that fell right in to our lap and even more bummed to trade out of the first. When Delmas went before we picked Chung, I thought "damn, we just lost the safety we wanted and scrambled for Chung". But in listening to Chung's conference call today and also watching his interview on draftguys tv, he's clearly a sharp guy with a good maturity level. As enamored with Delmas as I was, I'm not sure that he gave that same impression. It all comes back to an article that was written last year (maybe by Lombardi?) the Patriots board is always going to look very different from everyone else's because the premium that they place on intelligence.

It goes to show that you can read every profile on these guys and watch all the clips online, but you'll never know what it's like to talk to them one on one and ask them to answer football questions quickly and coherently. I wanted Maualuga, I really did. But listen to Tyrone McKenzie's conference call today and then think of any Maualuga interview that you saw/heard recently. McKenzie sounds like his maturity level is 10-15 years higher.

The only pick that didn't upset me initially was Vollmer. If you haven't seen his profile on draftguys tv, look it up now. The guy is a talent and it looks like his best days are ahead of him. Don't be surprised if Vollmer is joining in on Welker and Wilhite's soccer team within a few months. Also he was ranked in the late second/early third round range on Gosselin's final 100 ranking so I'm not sure why so many people thin the pick was such a reach. Gosselin's a pretty connected guy and a good talent evaluator.

The thing about the draft class that does bother me is the doubling up of lineman towards the end, I thought we could have branched out and picked someone like Javon Ringer or looked at another position - I would have LOVED to take a chance on Frantz Joseph. But now, I'm getting the sense that BB was "insuring" his early picks much like he did with Wilhite and Bo Ruud last year. BB wants a quality reserve NT so now he's covered a little if Brace doesn't work out or gets injured. If Brace looks great though, don't be surprised if Pryor end up on IR right before the season starts.

Overall, I think this has potential to be a really good draft. I'm really psyched about all four of our 2nd rounders and McKenzie. I'm intrigued by the quickness of Edelman. Skeptical about an underweight longsnapper. Tate seems likely to redshirt his first year as well, but could be an amazing asset in 2010. Plus we got two 2nd rounders for next year!

Yeah, it's the same for me. When the draft is going on you're constantly wanting a specific guy at that spot and when they pick someone else you're dissappointed. But if you look at it now, they've selected only players they thought useful and good prospects.
I really liked Chung, Butler and Brace at the senior bowl this year, so in the end i'm really glad we took them.
I read somewhere a really good analysis on how brilliant this draft is, he said: Chung is the best SS, Brace is the 2nd best NT, Butler is in many opinions the 2nd best CB. So you're first three picks are all quality players for a good price.

I also think it's impossible to grade at this point, but it looks really good. Love the Tate pick Btw

 

[greerre]

I gave a grade day one of C+, and after reading into these guys more, I would actually rate it higher. I hated the pick of Chung, but now I think he is my favorite player we took.

One pcik that REALLY made me think was Mckenzie. It leaves me rather torn. I love the kid. He produced on all three teams he played for, which to me says he not only is versatile, but also that he shows up to play no matter who he's playing for, I also love the fact that he transfered to South Florida to be closer to his ill mother. I think that speaks to his character and he will be great in the locker room. Here is what I didn't get about the pick...

Going into this draft we had a glaring hole at OLB, and less so at ILB. We also had a huge need for someone who could get to the QB on 3rd down (watching the patriots try to cover something over the middle on 3rd and long was painful last season). I was happy that we picked a linebacker, but why did we pick a natural ILB who not only doesn't have a good pass rushing game, but doesn't even play on third downs.

I understand the BPA mentality, and I like that, but surely there was a better available who could provide that pressure?

I guess what I am trying to say is that I dont know how to value this pick. I love the player as a patriot (great attitude and will soak up everything the coaches say) and his productivity (100+ tackles in 3 different programs), but at the same time, we still have nothing to resemble an outside pass rush.

Final thought on McKenzie... great long-term pick: Everything I look for in a patriot, nothing that I looked for at the position this draft. I honestly think he will start in a couple next to mayo. I guess this is a little long winded and off topic since I am grading a player and not the entire draft, but I feel like he sums up how we picked. All the defensive players taken in this draft are going to be ST studs until the big guys start leaving in free agency and then we will see the genius of BB... upgrading from C+ to A-

 

[AzPatsFan]

I'm glad I read posts like these. I feel better after your analogy and it does make perfect sense. Must admit I'm a little perturbed about no pass rushers yet. I hope you go over some of the names that are still on the board that may help us in that department and list them.

Unless Crable/Woods has BB's full trust I can't imagine going through another season with the lack of pass rush which contributed to real bad 3rd down #s.

They do.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Fine. I just happen to think the time to draft an NFL ready tackle is the year you have a hole, not two years previous. "NFL-ready" means he'll only really improve with game experience. No point drafting at a premium and then stashing someone on the bench for years.

I agree. But better yet is to take a raw guy and prepare him for a year or two. Especially if he has enormous potential. Like Volmer. If Scar went to Houston to work him out and came back with a Scholarship to his elite Academy for Offensive Linemen, who am I to criticize the inexpensive pick.

 

[Ricey]

A-

Reason it's not a A+ is cause Im bitter and they never draft anyone I want. Joking aside though, great draft. Not only did we get solid football players that fills needs but also got alot of depth on the O and D line. And the icing on the cake is getting 2 second round picks next year.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

We got some solid players, but I am completely confused about why no linebackers were taken. I guess we are signing taylor to play OLB and not finding a replacement at ILB? We could have had a great young LBing core after this draft, and instead we will have 3 aging starters.

I know people will say that the draft was good since we got good players, but the cost was too high. Im not saying we reached, I am saying we took several players at the cost of some linebacker talent.

Also, I guess BB didnt see the lions taking delmas, because I bet he would have been willing to give up a 6th to trade up one spot and take him over chung...

This was not the draft I was expecting, and I am not pleasantly surprised.

BB said he considers a draft a success if the team comes out better than it went in. THe team could have come out looking much better than it does now.

Grade: C+

What would happen to that grade if you find out BB believes he already has a solid, pass rushing OLB lined up?

 

[Nonentity]

We learnt before the draft that Bill Belichick has physical criteria for each position (e.g. RBs must be a certain height, hence why we didn't go for Maurice Jones-Drew). If they hit those minimum benchmarks then we'll start looking at the tape.

Then read Bill's transcript from the post-draft press conference yesterday:

"I mean, generally speaking, I think that there were more shorter players, maybe a little less speed than what we’ve seen, maybe a little more power with good production. There weren’t a lot of 4.6, 4.65 [40 time] guys. There weren’t a lot of 6-[foot]-4, 6-[foot]-5 guys. I’d say it was a much smaller pool of those types of players."

So perhaps there just wasn't anyone who fit Bill's prototype for the position. Every prospect mentioned had flaws and the level of disagreement on this forum proved that - there really was no obvious fit for the Patriots.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

Grade: Incomplete

Once again this draft absolutely failed to solve the major problem of the Pats defense, a pass rush! I could see trading down from #23, because there was no one left, but two teams got #1s next year for 2nd round picks, and all the Pats got were a couple of 3rds (which they turned into 2nds). I was wondering how many CBs they were going to have, until of course they gave away Ellis to the Iggles. The Pats will start next year without a single CB who has ever started a game for the Pats.

Not one guy drafted yesterday will start week #1 (aside from the long snapper), this team is worse than it was last year, and worse than it was two years ago.

I like Brace, but the fact that they traded up to get him worries me about Vince's status.
I'm not sold on Butler, quick name a single starting QB in the Big East? Anyone?

The tackle was at the very least a 2 round reach (if not more), and it is not like they didn't have the picks to get him later on.

They traded a starting CB, and the best KO return guy in the league for a pair of 5th round picks, and they gave them away for another lineman reach.

The only pick that intrigues me is the pot smoker, he is supposed to be a return specialist (which doesn't require a large cranium), of course, he will be PUPed for the year, so we won't know about him unitl next year.

I did like trading the two 3s for 2 2s next year (although i thought they would get at least one extra #1).


Things that should REALLY worry you...

IF Vince is "close to re-signing" why did the Pats trade up to draft a Nose tackle (When they have already re-signed Wright this off-season). And why did they draft 2 more Nose Tackles after that?

Who is going to play OLB??? (and don't say Woods)
Thomas is one, who is the other? Crable?? I can only hope that the non-drafting of an OLB means that a Jason Taylor/Julius Peppers is coming.

In the end, I was sitting in church listening to a long winded blowhard of a Priest quiz 8 year olds about Jesus, all the while watching the draft unfold via Mrs FTW's blackberry (which she did not notice that I pilfered and was watching until half way through the dinner after the communion!) cursing in church!

Lets face it, this draft did absolutely NOTHING for the offense this year, and made the defense worse (less Hobbs and Vrabel), the only real improvement was the drafting of a long snapper.

 

[bakes781]

Obviously I love the Darius Butler pick. I think he'll be a stud shut down corner.

I like the Chung pick, but would've preferred Delmas. I don't think it was much of a reach as many are saying.

Brace was good value, but I'll be sad to see Wilfork go cause to me the writing is on the wall with this pick.

I know nothing about Vollmer, so I won't even pretend to give an opinion on that one. lol

I had Tate as a day two sleeper originally, but took him off my radar when he tested positive at the combine. Obviously the Pats did their homework and don't feel it's a problem. He was a 1st round talent before the acl tear and if he can screw his head on straight then we may have THE STEAL of the '09 draft.

Overall grade: B

 

[Clonamery]

Grade: Incomplete

You big effin' copout.

 

[BelichickFan]

Not one guy drafted yesterday will start week #1 (aside from the long snapper), this team is worse than it was last year, and worse than it was two years ago.

This team is better than last year. And probably equal than '07 although the record won't show that. Springs, Bodden, Galloway, Taylor say so. How can you possibly think that this team is worse than last year ? That makes no sense at all to me.

On the draft, I'm very happy with it. Vollmer and the Penn State OG didn't excite me at first but they've grown on me and linemen are never a bad thing to draft. Chung and Butler should be core guys and I am not worried about what drafting Brace says about Wilfork. We have needed a backup NT and now we have one. And if Wilfork does end up leaving we have a viable replacement (not saying he's as good, of course). Tate excites me in the 4rd as does McKenzie as Mayo's long term ILB partner.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

This team is better than last year. And probably equal than '07 although the record won't show that. Springs, Bodden, Galloway, Taylor say so. How can you possibly think that this team is worse than last year ? That makes no sense at all to me.

On the draft, I'm very happy with it. Vollmer and the Penn State OG didn't excite me at first but they've grown on me and linemen are never a bad thing to draft. Chung and Butler should be core guys and I am not worried about what drafting Brace says about Wilfork. We have needed a backup NT and now we have one. And if Wilfork does end up leaving we have a viable replacement (not saying he's as good, of course). Tate excites me in the 4rd as does McKenzie as Mayo's long term ILB partner.

Galloway is Dante Stallworth, at best

Are you saying that Chung is better than Rodney?? Chung will not start infront of neither Merriweather nor Sanders. Springs and Bodden have never played a down as Patriots, and the Pats system is very difficult and hard to pick up (sepecially for DBs). Plus no pas rush, they are going to need all 18 DBs they have to run down these guys! Who is going to be the captian of the Pats backfield making sure that everyone is on the same page as far as coverage is concerned? right now Sanders has the most starts as a Patriot!

Did Taylor sign and nobody told me???

 

[BelichickFan]

Galloway is Dante Stallworth, at best

Are you saying that Chung is better than Rodney?? Chung will not start infront of neither Merriweather nor Sanders. Springs and Bodden have never played a down as Patriots, and the Pats system is very difficult and hard to pick up (sepecially for DBs).

I expect Galloway to be better than Stallworth because by midseason Stallworth's time was reduced because he wasn't in the right place at the right time.

Chung compared to last year's Rodney ? Yes I expect Chung to be better. Not compared to the 2003/2004 Rodney.

Springs/Bodden vs. last year's CB . . . if you liked Hobbs, great, but we didn't even have a #2 CB last year. It's almost impossible that Bodden won't be better than O'Neal and even if that's true, we have Wheatley coming back, Wilhite in his second year and Butler added. CB should be a lot stronger this year even if some of the names are new.

 

[Rhodey]

Vollmer:C I like the size, and I like that we had some sort of connection with the guy, but as others have said, could have been had later. I admit I don't know a ton about this guy.

Like most Pats fans, I am intrigued by this guy, as well. Why did he go from the projected 4/5 round to the second? What did BB see?

One writer presented the following:

"Vollmer was originally slated to go in the 4th or 5th round, but his stock rose quickly due to a great offseason. He was the best looking offensive lineman in the East-West Shrine game." (Crowe, 2009)

This is an interesting tidbit, indeed. In fact, many reports out of the Houston did not seem to be too surprised by Vollmer's rise in value.

"A First-Team, All-Conference USA performer last year, Vollmer rose up the draft boards over the last few months, using his workouts and performances in the East-West Shrine Game, as well as the UH Pro Day and individual workouts to showcase his skills to the NFL scouts." (University of Houston, 2009)

"It was during the East-West Shrine workouts that the Patriots took notice of him. Dante Scarnecchia, the Patriots’ assistant head coach/offensive line, then ran UH’s pro day, and he put Vollmer through offensive line drills. His versatility intrigued the Patriots, Belichick said in an interview with ESPN after selecting Vollmer." (Manfull, 2009)