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Good News! Jeffrey Kessler is trying to sabotage the talks again


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I used to love serial movies.....

The cowboy riding off a cliff mid air one week....(to be continued)

and next week seeing him clinging to a vine on the side of the cliff....

How'd they do that ????? :eek:
 
No ego here. When I am wrong, I admit it. I have admitted it several times in this thread. It is just fun playing with Deus' ego since he cannot even fathom the possibility he could be wrong even on the smallest issue.

Since I gotta suffer through his self-important, contrarian, condecending posts (even his screenname is a pompous play on Dies Irae [day of wrath] or he just can't spell); I gotta revel in him making a hypocrite of himself.

1.) The screen name is from a book title:

3462818573_bcbe37754a.jpg


2.) Contrarian:

–noun
a person who takes an opposing view, especially one who rejects the majority opinion, as in economic matters.

Contrarian | Define Contrarian at Dictionary.com

which means that anyone opposing a prior stated opinion is being a 'contrarian', including you when you disagree with a previous poster.
 
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Actually their job is to do what is in the best interests of their clients, and in this case there is serious question as to whether any of these lawyers are doing that, and bogging down a deal they all need to try and blow it up for your own agenda is doing your clients a disservice and not the job they were hired to do. Kessler wants the system done away with entirely, and to date not one player has come out in support of that concept, so there is real question as to why he would try so hard to derail the deal.

Both sides need new lawyers to write and sign off on the deal, lawyers who have no stake either in ego or reputation in the outcome.

Part of doing their job is haggling/squabbling/arguing over the minutae. Despite the comments of some reporters, nobody outside of the negotiations (and probably few inside) knows if the lawyers are doing what they're supposed to be doing, or doing something else.

The one thing we do know is that both sides brought in attorneys who've spoken of and/or demonstrated their willingness to be hard cases in negotiations, and you can be sure that was done for specific reasons.
 
In most cases, DI is being either a **** or a Zelazny :D
 
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Not sure WHY DI chose that book title for his personna here ?

Did you have a particular reason ? :confused:
 
Before settling on Joker, I was going to use THIS as my screen persona....

41584743110_Gorgo_1961.jpg
 
In case someone HASN'T mentioned it before, there is NO substance to that story that Vrabel was traded because he proposed the players get revenue from Patriot Place. In fact the Pats did Vrabel a HUGE favor trading him to KC. Vrabel was due a healthy salary as well as a roster bonus in 2009 and was a likely cap cut, and would have received neither. As it was, by throwing him into the Cassel trade, they helped Vrabel avoid the embarrassment getting cut, losing his bonuses and salary. KC also did him a favor in taking that contract which was WAY above the production Vrabel brought to the field the last 2 seasons. Clearly Pioli was willing to take that hit in order to have a guy like Vrabel help change the culture of that floundering franchise

All the talk that Vrabel was traded because of his "union" position and his revenue position just doesn't wash. BUT it is typical of the kind of media speculation that this town thrives on. Its always way more interesting to speculate and inflame, that just report the truth.
 
Its always way more interesting to speculate and inflame, that just report the truth.

thus speaketh Tony Mazzarotti and the blubberous tomato can whose name I refuse to mention...:steamed:
 
FYI
Deus Irae is Latin for god of wrath or anger.
 
FYI
Deus Irae is Latin for god of wrath or anger.

We know but DI said he took it because of the book of that name.....

A reviewer's comment:
"Overall, it has some elements that I like, but it's just so relentlessly grim that I didn't enjoy it. "There are no heroes in ****'s books", Ursula K. Le Guin wrote and that about sums it up. Everybody's just kind of an azzh0le". YIKES !
 
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We know but DI said he took it because of the book of that name.....

A reviewer's comment:
"Overall, it has some elements that I like, but it's just so relentlessly grim that I didn't enjoy it. "There are no heroes in ****'s books", Ursula K. Le Guin wrote and that about sums it up. Everybody's just kind of an azzh0le". YIKES !

Not a fan of **** (yeah, I know) or Le Guin.
 
Ursula LeGuin mindbendingly rocks.
 
We know but DI said he took it because of the book of that name.....

A reviewer's comment:
"Overall, it has some elements that I like, but it's just so relentlessly grim that I didn't enjoy it. "There are no heroes in ****'s books", Ursula K. Le Guin wrote and that about sums it up. Everybody's just kind of an azzh0le". YIKES !

**** and Zelazny are two of Science Fiction's best from an earlier time. Philip K. **** won 3 Hugo and 5 Nebula awards, and he had several of his works end up as movies:

Completed Films

Blade Runner (1982)
Based on "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?"

Screamers (1995)
Based on "Second Variety"

Total Recall (1990)
Based on "We Can Remember It For You Wholesale"

Confessions d'un Barjo (French, 1992)
Based on "Confessions of a Crap Artist"

Impostor (2001)
Based on "Impostor."

Minority Report (2002)
Based on "The Minority Report."

Paycheck (December 25, 2003)
Based on "Paycheck."

A Scanner Darkly (July 7, 2006)
Based on "A Scanner Darkly"

Next (April 27, 2007)
Based on "The Golden Man"


Films in Production

The Adjustment Bureau (coming 2010)
Based on "The Adjustment Team"

King of the Elves (coming 2012)
Based on "King of the Elves"

http://www.philipkdick.com/films_intro.htmlhttp://www.philipkdick.com/films_intro.html

And Zelazny won 6 Hugo awards, and 3 Nebula awards, and wasn't afraid to take risks with his work, especially early on. Sadly, he died at age 58.

The book was a collaboration between the two and has what I find to be an interesting title and interesting premise. If you're in this for more than bagging on me over a choice of screen name, I recommend you read the works of both authors. For Philip, you might wish to start with The Man In the High Castle

The Man in the High Castle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And for Zelazny, something like Lord Of Light or This Immortal

This Immortal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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1.) The screen name is from a book title:

3462818573_bcbe37754a.jpg


2.) Contrarian:



Contrarian | Define Contrarian at Dictionary.com

which means that anyone opposing a prior stated opinion is being a 'contrarian', including you when you disagree with a previous poster.

1.) I was wrong about where you got the your screen name.

2.) I understand what contrarian is and you are a contrarian whether you want to admit it or not. That is why I compare you to being the Felger of this board. You are the ultimate contrarian. If the popular opinion on this board was that the sky was blue, you would argue enlessly that it was red. You are constantly in the opposing opinion of the majority of this board. I am not the first to call you a contrarian and I certainly won't be the last.
 
sorry Rob...but Deus Irae is a phrase in Latin that means God of Wrath...

I had six years of Latin...back in the days before "classical education BAD!!!! Pop tart homogenized lowest common denominator good!!!"...I apologize if I seem condescending

Sorry, I just know the Roman poem called Dies Irae about judgment day. I just assumed he stole it from that.
 
As has become all too frequent with you, you're clowning yourself. From the quote in your own post that you conveniently ignored while bolding everything else:



That's the issue. You were wrong. You're now just putting on the big shoes and red nose to complete your clown outfit. Calling me a hypocrite just makes you look even more ridiculous, given that I'm staying on point and you ran off claiming it was off topic and you were done with it until Freeman posted his stuff.

I guess I am a clown for allowing you to go on your pompous, contrarian rants (and again I understand what contrarian means even if you apparently do not) and talk down to everyone without taking any any accountability for anything you say that is incorrect.

For weeks you have been defending Kessler saying there is no proof that he has been a hinderance in any way dismissing Schefter's reports that Smith had to tell him to stand down and send him out of the room. Now that Freeman has sources from the players' side saying he is bogging down the negotiations with issues that even the players think are ridiculous, you just deflect some more.

I already said that I may be wrong about the meeting between Kessler and the players being an example of Kessler trying to derail the process. So I already did something you accused me of not doing. lamafist acknowledged it and even admitted that he/she could have been wrong and now admits that Kessler could actually be trying to derail the process. This is how grown ups debate issues. Maybe some day you will learn that.

Here is what I wrote earlier this week:

The article also supports the original premise of this thread that there is a belief that Kessler (along with Quinn) are trying to derail the the process to go back to litigating the antitrust case. Since we have established in this thread that sources opinions are news, it is fair to state that. That said, the talk Kessler had before this week's meeting in context may not have been an example of his derailing the process based on this report. I admit I may have been wrong there. Although I still agree with the owners that I think he wants this brought back into the legal process over the negotiation.


Time for you to realize you are not always right. You were wrong about Kessler. The players' Freeman has talked to contradict what you are saying. I admitted when I was wrong. Can you? I doubt it. Your ego can't handle it.

Go on now. I will let you have the last word trying to talk your way out of this while making yourself look ridiculous trying to avoid anyway of admitting you are wrong in any way. It is some of your funniest stuff when you do anything to avoid admitting you were wrong in any way.

BTW, I was wrong to claim the stuff was off topic before and then bring it up again. I again there I admit I was wrong. I guess I couldn't resist the impulse of watching you refuse to admit you actually were wrong in an argument because your ego wouldn't allow it. That said, again I will let you have the last word.
 
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May I suggest geting a room?
 
Breer reports Kessler is at the meetings today (wasn't there last week). Big week coming up.

Twitter
 
Attorneys work for their clients. My feeling is all of this is spin control to make DeMaurice Smith look good to the media and his players(probably in that order). Yes, he gave back 5% of total revenue to the owners, but he stood up to his evil lawyers and saved the season. He might have a future in politics after all.
 
Yes, I was wrong. A part of the off the top credit to the owners has been for the construction of stadiums. Not all of it, but some of it. But that started in 2006 and only two or three stadiums have been built in that time.

But this CBA, they are reducing or eliminating the off the top credit. Word was when they report the framework of the CBA the week of the owner's meeting, the off the top credit was eliminated. This past week there was rumors that the owners re-introduced the off the top credit at about $500 million which is half of what it was in 2009.

As for player endorsements, I personally don't believe the owners deserve any part of it. But I also don't believe that the players deserve a percentage of an U2 concert in Gillette or the Revelotions box office either.

I feel the off the top credit was agreed to without the inclusion of non-football revenues and now the owners are reducing or eliminating this credit and the players want more of the revenues generated for things that were helped constructed for these activities. So they want to pay less for paying more.

As for players' endorsements, they are PARTNERS with the owners. That is what they have been saying to get a share of all the revenues. That means the brand of Peyton Manning is a partnership between him and the owners. The owners therefore, at least in theory, should get a percentage of whatever he makes off of his name or likeness.

You really cannot have it both ways. Either the players are employees or they are partners or "the product". If they are employees, they have no right to expect a percentage of virtually everything the owners makes. If they partners, a partnership goes both ways and the money generated should be shared both directions. If they are a product, the owners have the right to a percentage of everything the player makes on endorsements based on their play in the NFL.


Just for the record, four stadiums (serving 5 teams) have been built since '06, for the Colts, Cards, Cowboys and Giants/Jets. I know that the NFL's stadium fund contributed around 1/2 a billion dollars to the most recent two alone, and that at least at one point there was money being allocated to build a stadium in LA even before figuring out who was going to be playing there.

The strength of the players' claim to stadium revenue from non-NFL events is entirely conditional on the degree to which they continue to contribute to the stadium fund under the new CBA. If the new CBA essentially ends the expense credit for stadium construction, they ought to be prepared to accept a very limited amount of compensation, or be willing to forgo it entirely as one of the many gestures of good faith that will be necessary from both sides to get a deal done. If the new CBA continues their contribution, their expectation of compensation needs to be taken seriously.

In my original post on the subject, I never intended to express more than this kind of conditional support for this claim. I just was pointing out that something Florio was presenting as absurd on its face actually makes all the sense in the world, depending on how the negotiations go. If Kessler is trying to hold up negotiations over compensation for non-NFL events absent any plans for continuing player-side contributions, than Florio's characterization is right on... we just don't know the whole story yet.

As for your case for the owners' being entitled to a share of the players' endorsements... well, firstly, the players never asked to be treated like partners. The onus for that is entirely on the owners, and their desire for a salary cap to curb the growth in expenditure caused by the natural right to free agency that the players were going to win in court. If the players' salaries were determined entirely by their individual negotiations with their teams, they would be normal wage-paid employees. With their compensation made a function of the annual success of their collective venture with the league, they are more accurately described as entered into a limited partnership.

All of this is neither here nor there. Whether and to what degree the players are "partners" or "employees" is a byproduct determined by the negotiations, not a determining factor within the negotiations. They aren't being given a cut of all NFL revenue because they're partners, they're being given it because that's the price to get them to agree to setting an artificial cap on the market for their talents, and that ultimately makes them more like partners.

The question of whether the owners are entitled to a share of player endorsements is simply something else that could be negotiated. Sometimes partners do or don't share in proceeds from other ventures. The Beatles made Lennon famous, but he didn't owe any proceeds from his solo albums to Apple Corps unless he used material that McCartney had a hand in developing. There's nothing stopping the owners from requesting a share of the players' endorsements during negotiations, but they have no preceding entitlement to it, and they're running the risk of negotiating for something unenforceable. There are some rights that can't be waived by contract, and the right to profit off your own name and identity is one of them. (The old school Hollywood studios tried and failed to enforce contracts that entitled them to any money an actor made off the fame they achieved making movies under their exclusive studio contracts.)

That said, it's not like the majority of owners would ever think of trying to wrangle this from the players. First off, there are only a handful of players at any time who can make any serious money from endorsements, and these players are by definition the ones who wield the most clout in negotiating contracts. Competitive owners like Kraft don't want to diminish the value of their stars' endorsements because they know that they'll end up paying the difference in salary demands, and the only real change would be taking up more cap space, which is an appealing thought only to owners like the Browns and Bidwells, not the Krafts and Jones's.
 
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